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October 5, 2017, 06:43 PM | #26 |
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Join Date: November 30, 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 298
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Setting a bad precedence by sacrificing something. If we do, we will have to again in the future. Unfortunately, these killings are going to happening again and again (the cause is never addressed) and we will have to continue to give ground. The beast will never be full and once we feed it, it will demand more.
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October 5, 2017, 06:45 PM | #27 |
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Join Date: August 6, 2002
Location: SoCal PRK
Posts: 986
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Typical, NRA compromising on your rights!
I'm glad I'm no longer a member, Wayne needs to go forever before I would even think about joining again! Maybe they can compromise on any firearm that's black and evil and can hold 30 rounds or more in a detachable box magazine! Or maybe they can waste more money calling you and sending out more letters asking you for more money! All of you members should send them letters letting them know that you're in a compromise over renewing your membership because they're compromising once again with the wrong people! Once again I'm disgusted with the NRA! Wouldn't take the membership if it was free!
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October 5, 2017, 06:46 PM | #28 |
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Join Date: June 17, 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 6,894
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then don't.
simple. |
October 5, 2017, 06:48 PM | #29 | ||
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Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 9,471
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Quote:
The point is to keep this a regulatory matter, especially in light of past actions by ATF with regard bump-fire stocks. In Congress, especially right now, political pressure for extravagant solutions will be enormous and difficult to resist. Be it remembered that in the mid 1960s the political climate in the wake of the assassinations of JFK, RFK, and MLK was such that it would have been pretty much impossible to avoid some version of the Gun Control Act of 1968. But adroit political maneuvering was able to ameliorate some of the worst provisions of the law as originally proposed. Quote:
The reality is that we live in a pluralistic, political society, and not everyone thinks as we do. People have varying beliefs, values, needs, wants and fears. People have differing views on the proper role government. So while we may be using the tools the Constitution, our laws and our system give us to promote our vision of how things should be, others may and will be using those same tools to promote their visions. The Constitution, our laws, and our system give us resource and remedies. We can associate with others who think as we do and exercise what political power that association gives us to influence legislation. We have the opportunity to try to join with enough other people we can elect legislators and other public officials who we consider more attuned to our interests. And we can seek redress in court. And others who believe differently have the same opportunities. Success will depend on political acumen. Holding one's breath until turning blue isn't a very effective strategy.
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"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
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October 5, 2017, 06:50 PM | #30 | |
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Quote:
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October 5, 2017, 07:01 PM | #31 | |
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Join Date: May 16, 2008
Posts: 9,995
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Quote:
For ATFE to regulate this they need to change definition of a machine gun. Obama would have loved to ban, but it does not meet definition. If they are allowed to redefine there will be decades of consequences in regard to every minute ambiguity. |
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October 5, 2017, 07:09 PM | #32 | ||
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Join Date: February 12, 2001
Location: DFW Area
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Quote:
Quote:
1. BATF has been known to reverse their rulings. Laws are hard to undo. 2. If the folks screaming for a new law can be placated while BATF deliberates, it could provide a very useful cooling off period. Those are really important because most anti-gun legislation needs fresh, raw emotion to pass. Once things cool down then facts and logic tend to prevail. 3. It would reinforce the NRA mantra that we have all the gun laws we need, they just need to be enforced.
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October 5, 2017, 07:12 PM | #33 |
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Join Date: June 17, 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 6,894
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Sorry guys. Those bump stocks nominally put out 3-4,000 rounds inside of 10 minutes last Sunday.
No amount of "scientific/explanatory logic" will make a hill of beans difference at this point. It's toast. ' You'd better hope that's all we lose as this thing plays out |
October 5, 2017, 07:12 PM | #34 |
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Join Date: April 12, 2017
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,048
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Good point John.
I think you're right a ATF reversal would likely be the cleanest way of doing it. They could target very specific products rather than try to rewrite comprehensive language that only specifically targets what you want without loop holes or unexpected consequences. Not that I want even that to happen. |
October 5, 2017, 07:14 PM | #35 |
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Join Date: June 12, 2000
Location: Texas and Oklahoma area
Posts: 8,462
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Well, I'm not going to quit NRA; but it is plain a Cincinnati II is way overdue.
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October 5, 2017, 07:15 PM | #36 | |
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Quote:
Doing nothing saves us from destructive error. To paraphrase Edmund Burke don't just do something, stand there.
