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Old December 28, 2015, 07:25 PM   #1
hifiaudio
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Please help me decide on my first suppressed SBR

My current research has me leaning towards the Spikes Tactical Compressor SBR with their LRS-2 silencer attached, however I am still quite open to other suggestions. Price is not a huge factor as I have no plan to buy any other AR rifle. I dont mind spending up front to get something high end that will last and perform. I am not at all looking to collect lowers, or uppers, or have a ton of guns. I have a KSG, an m&p 9c for concealed carry, and likely a full size M&P 9 with whatever can I come up with for bedside.

That being said, what else should I check out for my SBR?


Criteria is SBR, 300 blk, and will shoot suppressed 100% of the time. Subsonic all the time as well.

And any issue with buying the Spikes Compressor and putting someone else's can on it? I am having trouble finding a real review of the Spikes LRS-2 can standalone. I think that is one of my main holdouts with just getting the Compressor SBR with the LRS-2 is that there just seems to be no third party testing on that can on the internet. Would like to see at least a couple of videos from the respected experts on the performance of that can. The SilencerCo Omega can on the other hand seems like a very well reviews unit, over and over.


I am sure a lot of people will say build this or build that....and I MAY be interested in going down that route, but I would rather this one be "done right" than up to me to piece together the parts. If I did build I suppose I would go down the path of copying the build here:

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...lackout-rifle/

So what say ye? Thanks for the help!

Last edited by hifiaudio; December 28, 2015 at 08:21 PM.
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Old December 28, 2015, 07:46 PM   #2
Bartholomew Roberts
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If you are 100% certain you want an SBR and 100% certain you want to shoot subsonic all the time, there are probably better choices than .300 BLK - and I say that as the owner of a 9" .300 BLK with suppressor.

The thing is, right now there are very few effective subsonic bullets for .300 and what is out there is expensive and a lot of it doesn't feed through an AR well.

Unless you want to shoot past 200m, a pistol caliber subsonic will be cheaper to shoot and have better options for bullets that work well at subsonic velocities - and because pretty much any subsonic bullet drops like a rock, there isn't even a huge difference in point of impact. You can also use a pistol caliber suppressor and save money.

If you want to shoot past 200m, then something like .458 SOCOM or .50 Beowulf subsonic throws a much heavier/longer bullet and gets you more punch at subsonic velocities.
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Old December 28, 2015, 08:01 PM   #3
hifiaudio
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OK thanks, I will research down that path as well. Why the massive interest in 300 blk and 300 blk suppressed? Herd mentality?
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Old December 28, 2015, 08:29 PM   #4
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I would agree that a "subsonic ONLY" gun does not take advantage of the versatility of this caliber.

I have a 9" SBR and a SDN-6 can. I run about a 80/20 mix in favor of SUPERSONICS (125gn @ ~2150fps).

I have a 300blk specific can in jail (GMT-300blk) and will dedicate it to a surpressed only gun, but it will run that same 80/20 mix.

If you want a Compressor... Get it. The other one to look at is the Liberty Leonidas. Another integrally suppressed 300blk.
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Old December 29, 2015, 08:54 AM   #5
Bartholomew Roberts
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You can still run supersonics through a suppressor, it just will not be as quiet. As for the interest in .300, it has a couple of things it does well:

1) It is an alternate caliber where you don'thave to change anything but the barrel to work in an AR15 (others are .25-45 Sharps and .277 Wolverine). You still use same mags and boltface.
2) It uses commonly available bullets and cases but a fraction of the powder of .308.
3) It is designed to shoot supersonics very efficiently out of the short barrel. You basically get AK like power out of a Krinkov sized rifle with AR15 ergos.
4) With a suppressor, just by changing magazines you can switch to subsonics and be as quieter (if not quieter) than an MP5SD.

If you are just going to use subsonics, you give up the advantage in #2 and #3. Pistol rounds are even cheaper to load and there are lots of them already designed to expand at subsonic velocities - and unless you are shooting pretty far subsonic is so slow you won't notice the aerodynamic efficiency of a .308 bullet. At the ranges where the bullet shape does make a difference, it is similar to shooting 800yds with a .308 - you miss the range call by a few yards, you are a bit off on the wind, the temperature has dropped since you chrony'd - you'll miss an 8" target. And you need to be super accurate because your FMJ match bullet in .300 does nothing but punch a narrow hole at 900fps.

If you are shooting .300 BLK subs exclusively, a Handi-Rifle or bolt-action can chamber more effective rounds that won't feed in an AR and is quieter to boot (no action noise). Or if you need repeater and capacity - a pistol caliber AR with suppressor will reach out to 200 - which is past the point most people can make good shots with subs IMO.
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Old December 29, 2015, 09:31 AM   #6
Pilot
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Nice summation Bart! I am also intrigued by the .300 Blackout in an SBR for those reasons. Suppressed, I think it makes a fine HD weapon, and fun range gun.
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Old December 29, 2015, 10:01 AM   #7
Sharkbite
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Quote:
Suppressed, I think it makes a fine HD weapon
With SUPERsonic ammo and a suppressor it does a great job for HD. Unless you are loading one of the specialty SUBsonic rounds (Lehigh, etc) the ammo does not expand and will just icepick thru a badguy.

As an example, lots of guys (me included) use the 208 Amax or 220 SMK bullets for our subsonic loads. Neither bullet will expand at Blackout speeds. So, basically you are shooting a 30cal FMJ at 900-1000fps. Not a great stopper.

If thats what you want (suppressed & subsonic), a nice PCC in 9mm or 45 will be more effective.

