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Old November 13, 2009, 10:21 PM   #1
scum513
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Wolf Large Rifle Magnum Primers

I shoot a 30-378 Wby which i hand load the ammunition for. I recently had to purchase Wolf Large Rifle Magnum Primers, as that was the only thing that I could find within a days drive of my house. I loaded the same recipe that I always used in the load, 165 grain NBT bullet, 100 grains RL 22 powder. I usually use the Winchester Large Rifle Magnum Primer, but switched to the Wolf as I was out of the Winchester. I loaded 20 rounds with the following results: 3 misfires, 16 delayed fire, 1 shot perfectly. I spoke to a local shop and they suggested checking the flash holes for debris and checking to ensure the primer was seated all the way. The following week I loaded 10 rounds, flash holes clean and clear, hand seated the primers twice to ensure they were in tight. Results were as follows: 1 shot perfectly, 2 misfires, 7 delayed fire. Frustrated I spoke to another local shop and they suggested to switch to a faster powder. So, I switched to the IMR 4831 with 92 grains. I loaded 6 rounds. Results were as follows: 1 shot perfectly, 5 misfires.

So through 36 rounds I have had 10 misfires, 23 delayed fire, 3 perfect rounds

Has anyone had any similar problems with these primers? In short, my rifle is on the shelf until I can get this resolved. If it helps, the lot # on the Wolf primers is 3/09.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions / help.
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Old November 13, 2009, 11:24 PM   #2
Shoney
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There are a lot of bench rest shooters that have used the Wolf LR Primers (item QQQLR KVB-7). They have outstandingly small deviation from primer to primer.

Here is an unofficial rough guestimate of values, so take it with a grain of salt.
These are the results of a test done to determine the relative strength of primers:

B]RIfle Primers[/B]
Brand/type_________Power Average___Range____Std. Dev
1... Fed Match GM215M___6.12______ 5.23-6.8_____.351
2... Federal 215 LRM _____5.69______ 5.2-6.5 _____.4437
3... CCI 250 LRM_________5.66______ 4.5-7.4_____ .4832
4... Winchester WLRM____ 5.45______ 5.1-6.0 _____.2046
5... Remington 9 1/2M LR _ 5.09 _____ 3.5-6.75 ____.6641
6... Winchester WLR _____ 4.8 ______ 4.1-6.0 _____.4300
7... Remington 9 1/2 LR __ 4.75 _____ 3.7-6.25 ____.5679
8... Fed Match GM210M __ 4.64 _____ 4.0-5.6 ____ .3296
9... Federal 210 LR ______ 4.62______ 3.7-5.5 ____.3997
10.. CCI BR2 ____________4.37______ 4.0-5.0 ____ .2460
11.. CCI 200 LR __________4.28 _____ 3.8-4.8 ____ .3218
12.. KVB 7 LR Russian_____ 4.27 _____ 3.8-4.8 ____ .2213
13.. Rem 91/2 (30 yrs old)_ 4.16 _____ 3.8-4.8 ____.3427
Pistol Primers
14 Rem LP ___________4.47_______ 3.2-5.6 _______.5171
15 KVB 45 LP Russian __3.89 _______3.3-4.2 _______.2232
16 CCI 300 LP________ 3.18_______ 2.7-3.5 _______ .2406
17 Federal 150 LP _____3.11 _______2.6-3.5 _______.2090
18 Fed Match GM150M _3.05 _______ 2.6-3.7 ______ .2299
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Old November 14, 2009, 01:26 PM   #3
Haystack
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I am having a similar problem with the Wolf small rifle magnum, but it seems to be only with H-335. When I use these primers with H-322 or BL-C2 they work great. I chalked it up to a bad powder/primer combination.
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Old November 16, 2009, 12:18 AM   #4
A_Gamehog
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dangerous conditions exist with your setup....

Could be many things,

1). how do you store your primers? (once i stored some in a sandwich bag and most were all bad) vapors? chemical reactions?

2).was the brass soaked in a solution?

3). could this be a mininum load?

4). does the primer have a definite dent or slight? (Dirt behind the firing pin)

I had some favorite loads for H-380 and my 22-250, long story short, they

needed work again because the Powder lots varied so much. My load books

are in storage 3 states away, can't help much here.
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Old November 16, 2009, 02:41 AM   #5
Shoney
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Please describe your hangfire, time between click and ignition.

Did you try to fire the misfires a second time. If they will fire on the second hit, that usually means the primer was seated by the first hit, allowing it to fire on the second.

Try seating the primers with a lot more force. The shape of the Wolfs and their hardness may not go all the way to being seated properly. You need to seat them deep enough to just start to flatten the anvil.

If you have reamed out the primer pocket, you may not be able to seat the primers deep enough.
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Old November 25, 2009, 02:33 PM   #6
scum513
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Responses

Thanks to all for the responses.

Gamehog- All primers are inside my house, climate controlled, etc in the manufacturers packaging. Brass was cleaned in the same media I use for everything, the load is on the lower end of the recommendations in the book, I believe they said 99-104grains, and the primers have a very clean and deep mark where they were struck.

Shoney- by misfires, I mean they failed to fire. Delayed fire meant that there was approx 1/2 sec delay between the primer "snapping" and the powder being set off. On all of the "misfires" I repeatedly tried to fire the rounds 4-5 times each and although the primers were caved in, the rounds never fired.

The third round of ammo as described were hand primed twice so I am pretty sure they were seated all the way.

It's just kind of depressing because I loaded 30 rounds of .270 wby magnum using the same primers and have yet to have any issues.....the only difference is I use 68 grains of powder in that load and 100 in the 30-378. Additionally, I "snapped" 30 primers the other day just testing them and had no misfires. I am at a loss for now, and unfortunaltey my custom rifle is on the sidelines this season.


Thanks again!
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Old December 3, 2009, 07:19 AM   #7
wileybelch
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To Shoney:
Can you cite the source for your earlier table of relative primer power? I think there is more to this problem of hangfires than meets the eye. Using your table, can you explain why a combination of Rem 9 1/2 primers with 71gr Reloder 19 behind a Sierra 165gr HP in the .300 Win Mag produced several hangfires for me?...or is there something else going on? ...like too much graphite retardant on Reloder 19?...or ammo temperature (single loaded at the bench on a 50degree day)? When I use 70gr IMR-4350 instead of RL19 in the same cartridge, there is never an ignition problem! I think handloaders should have better knowledge about primer/powder behavior than the manuals tell us.
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Old December 3, 2009, 09:52 AM   #8
Uncle Buck
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I have used Wolf large pistol primers with no problems.
If I understand what you wrote, the primers worked in one type of ammo (.270) but not in the other. Could it possibly be a problem with the rifle? Anyway you could check the ammo in another rifle of the same caliber?
I read somewhere that some Wolf primers are harder than other primers available. I can not remember the source. This could account for the misfires and delays. Just a thought.
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