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October 5, 2017, 07:35 PM | #37 |
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Location: Virginia
Posts: 298
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I have made phone calls (to include my reps), sent emails, letters, posts, spreading the word, etc.. I will put up a fight as I know more bans and regulations will follow after the next shooting.
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October 5, 2017, 07:39 PM | #38 | |
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Join Date: May 16, 2008
Posts: 9,995
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Quote:
Maybe 80-90% of Americans may agree with banning bump stocks, but the remaining 10-20% are key to Republicans winning the next election. They won't vote Democrat, but they might stay home. Anything Republicans can do to avoid a recorded vote will be done. Democrats will surely go along. |
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October 5, 2017, 07:41 PM | #39 | |
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Quote:
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October 5, 2017, 08:04 PM | #40 |
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Join Date: December 30, 2010
Posts: 1,581
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It seems amazing to me how many people are willing to "throw a bone" to the gun grabbers when it doesn't affect them directly.....this time. Me, I'm ready to reset the laws back to 1933.
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October 5, 2017, 08:31 PM | #41 | |
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Join Date: December 23, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,955
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Quote:
All the NRA did was issue a statement letting the world know that it was the Obama ATF that allowed the use of Bump-Stocks, not the NRA and not President Trump. They also called on the ATF to reevaluate the Bump-Stocks to see if they comply with existing Federal laws. They will not have to justify anything, it will be up to the ATF and to Congress. They simple put the blame where it belongs and threw the ball back at the ATF and Congress. |
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October 5, 2017, 08:44 PM | #42 |
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Join Date: June 12, 2000
Location: Texas and Oklahoma area
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Look! The NRA's strategy is already paying dividends. The antis paused almost an hour before demanding more concessions...
https://mobile.twitter.com/MatttDavi...2017%2F10%2F02 Pelosi said, “So what they are going to say if you give them bump-stocks it’s going to be a slippery slope I certainly hope so.” steve,4102 you appear to be forgetting this part of the NRA statement: "The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations." That's not putting the blame back on Obama. That is an affirmative statement that currently legal firearm accessories should be subject to additional regulation. |
October 5, 2017, 09:11 PM | #43 |
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Join Date: April 12, 2017
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,048
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LOL Background checks.. but there are loop holes, like online sales, *rolls eyes*
Most of these shooters get their guns thru dealers with those back ground checks. Yup looks like popeye got her spinish.. they smell weakness. |
October 5, 2017, 09:17 PM | #44 |
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Join Date: September 5, 2010
Location: McMurdo Sound Texas
Posts: 4,322
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Bump fire stocks are a joke, and I'm really surprised the Obama admin allowed them. I really don't care, and if it's a bone that can be traded for tax reform, go for it.
That said, look at Chicago and tell me more gun laws reduce the crime rate, or restrictions on a bump fire stock.
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October 5, 2017, 09:37 PM | #45 |
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Join Date: March 15, 2010
Posts: 8,237
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You have to admit that this tragedy is very eye opening.
Never used a bump-stock and considered them to be an idiotic form of sophmoric entertainment. |
October 5, 2017, 10:42 PM | #46 |
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Join Date: October 1, 2017
Posts: 391
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Well, the Lord and Master of all things bang has spoken. Now be good subjects, run along, and tell everyone you know that your marching orders have been given. No more bump stocks!
In case it isn't obvious, I don't care for the NRA much. I think this organization has done more to divide this nation than any other. |
October 5, 2017, 10:43 PM | #47 |
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Join Date: September 26, 2010
Posts: 1,536
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Good for the NRA
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October 5, 2017, 10:53 PM | #48 |
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Join Date: October 8, 2008
Posts: 95
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You can down load a file to 3d print one, you can build one for under 10 bucks with out much trouble. If someone wants one it can be done. The NRA has lost me over this and a lot of toher people.
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October 5, 2017, 10:55 PM | #49 |
Member
Join Date: October 8, 2008
Posts: 95
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So what are you willing to trad for over 10 round mags and what will you trade for Assault rifles or semi autos?
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October 6, 2017, 12:39 AM | #50 |
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Join Date: April 24, 2011
Location: Burnaby
Posts: 260
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Any accessory can be banned
Back in the 1980s Lawn Darts were all the rage. But after 8 years, 6,100 people ended up in emergency departments.
The Consumer Product Safety Commission stepped in and banned them. Labeled as a unsafe product. I'm sure this agency could be used to remove bump stocks from the store shelves. |
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