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Old September 6, 2021, 04:24 AM   #1
Carl the Floor Walker
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Saw it coming-man pull knife

The other day while traveling down a busy road, I pulled over into a vacant parking lot to use my phone. I pulled my car into a parking space facing the main road.
A old Taxi mini van pulled into the entrance and just stayed there. Almost blocking it. I thought he was broken down. Then after I made the phone call and was pulling out, I noticed the passenger in the cab quickly got out.
The driver then also quickly got out and ran toward the passenger. The driver then attempted to take something off the Passenger.
A small struggle then happened, and the passenger backed up.
I SAW IT COMING!. He then made a movement to his right pocket. I saw this movement before the Knife even came out. The driver did not, but did manage to back off after the knife was out.

The point (no pun intended) is to have situational awareness at all times. I anticipated a violent action happening well before the driver. (the move to the pocket by the assailant. )

Interesting. It seemed like the classic close encounter. Less than 3' away. And when fast drawing is most important along with being in control of anticipating and aware of the violent act to follow. He could have very well pulled out a firearm and shot.
Lesson learned. Be fast at the draw.

Last edited by Carl the Floor Walker; September 6, 2021 at 04:31 AM.
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Old September 6, 2021, 04:37 AM   #2
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If I was the phone call individual? I am gone. Places to go.
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Old September 6, 2021, 05:06 AM   #3
Carl the Floor Walker
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Yea, right, this all took place within about 30 secs. What pull up to the spot right next to the attack and wait for traffic to pass so I can get out to get away? How long do you think a attack happens?

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Old September 6, 2021, 05:52 AM   #4
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now you know what its like to be a cop.
who was victim and who was the attacker?
ya don't know .
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Old September 6, 2021, 07:44 AM   #5
Carl the Floor Walker
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I feel for every cop out there. I called 911 and as soon as I did, I was regretting it. Why send them onto this mess? They risk every thing trying to help.
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Old September 6, 2021, 09:38 AM   #6
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I SAW IT COMING!. He then made a movement to his right pocket. I saw this movement before the Knife even came out. The driver did not, but did manage to back off after the knife was out.
You can speculate but you have no real way to know what the driver saw or didnt see. For all you know the passenger may have been telling him outloud what he was about to do. You dont know what may have been discussed, threatened or the context of what occurred.

This may actually be an event that transpires between these two individuals on a regular basis,.. you just dont know.

This isnt something I would sit around a ogle at. I would have drove off.

As far as situational awareness goes, what all did you miss in your surroundings while you were fixated on this jackassery.
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Old September 6, 2021, 10:07 AM   #7
Carl the Floor Walker
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Lol No one was sitting around and Ogleing. What part of 30sec that this happened that you do not get. And I say 30 sec. not even sure it was that long. I was backing up and had not even put my car in forward gear when they popped out.
How about actually reading the first paragraph rather than telling me what YOU would have done. There was no way to move, but next to the Van. And you would have driven next to him? Really. And waited for traffic to clear. Lol, no way was I going to do that.
Common sense says that this was not a couple of buddies just having a spat. It was obvious the passenger was not going to pay the fare or ripped off the driver.
The Passenger was already out and walking away when the driver got out and ran quickly chased him down. I had no idea that the driver was going to attack the passenger. Sorry, but please do not tell me what YOU would have done. Not unless you have a crystal ball.
What did I miss in my surrounding? what are you even talking about? It appeared to be a normal day in busy traffic when a old van appeared to have broke down.
I noticed that the van was partially blocking the entrance way and I thought he was broken down. It was a busy day and a lot of traffic. NOTHING out of the ordinary until both parties got out of the Van. Again, that was less than 30 sec. And then the passenger after pulling the Knife, hauled ass with the Driver chasing him. At that point I was out of harms way. Yes then I stayed around and reported it to the police. I could see them behind a building in the alley which was across 4 lanes of busy traffic. I was on 911 giving the police the details, description and the locations of where they were on the chase.
If I had know before I even parked in the space that A Van would later come down and stop, I would not even have parked in the spot. But Unfortunately I do NOT have a crystal ball.

Last edited by Carl the Floor Walker; September 6, 2021 at 10:13 AM.
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Old September 6, 2021, 11:50 AM   #8
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Saw it coming-man pull knife

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl the Floor Walker View Post
Common sense says that this was not a couple of buddies just having a spat. It was obvious the passenger was not going to pay the fare or ripped off the driver.
You say the passenger got out of the van. Which seat in the van was the passenger seated? It’s an odd situation to ride up front with the driver in a taxi if there’s only one passenger and usually the taxi driver will have the rear locks engaged so that the fare can’t just bolt without paying.


