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Old May 13, 2018, 07:55 PM   #51
xandi
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So guys and gals, I think a got it narrowed down to 2 options
357 was cutters
Or 22
I like the 357 because I have the dies, and I think it will be easier to machine a 9mm hole
22 would be safer
Any flaws in my thoughts
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Old May 13, 2018, 08:29 PM   #52
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Yes, more action and less talk. We will enjoy pictures of the finished product.
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Old May 13, 2018, 10:10 PM   #53
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"Any flaws in my thoughts"

I don't know where to start......
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Old May 13, 2018, 10:21 PM   #54
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"Any flaws in my thoughts"

I don't know where to start......
Me too.

Basing your project on what dies you have on hand is not practical. By the time you finish this project, you will have spent far more money than a set of reloading dies. Buying a new set of dies should not be a deciding factor.

Machining a 9mm hole? You do realize that a rifled barrel will have a land diameter (the bore) less than the rifling groove diameter? Just curious how you plan to rifle the barrel. If you bore the barrel at .357 (pretty close to 9mm) you will have machined away the metal that would form the lands of the rifling.

Again, I think this project is far more complicated than you think.
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Old May 14, 2018, 06:12 AM   #55
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54r would be stiff, but cool.
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Old May 14, 2018, 08:05 AM   #56
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Let me clarify: I think if i were to bore a .355 diameter hole the button riffle it vs boring a .223 hole and then rifling it
Cost isn’t a issue, i want to learn and the experience

Last edited by xandi; May 14, 2018 at 08:15 PM.
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Old May 14, 2018, 09:38 AM   #57
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I can't even tell what you're last post is supposed to say, but .355 is the minimum groove diameter for a .357 Magnum. Using a groove diameter of .357 would be the more acceptable standard unless you plan on firing a bunch of 9mm bullets through the gun.

.346 is the bore diameter for .357 Magnum.
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Old May 14, 2018, 08:18 PM   #58
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I edited it, maybe that will help, not the best writen post sorry
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Old May 15, 2018, 10:36 AM   #59
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Bill, Sam, and John all started somewhere with design and building, and by the way I'm not "all wet" I am completely dry. Do we know this guy? Do we know his background? He may be a genius. He may be the next JM Browning. He is being criticized because he is stepping out and trying something out of the norm. Just because some here thinks he can't do it doesn't mean he can't. Most geniuses were thought to be crazy when starting out with a new idea. He may be one of those.
OK, let's look at John M Browning. He apprenticed to his father, a gunsmith, when he was around 15 years old. At this time he was mostly repairing muzzle loaders, so that is what he cut his teeth on. When he was 23 he was repairing a single shot cartridge rifle and he became so exasperated with it that he told his father, "I could make a better gun than this myself". His father replied, "I know you could John Mose. And I wish you'd get at it. I'd like to live to see you do it"*

So at the age of 23 he designed and patented his first gun, a single shot cartridge rifle that later became the Winchester Model 1885.

My point is he did not start designing guns with revolvers, semi-auto rifles, pistols or shotguns, lever action rifles, or machine guns. He started simply with a single shot cartridge rifle, then moved on from there to become the most prolific gun designer in American history.

He started small.

The original poster of this thread would do well to follow Browning's example and start simple, with something like a single shot pistol, then move on to something more complicated like the SAA after he had some experience with something simpler.


*John M Browning, American Gunmaker, by John Browning and Curt Gentry.
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Old May 15, 2018, 02:28 PM   #60
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I wouldn't want to be a child to some of you. God forbit you not understand the granular structure of pine and how it effects strength or the bearing force of a roller skate wheel on your soap box derby car, you'd obviously kill yourself.

There is such a thing as learning as you go, making mistakes and fixing them etc. And god forbid his gun not be the height of perfection in your eyes when he is done.

Maybe if you dont have something constructive to say you should just leave it alone rather than being sticks in the mud.
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Old May 15, 2018, 04:31 PM   #61
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Driftwood Johnson, I have that book on my amazon cart,I’ll finish my order sometime in a week or 2, thx it looks like everything I would want to know about the internals, thx. That’ll make AutoCADing it for full comprehension of how everything interacts and the assembly, much easier
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Old May 15, 2018, 06:22 PM   #62
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Chainsaw is correct. Exspensive equipment is nice, but with files, hammers, basic hand tools, decent guns CAN be built. There was a Gun Digest article in 80 or 81, can't recall which, pertaining to gunsmiths in Afghanistan (or Pakistan... some "stan" anyhow), building reproduction Lugers, Lee Enfields and AK-47's, with only very basic, old school equipment, elbow grease and skill. Kabul, and the Kyhber pass area both have a huge cottage industry of gunsmiths. If THEY can build functional repeating weapons with limited tools, why can't the original poster? I doubt some of these middle eastern gunsmiths can even read or write, yet THEY can build a working AK-47 with BASIC hand tools, but you guys are telling the poster his idea is too exspensive and complicated, so forget it??? If I'm cutting a tree down, I prefer my Jonsered Chainsaw, as its easy on my back and cuts like a knife through butter, but I don't NEED it to drop the tree. I have an axe too!!! More than one way to skin a cat guys. . Here is a video..., poor quality, but you can see the work conditions, and old and new technology being used. https://youtu.be/Sp6kxPZCCmg

