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Old November 27, 2018, 03:48 PM   #1
Geezerbiker
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Cheap imported AR15's

I've seen ATI and one or 2 other imported AR15's for cheap prices on GrabAgun and other sites. Are these a bargain, junk or something in between?

Tony
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Old November 27, 2018, 04:35 PM   #2
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Can't speak for 'em, but I can say this... when you can build a mid-grade PSA rifle on an anderson lower for 20 bucks more, why roll the dice?
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Old November 27, 2018, 05:36 PM   #3
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Not sure why anyone would want to do that. I just saw a S&W M&P Sport for $465 online brand new. Just how much cheaper do you want to go? And what kind of quality are you going to get? Almost certainly not the same quality as the S&W . . .
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Old November 27, 2018, 06:36 PM   #4
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What are you seeing that's actually imported?

Just because the ATI name includes the word "Imports" doesn't mean that every product is imported.

Please cite some examples.
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Old November 27, 2018, 07:56 PM   #5
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What are you seeing that's actually imported?


Exactly. Not sure I've seen a cheap imported AR.
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Old November 27, 2018, 09:27 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankenMauser View Post
What are you seeing that's actually imported?

Just because the ATI name includes the word "Imports" doesn't mean that every product is imported.

Please cite some examples.
You got me there. I assumed because the name includes the word "Imports" that the rifle was imported. They tend to run in the low $300 range and that's an attractive price. I've considered assembling one and honestly that's second on my list if these aren't worth the money.
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Old November 28, 2018, 12:05 PM   #7
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Well, I wasn't trying to 'get' you. I was just curious about whether or not I was missing something, while wanting to point out that ATI isn't exclusively an importer.

But I do understand how my post could have been seen as confrontational.

--

There hasn't been much talk about them recently, but most people seem fairly happy with the OMNI Hybrid - at least for the price.
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Old November 28, 2018, 03:52 PM   #8
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One of my co-workers owns the ATI Mil-Sport. I haven't shot it yet, but he told me he had constant reliability issues with it when he first bought it. He said he replaced the bolt it came with with a bolt from PSA and now he said it runs fine.

However I don't think he puts enough rounds through his guns to notice if the thing was a piece of junk or not.
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Old November 28, 2018, 06:21 PM   #9
Geezerbiker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankenMauser View Post
Well, I wasn't trying to 'get' you. I was just curious about whether or not I was missing something, while wanting to point out that ATI isn't exclusively an importer.

But I do understand how my post could have been seen as confrontational.

--

There hasn't been much talk about them recently, but most people seem fairly happy with the OMNI Hybrid - at least for the price.
I didn't take it as confrontational but that you brought up point that I had not considered and I was owning up to it. I try not to be too thin skinned...

Anyway I think I'd be better off building one. It will cost me more but I can spread out the cost over several months and I can get the A2 Hbar that I really wanted anyway.

Tony
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Old November 28, 2018, 08:22 PM   #10
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In the past (4-5-6 years ago), ATI "partnered" w/ Head Down Products (Dallas, Georgia) to crank out a couple of AR models. Don't believe that included the polymer ones.
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Old November 29, 2018, 01:43 AM   #11
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A buddy on the next street (retired US Army Lt. Col.) didn't do any reading before he bought his ATI. He is only into 1700s-1800s muskets: about eighty of them.

Brand-new from the gun store it malfunctioned about once every three rounds as I watched. All ammo was new retail US brass .223.
It has been over half a year since we tried to use it, but it seemed that the problem was with extraction or ejection. Can't remember which, but I was baffled.

I'm glad that other people solved their ATI problems (if so) but I wouldn't gamble my money on an ATI "AR clone", having no skills to evaluate and diagnose problems.
The buddy knew it was a gamble on the lowest-cost version, didn't mind the results, and he never returned it during the warranty.

On a side note, my former S&W M&P Sport II, bought brand-new, functioned perfectly, all 400 or so rounds. AR rifles never "grew on me", but that brand-new S&W, bought in '15 or so was a perfect operation and highly recommend them, for what it's worth.

Last edited by Ignition Override; December 1, 2018 at 01:34 AM.
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Old November 29, 2018, 04:24 AM   #12
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I'm continuously shocked that we aren't drowning in crazy cheap imported AR15's. There can't possibly be anything out there cheaper and easier to 922r.

Seems like the cheap ATI stuff is all plastic receiver models, which is a completely different thing entirely.
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Old November 29, 2018, 06:07 AM   #13
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While likely not imported, I'd skip the ATI and go with something from PSA. You can put together a decent PSA for $300, or a really nice one for $400. You get pretty decent quality parts with a good reputation and a lifetime warranty.
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Old November 29, 2018, 10:37 AM   #14
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I traded into a DPMS Oracle AR last year, never been a big fan of DPMS but I was helping out a buddy. The Oracle is the entry-level 'optics ready' carbine, so it's about as stripped as can be and still function. Oddly enough, the thing really runs... I took it out to NV at Christmas last year and promptly ran about 1000rds through it in pretty short order... not one hiccup. I saw at the last gunshow they were going for about $370 NIB. Although I can see where building one has it's merits (I've built about 4, so I know) there is nothing wrong with buying a complete rifle and running it as-is. That is generally my suggestion to people new to the AR platform... buy something cheap you can shoot, figure out what you like... and, more importantly, what you DON'T like... and then you can upgrade or build, and in the meantime still have a shooter.
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Old November 29, 2018, 01:46 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusion View Post
While likely not imported, I'd skip the ATI and go with something from PSA. You can put together a decent PSA for $300, or a really nice one for $400. You get pretty decent quality parts with a good reputation and a lifetime warranty.
PSA's "reputation" is somewhat mixed, but most of the first-hand complaints seem to be about shipping time or occasional lapses in quality control where PSA has been good about providing replacement components or exchanges.