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Old September 6, 2021, 11:55 AM   #9
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He was in the back. As soon as he got out the driver was out the other side in a instant.
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Old September 6, 2021, 11:55 AM   #10
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Thanks for the clarification.


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Old September 6, 2021, 04:39 PM   #11
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The birds eye view lets us see so much more than when you are right up close in the thick of it.
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Old September 7, 2021, 03:33 PM   #12
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I feel for every cop out there. I called 911 and as soon as I did, I was regretting it. Why send them onto this mess? They risk every thing trying to help.
Captain Obvious here, I think you did the right thing and I bet the police think you did the right thing too.

And yeah, the police are feeling a lack of support from some areas (Minneapolis will vote on a 'defund the police' in November although the mayor did try to stop it.)

I see a pretty big push back of support for the police too. Will real common sense prevail? I don't know. To me it's inconceivable/unbelievable folk would even CONSIDER getting rid of the police.
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Old September 8, 2021, 03:47 AM   #13
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CTFW thanks for sharing the story.
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Old September 8, 2021, 04:21 PM   #14
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Did the investigating officer contact you yet with the report number?
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Old September 8, 2021, 05:04 PM   #15
Carl the Floor Walker
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Did the investigating officer contact you yet with the report number?
No, but I am anticipating a call down road. Once the Police arrived, (three Patrol cars) the dispatcher said I was released. The dispatcher took down my Name so we shall see. Hopefully I will not have to go to court to testify.
This could have been much more serious, a shooting etc. When the patrol cars were coming, I could not help but think how these guys put themselves in danger so often.
I have the highest respect for them.
I cannot stomach the Propaganda machines that constantly put them down with such lies etc. The disgusting propaganda that spews out of the media is destroying our country.
Ironically, it was great to watch Sheriff David Clark the other day, just tear Don Lemon of CNN apart and call him and CNN and even Biden nothing but Liars with their constant condemning of police.

I believe Road Rage is one of the number one reasons to carry these days. I think we all have seen these kind of things and that a nut job can come out of nowhere. My wife came home one day and was shaking like a leaf. Some nut had come up to her window, completely out of control and banging his fist on the window. At the time, my young son was in the car as well.
Thank God, a police officer came up and quickly took control of the guy and arrested him. I shutter to think of what this man could have down if he had broken in the window.
Thank God for the Officer. These guys do this all the time.
Every day they are out there, Ready to serve and protect. May God bless them all.
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Old September 9, 2021, 08:03 AM   #16
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I thought this was the "Tactics and Training" subforum. I see a decided lack of both in the OP's account.
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Old September 9, 2021, 08:26 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Moonglum View Post
I thought this was the "Tactics and Training" subforum. I see a decided lack of both in the OP's account.

Maybe you could elaborate and provide meaningful content to the thread. Simply saying something is wrong isn’t as useful as explaining why.


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Old September 9, 2021, 09:32 AM   #18
Carl the Floor Walker
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He has no desire to contribute anything to the post. That is not his agenda. Just yet another of so many to try and agitate and antagonize. I have become use to it. Mods are aware of it.

I usually just do not engage when he post.
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Old September 9, 2021, 11:28 AM   #19
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I regularly watch the Active Self Protection (ASP) channel. Most things take place in 30 seconds or less from start to finish. The attach indicators come fast and you have to pay attention. Some things are so fast, especially involving the police that you literally can't see anything till the video is slowed way down. Good of the OP to see the indicators as they unfolded. None of us can sit here and judge what we'd do.

Most of us would be on our phones playing games. The only way anyone would know what happened to us is when our loved ones saw the video of the bad guy getting the drop on us. The ASP channel is all about indicators. If anyone hasn't been following it, I highly recommend it.
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Old September 9, 2021, 12:12 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by TunnelRat View Post
Maybe you could elaborate and provide meaningful content to the thread. Simply saying something is wrong isn’t as useful as explaining why.