There are some boutique ammo companies that are loading expanding bullets in subsonic loads (Lehigh defense) but this ammo is EXPENSIVE to function test in your gun and then stock for HD.

Believe me, i LOVE my 300blk SBR and i do use it as my go to HD long gun, but its loaded with Supersonic ammo that will give me the effect on tgt i need
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Old December 29, 2015, 11:33 AM   #8
hifiaudio
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If I were to narrow my choices to the Spikes Compressor vs the Noveske 10.5 complete rifle plus (insert top rifle silencer here), how can I adequately compare and contrast, on paper and with forum member feedback, what the pros and cons of each rifle are? I cannot think of a way to get to handle and shoot both.

The Noveske would be this one..

http://www.noveske.com/collections/s...eske-cqb-rifle

Spikes would be this one:

http://www.spikestactical.com/st-com...fa-p-1308.html
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Old December 30, 2015, 07:00 AM   #9
Mobuck
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"OK thanks, I will research down that path as well. Why the massive interest in 300 blk and 300 blk suppressed? Herd mentality?"

Because that's what it was originally made for. SBR suppressed? 300AAC is the answer.
As for "effective subsonic bullets", most bullets delivered to the brain are going to be supremely effective. I don't consider any of the subsonics as effective hunting bullets due to the lack of expansion or the short ranges required for the precise placement of the non-expanding bullets.
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Old December 30, 2015, 12:10 PM   #10
raimius
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Consider the Daniel Defense DDM4ISR for fewer required stamps. By making it permanently attached, the suppressor counts for barrel length, getting you to 16in. That eliminates some travel requirements, and a second stamp.
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Old December 30, 2015, 12:15 PM   #11
hifiaudio
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Yep checked that one out... thats a good point. Although I do like the "look" of the Compressor or Noveske a bit better.

Question... What is the reason that Noveske quit making the 8.x inch barrel and only sell uppers / full rifles in 10.5 now? I thought one of the points of 300blk was that it was designed to function properly / best(?) in 8-9 inches?
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Old December 31, 2015, 11:14 AM   #12
hifiaudio
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Ok...related question I need help with.... Lets assume I buy the Spikes Compressor. There is very little data (third party tests, videos, reviews) on the Spikes LRS-2 can. So I am considering the Omega to put on their Compressor instead of their can. Thoughts on that? Get the Omega since it seems to be a very top tier 300blk can, or stick with the Spikes since it was developed along with their rifle?
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Old January 4, 2016, 12:35 PM   #13
hifiaudio
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I was all set to take the plunge on either a full Noveske or Spikes 300 blk rifle, or at least one of their uppers, but wanted to make sure that piston driven manufacturers dont have something out there with significant pros vs the DI competition.

Do the current products from PWS or Adams, namely the MK109 or XLP EVO offer less cleaning, recoil, or quietness when suppressed / shooting subsonic than the Noveske or Spikes would? Is blowback when shooting suppressed greatly reduced with piston rifles?
Is accuracy on par with a great DI or does it suffer?

I cant claim to know all if the differences or DI or gas piston, especially when SBR configs and 300 blk is thrown into the mix. My initial assumption is that if there were clear advantages that work with short barrels and 300 blk, then more companies would produce these.

Can you guys shed some light on this for me?
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Old January 7, 2016, 08:49 AM   #14
Elkins45
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Quote:
Get the Omega since it seems to be a very top tier 300blk can, or stick with the Spikes since it was developed along with their rifle?
Developed along with their rifle? What does that really mean? How is their AR different in any meaningful way from any other AR type rifle?

Get the best performing can you can afford.
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Old January 7, 2016, 09:21 AM   #15
Mobuck
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Considering what I've learned in my very limited "muffler" use and the comments of a guy who runs his in 3 gun competition, I'd say a piston has merit IF it will function w/o eating the guts out of the upper. This is the main reason I'd only buy a "factory" piston upper (Adams Arms probably)-warranty.

I don't see nearly as much fouling in the 300 as in the .223-probably directly related to the amount and type of powder each uses. The 300 wouldn't benefit from a piston while the 223 would possibly be suitable.

Regarding the perceived benefits of suppressing super-sonic ammo, I'd make a different observation about the effective sound reduction. The suppressor makes the supersonic quieter rather than "You can still run supersonics through a suppressor, it just will not be as quiet". The difference being it's quieter than w/o the suppressor but far louder than true sub-sonic. The muzzle blast is dissipated but the bullet crack is still there. Where the listener is located in relation to the muzzle and bullet path determines the sound perception.
Super sonic .223 is reduced from an ear ringing boom to the sound of a 22lr standard velocity from a 16" rifle barrel. 300 sub sonic if closer to the sound of a pellet rifle. 22lr sub sonic is "Pffft".
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Old January 7, 2016, 04:19 PM   #16
Bartholomew Roberts
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Here is the thing with centerfire rifle suppressors (assuming supersonic ammo) - your super-engineered, precision-machined, same-as-SOCOM $1000 supressor is going to sound maybe a tiny, tiny bit quieter than an unsuppressed .22LR.

Your $60 freeze-plug suppressor built by Bubba in a garage is going to sound a tiny bit louder than an unsuppressed .22LR. Maybe even .22 Mag. So, you can spend another $940 and still not see a huge, dramatic difference in sound.

If the suppressor you are interested in hasn't been independently metered and tested, you should assume it is probably closer to the freeze plug model.

However, there are a lot more to suppressors than just quiet - point of impact change, durability, heat, ease of maintenance, mounting system, etc.
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