The serious die-hard "I'll never buy a PSA" folks seem to generally be people who never did buy any PSA product but who "know a guy" or "heard about" some supposed problem.

Personally I have only one experience with PSA -- I recently bought one of their mid-price AR pistol kits on sale. The kit consisted of a fully assembled upper plus a full LPK with SBA3 brace, needing only the lower receiver and whatever sight I chose. I combined it with an Anderson lower (just under $25 at my LGS). Only change I made was I replaced the plain end cap in the LPK with a sling adapter end cap so I can use a single point sling.

Bottom line, I've got an AR pistol configured exactly as I wanted it, for $430 when a similarly configured AR pistol from any of the 'name brand' makers runs over $1000 and even the cheap ones from online discount shops run around $600 before shipping, tax, and transfer fees.

I could have assembled a basic AR rifle or pistol for a hundred bucks less easily enough using a lower priced PSA kit but I stepped up to a slightly higher priced kit to get the configuration I wanted.

By the way, Anderson produces some very nice AR rifles as well as uppers and lowers, at budget prices.
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Old November 29, 2018, 01:59 PM   #16
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Thanx for all the opinions. I'm going to buy a lower receiver and take my time putting the rifle together. One thing for sure is I don't want a collapsible stock. I think they're only popular now because they were once banned...

Tony
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Old November 29, 2018, 02:38 PM   #17
n4aof
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Originally Posted by Geezerbiker View Post
Thanx for all the opinions. I'm going to buy a lower receiver and take my time putting the rifle together. One thing for sure is I don't want a collapsible stock. I think they're only popular now because they were once banned...

Tony
There are a number of reasons why adjustable stocks are popular (one of which actually makes sense)...

As you suggest, the idea that it was once banned so it must be good does apply to some people.

Another similar reason is that "it's what the Army uses" so it must be good... There is a little truth to this (more about that as we go on). And of course the fact that the Army uses it makes it "tactical" looking (or tactikool as we sometimes sneer)

Another reason is simply that most manufacturers put adjustable stocks on their ARs, one reason for this is because there are a lot of 'milspec' stocks available cheaply - another reason is simply that most people expect to see an adjustable stock on an AR (this is somewhat circular in that people expect to see an adjustable stock because manufacturers build ARs that way, while manufacturers build them that way because people expect it).

Another reason people expect an adjustable stock is because all the pictures they see of modern AR's in use by the military are of M4 carbines which have the adjustable stock.

Finally we get to the one valid reason for an adjustable stock....

Note that all through this I have referred to it as an "adjustable" stock, not a "collapsible" stock as you called it. The one valid reason to choose the adjustable stock is because it is adjustable. The standard adjustable stock lets you choose the length of pull which may or may not be a concern depending on how well the fixed stock fits you (it also lets you reduce the overall length of the rifle for storage if that is a concern)

Basically you have five choices for a stock on an AR:

1) The standard fixed stock used by the military on the M16

2) An adjustable stock like that used by the military on the M4 or one closely copied from it. (This is what will come on most available basic AR rifles)

3) One of several adjustable stocks that are cosmetically different from the military M4 adjustable stock but functionally the same. (BCM, CMMG, Magpul, etc)

4) A high-end "fully adjustable" stock that lets you adjust the length of pull, the comb height, the drop at heal, etc.

5) A custom made stock

If the standard fixed stock is a good fit for you, there is no need for any adjustments.
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Old November 29, 2018, 05:00 PM   #18
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I dislike collapsing stocks. I do have some because they were cost effective at the time and I can work with them. I’ve replaced a couple with plain ol A2 style stocks and tubes now.

PSA will generally be a good deal for the money. I do have a few complaints about them that is not firearm related. Seems that they’ve corrected the issue, so I don’t say what it was anymore.
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Old November 29, 2018, 06:01 PM   #19
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I got a really cheap parts kit from Sarco a couple Christmas's ago. Everything except the lower. I'm guessing all Chinese parts. The upper was assembled, but the front sight was crooked and you couldn't get the handguards to stay on. The lower parts were out of spec and the springs weren't tempered properly, would bend and stay bent. I ended up tossing most of the lower parts kit and kept the upper receiver and barrel to maybe rebuild someday.
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Old November 30, 2018, 04:32 AM   #20
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ARs are VERY cheap - Bear Creek Arsenal was blowing out some complete AR models for $299.99 recently.
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Old November 30, 2018, 06:19 AM   #21
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why buy anything imported
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Old December 1, 2018, 11:05 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armoredman View Post
ARs are VERY cheap - Bear Creek Arsenal was blowing out some complete AR models for $299.99 recently.
But, when I read the specs. I'm pretty sure they had commercial buffer tubes.
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Old December 2, 2018, 02:39 AM   #23
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I don't know enough about ARs to know if that is a bad thing or not - I have a Bear Creek barrel in my one and only Ar that seems to work just fine.
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Old December 2, 2018, 09:13 AM   #24
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"But, when I read the specs. I'm pretty sure they had commercial buffer tubes."

And the problem with that IS???
There's a good selection of stock accessories which fit commercial tubes.
If you're not planning to use your AR as a club, spear, or prybar, it's HIGHLY unlikely, you'll have any issues with a commercial tube.

RE: BCA
I'm returning a BCA upper due to multiple problems.
1:does not chamber all types/brands of factory ammo
2: does not extract factory ammo that is chambered but not fired
3: after 25 rounds fired, bolt fails to fully cycle
I have used BCA barrels on a couple of "chore gun" builds which turned out well enough but have little confidence in their overall QC.
There's "economical" and then there's "cheap".
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