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That's hard to do when we don't have a clear account of what (if anything) actually happened. As reported, it sounds like a wrong place, wrong time much ado about nothing story.
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Old September 9, 2021, 05:57 PM   #21
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If I was the phone call individual? I am gone. Places to go.
There might not have been time but I would have given it my best effort. I CERTAINLY wouldn't have been there when the cops showed up.
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Old September 9, 2021, 11:33 PM   #22
Carl the Floor Walker
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There might not have been time but I would have given it my best effort. I CERTAINLY wouldn't have been there when the cops showed up.
Ok, you would have taken off, that is your right and what you would have done. That is not me.
I was still on the line with 911 giving the locations of where the chase was headed etc. which were behind different building 100 yds away when the Police showed up. I was out of harms way and doing what I thought was right as a citizen and helping the Police.
I get it. Some people do not like the police or feel they have no responsibility to help them at all. I just was not raised that way.
I posted this just to show that Crime can happen anywhere at any given time. This was a nice part of town on a busy day.
But this post was interesting. It also shows how so many will JUDGE a police officer in a shooting. A lot of 'I would have done this, or he should not have done that' crap.
A cop is now always caught between a rock and a hard place. No matter what he does he will be judged by the public. I simply made a phone call to 911. And in some cases like this that can be bad enough with the Public. Some will say, they would have done things differently. Well maybe you would have, or maybe you would not have. But just doing what you think is right, might get you a whole lot of judgement with the arm chair public.
And in hind sight, I would have done the same thing and made the call. I have no regrets. I did not stick around. I left immediately when the 911 dispatcher said. OK, I can release you now, Thank you.
And hopefully a Bad guy is off the street. And hopefully no Officer injured. That I do not know as I did not stay around to find out. I did my duty as a Citizen and that is the best I can do.
There might come a time when you are your family need Police Help. I pray to God that a citizen makes that call to the Police. And does everything to safely aid the police which might save your life or the life of a loved one.

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Old September 10, 2021, 05:11 PM   #23
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If you want to be johnny on the spot, go for it... there certainly isnt anything wrong with it. Some people simply have the forethought to see how getting involved or loitering around a volatile happening can come with its own unintended consequences. Some people have had negative experiences in "getting involved".

I have called 911 on a few occasions to advise them of a person in some manner of distress. I dont hang around, I dont give my name and I just keep on keep'n on. The person with the greatest responsibility to protect me and mine, is ME. I aint mad at anyone who decides to stay out of my business. I in turn, stay out of everyone elses business ( generally).

This is not an emotional issue with me, its just practical thinking. I dont want trouble, I dont want your trouble and I dont want to be involved. Plain and simple.
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Old September 10, 2021, 05:50 PM   #24
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Saw it coming-man pull knife

If I personally see what I think is a crime occurring I generally call the police. If the police ask for a name I generally give it, though it is fair to point out that 911 calls are often public record (if you are concerned about potential retaliation). By my definition reporting a crime occurring in a public setting is loosely getting involved, though again I understand the people involved in the crime may well not think the same. I don’t intend to intercede myself physically unless to protect myself or a third party from death or serious bodily injury.

I like to believe I can protect myself and I do agree that the only person that cares about you as much as you is, well you. That said I’ve been witness to events that went poorly and fortunately some people did choose to get involved and at least call the police. Those people that did help may well have increased their risk profile for in turn saving someone else. Was that the smartest choice in terms of self preservation? Probably not. The people that were the victims were grateful for the assistance, however.

Some years ago I watched a video of a man who was the victim of an assault outside a convenience store. He was struck in the head from behind, his pockets were picked, and the attackers fled. The man lay unconscious on the crosswalk for at least a few minutes. No one moved to help him, despite a number of people in the vicinity, and some people actually stepped over him. Eventually the man was run over by a taxi cab and died of his wounds from the vehicle. The people that didn’t intervene likely did the smart thing purely from the perspective of self preservation. Still, a man died seemingly needlessly.

I would never encourage anyone to be a hero when carrying a firearm. If anything a firearm on your person makes you a liability in many cases when you get involved. We all have to determine for ourselves what, if any, sense of duty we feel towards anyone else.


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Old September 10, 2021, 10:46 PM   #25
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When I worked as a security guard calling the police was part of my job but I almost never called 911.

In MY experience with MY local dispatch center your name and phone number are almost the first thing they ask. My employer required us to identify ourselves and tell dispatch that we worked for XYZ Security. I'm positive their software captured my work phone number anyway because I never knew it and never gave it but everytime they called back they call that phone.

The last year I worked they routinely ignored any call that wasn't a violent crime in progress. Sometimes they even refused to start a call, so I couldn't even get a reference number to prove I had called. I called one night to report a broken window in a building I was supposed to check. Multiple witnesses saw a little Tweaker girl throw a rock through the window. The dispatcher told me only the owner of the building could report the damage and that had to be online. I've also been subpoenaed and had to give up my day off to go to court and wait around for an hour or two only to find out the defendant had plead out.

Unless I am DIRECTLY involved I don't call the police.
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