Last edited by shurshot; May 15, 2018 at 07:19 PM.
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Old May 15, 2018, 11:43 PM   #63
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Chainsaw is correct. Exspensive equipment is nice, but with files, hammers, basic hand tools, decent guns CAN be built. There was a Gun Digest article in 80 or 81, can't recall which, pertaining to gunsmiths in Afghanistan (or Pakistan... some "stan" anyhow), building reproduction Lugers, Lee Enfields and AK-47's, with only very basic, old school equipment, elbow grease and skill. Kabul, and the Kyhber pass area both have a huge cottage industry of gunsmiths. If THEY can build functional repeating weapons with limited tools, why can't the original poster? I doubt some of these middle eastern gunsmiths can even read or write, yet THEY can build a working AK-47 with BASIC hand tools, but you guys are telling the poster his idea is too exspensive and complicated, so forget it??? If I'm cutting a tree down, I prefer my Jonsered Chainsaw, as its easy on my back and cuts like a knife through butter, but I don't NEED it to drop the tree. I have an axe too!!! More than one way to skin a cat guys. . Here is a video..., poor quality, but you can see the work conditions, and old and new technology being used. https://youtu.be/Sp6kxPZCCmg

Did you happen to notice the bank of CNC millers in one scene in that video? While the video shows workman hand fitting parts with files, while working on the floor, those parts were made on that CNC equipment. The finish filing and fitting was being done by hand, and while I can tell by looking at them that those CNC millers are not modern state of the art, they sure as shooting are CNC millers. Which is a far cry from making parts from scratch with basic hand tools. I worked with CNC millers about that sophisticated over 30 years ago, and I can tell you that the operators of that equipment not only know how to read, they have to know how to program them too.
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Old May 16, 2018, 06:51 AM   #64
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Yes, I saw that. My point is that they have been hand crafting modern weapons long before CNC machines were around and can do so now if the power gets shut off. They are obviously trying to increase productivity and quality in recent times for greater profit, but were previously doing things by hand, slowly grinding and filing away diligently until they got the right fit and function. I doubt they had CNC machines in that remote region during the Soviet invasion era.
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Old May 17, 2018, 09:38 PM   #65
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Dunno if someone already posted it, but if not, here ya go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80wm9GY7IwI
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Old May 23, 2018, 08:14 AM   #66
xandi
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Wow
That video answered any questions I had about how to machine it. Thx
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Old May 23, 2018, 08:55 PM   #67
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Howdy One More Time

If you have half the skills of that young lady, and all the terrific equipment she used, you might be able to pull it off.

She used several innovative techniques that were not standard, particularly making the bolt from a bent piece of spring steel. Her rifling technique goes back to the early days of muzzle loading rifles, which she did mention. She also did not mention how the sine bar works that she used to control the twist rate of the rifling.

Notice she mentioned several times she used an original revolver, I assume a Colt, to make all her measurements.
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Old May 25, 2018, 08:14 PM   #68
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I'd recommend 2mm Kolibri.
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Old May 25, 2018, 08:29 PM   #69
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7.62x54R would be an amazing home-built revolver project.
Might set your target on fire, so be careful.
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Old May 27, 2018, 07:12 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by konstan View Post
Dunno if someone already posted it, but if not, here ya go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80wm9GY7IwI
Well, I'll be ding dang durned, some one can build a revolver from scratch, and I read here somewhere in this post that it couldn't be done.
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Old May 27, 2018, 08:11 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by xandi
Not unless I get ahold of some serious money, I will, if I go through with it, machine and file everything, school has a old Bridgeport mill, I can use,
First off, from one CNC machinist to another I do admire your passion for designing and manufacturing a firearm. I'm also guessing you are either a high school trade student or a college student enrolled in a machinist apprentice 2 year program ? Either which you FIRST need to consult with your faculty if they will even allow the design or manufacture of a firearm (and I almost guarantee the answer will be a harsh "NO"). Reason being is the substantial liability issues. If you pursue this all on your own you will need a lathe, special rifling tooling, reamers and a Bridgeport. You will also need to do some deep research on metallurgy. Don't just think you can grab any random grade of steel and machine out a revolver receiver and cylinder. You as a designer are obligated to not only provide a well engineered design, you are obligated to engineer a safe design. If with your finished functioning revolver your dad blows his hand apart from the fact you incorrectly over hardened 1018 steel when you should have used a certified 4140 forging. Design and manufacture is not just about drawing lines on a computer and throwing metal chips...
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Old May 27, 2018, 11:42 AM   #72
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Naw I’m a millennial going back to school, whom is very bored and In the search for knowledge
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Old May 28, 2018, 09:25 AM   #73
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Howdy Again for what I hope is the Last Time

I have already said this a zillion times, but I will say it one more time.

Start simple. Build a single shot pistol. The Colt Single Action Army mechanism is much more intricate and subtle than it appears at first.

In a past life I had considerable experience with CAD/CAM. Both at the design end and the manufacturing end. I am also a pretty fair gun tinkerer.

I would not dream of trying to make one of these from scratch, I know what is involved.




Last edited by Driftwood Johnson; May 28, 2018 at 09:31 AM.
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Old May 28, 2018, 11:39 AM   #74
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With all due respect, even back in the 1870s it took an entire factory, with many, many specialty machines, jigs, and fixtures to manufacture the Colt Single Action Army. Not to mention obtaining dimensioned drawings, which are the intellectual property of Colt, and they will never release those documents.
LOL! I guess you'd never heard of the Pakistani Black Market Gun Shops. Just do a Google
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Old May 28, 2018, 04:59 PM   #75
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That’s a nice gun you got there, driftwood johnson
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