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Old December 27, 2008, 06:31 AM   #1
apu204
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Loading .25 acp ?

Hello
I want .25 acp Hand Loading and have the Hodgdon HP 38 Powder how much grain can I
exactly Loading.The Bullet, S & B/50grains can someone help me?

Greez Daniel

Last edited by apu204; December 27, 2008 at 10:28 AM.
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Old December 27, 2008, 10:33 AM   #2
Unclenick
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Welcome to the forum.

Very few people in the U.S. try to reload 25 ACP, so you won't find much information. Part of the reason is the small charges are difficult to weigh and dispense accurately. The small cases are very sensitive to powder charge level so it is easy to exceed maximum pressure with normal weighing error.

Most loading scales resolve either 0.1 grains or 0.01 grams. That is not enough resolution to be consistent in such a the small case. With charges on the order of one grain, that represents 10% difference in powder charge. You will need a lab scale resolving 0.02 grains or one resolving 0.001 grams to control such a small charge accurately. Otherwise, again, you need to settle for a mild charge so that weighing error doesn't accidentally cause excess pressure.

The only published load data I have for the .25 ACP is in the old NRA Handloading book. It calls for: 1.0 grains (0.065 grams) to
1.3 grains (0.084 grams) of HP38 with the 50 grain round nose Hornady FMJ bullet.

The QuickLOAD internal ballistics software estimates with the S&B bullet that 1.0 grain (0.065 gram) is a mild load of HP38 and that 1.4 grains (0.091 grams) is too hot in that small case with some lots of powder, but OK with others. This agrees well with the published data for the Hornady bullet, so the two bullets appear to be interchangeable. Since you probably have a conventional powder scale, I would start with 1.0 grains and work up near to 1.2 grains or 0.08 grams. I would probably not exceed 1.2 grains or 0.08 grams unless I had a higher resolution scale.

For speed, I would consider making a small dispenser and measure powder by volume rather than by weight. In that small size it may be more consistent. You can solder a wire into the extractor groove of a fired .25 ACP case to act as a handle. clean the inside of the case well and fill it with solder until there is just enough room for the small powder charge. Use a file to further reduce the volume if needed, or a drill to make it bigger. Use this as a dipper and level the charge with a plastic card. You can put 10 such charges on a scale to weigh, then see what the average weight is? Do that several times and the groups of ten should have an error that is ten times smaller than your individual dispensing error, so you can get some idea of what that error is, too?

Good luck with it.
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Last edited by Unclenick; December 27, 2008 at 10:55 AM.
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Old December 27, 2008, 11:46 AM   #3
apu204
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I've already tried with 1.4 Grain and Grain with 1.8 and the Bullet with the powder has not enough Power. I've tried it with 1.1 Grain Powder Shotgun because the fired Bullet was more Power than 1.8 Grain Hp 38

Bullet the left is something oxidized because of the temperature but what can it do the Pistol or the Bullet when it is too hot?
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Old December 27, 2008, 12:17 PM   #4
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Sorry for the confusion. "Too hot" is colloquial shooter's English actually meaning that the pressure is too high. Pressure that is too high can damage the gun.

If you are getting weak loads from 1.8 grains of HP38, it sounds like the powder has something wrong with it? If it has picked up moisture or if it smells of nitric oxide, or if it has a reddish color it may have been damaged by storage in too much heat or humidity. If you got the powder from another shooter and did not buy it new, that person may have put the wrong powder in the container. Winchester 296 and 748 and Hodgdon H110 and Alliant Power Pistol all look very similar to HP38, but are far too slow burning for the small .25 ACP case. The only other possibility that comes to mind is weak neck tension on the bullet, but if you are shooting the shotgun powder OK, that should not be the problem.


P.S.,
Here is the other published data I have:
Other loads:

Code:
.25 ACP
50 grains Round Nose FMJ Bullet
COL 0.9"

Powder        Charge Weight Range
Bullseye       1.0 to 1.3 grains
Unique         1.7 grains
R1             1.0 grains
700X           0.8 to 1.0 grains
Red Dot        0.8 to 1.2 grains
HP38           1.0 to 1.3 grians
231            1.2 to 1.6 grains
The last two are interesting. HP38 and 231 are actually the same powder packaged under different brands. So, why the big difference in the load recommendations? The answer is that it is actually a non-canister grade powder that is packaged for sale to the public, but is not blended to a constant burning rate, as canister grade powders usually are. Non-canister grades are usually used by manufacturers who test the pressure for each lot of powder individually and adjust the loads to compensate. The two different results for HP38 and 231 above indicate the loads were developed with different powder lots. So now I am also wondering if you got an exceptionally slow lot of HP38? That might also explain it, but testing would have to be done against another lot to see?
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Old December 27, 2008, 12:28 PM   #5
Tony C
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.25 ACP Load Data

The Alliant website has load data for both the 35 grain and 50 grain rounds. Here is the link...

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloade...=5&bulletid=20
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Old December 27, 2008, 12:52 PM   #6
apu204
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ok, I check it on time tomorrow I'll have a block of wood first I invite grain 1.0 then 1.3 Grain last 1.8 grain, and then another shot with 1.1 grain Shotgun Powder

I have recently purchased GECO 6.35 Bullet 50 gr on a wood block and shot the 1.1 grain powder shotgun with shotgun powder is just as so deep into the block of wood purchased purely as GECO 6.35

Greez Daniel and thanks for Help
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Old December 27, 2008, 01:39 PM   #7
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My lee book shows 1.3 to 1.5 grains of HP38 for a 50 grain Jacketed bullet
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Old December 27, 2008, 09:46 PM   #8
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My Hornady 7th edition shows
For 50gr
Min HP38: 1.0 gr 650 fps
Max HP38: 1.3 gr 800fps and this load comes with a warning.
All I can say is that you’re a glutton for punishment if you want to load those little pills.
I found 380 to be difficult enough.
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Old September 3, 2017, 02:46 PM   #9
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I figured it would be okay to re-open this thread in order to keep info in the same place.

I'm going to start reloading these and wanted to see if any part of the plan is unsafe.
Bullets: Remington 50gr FMJ
Powder: HP-38, 1.3gr (Hodgdon says 1.3 to start, 1.5 max)
OAL: .900" (I measured some Rem 50gr FMJ's and they varied from .087" to 1.001")
Brass: Rem and Winchester

That's about it, does it look okay?
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Old September 3, 2017, 05:47 PM   #10
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Quote:
Carmady wrote:
That's about it, does it look okay?
Yes.

The OAL Hodgdon gives on its web site for all 50 grain bullet loads is 0.900 inches, so you are right where you should be.

Also, I want to echo Unclenick's caution about making sure charge weights are correct. Since the charges are so small and light, we start bumping up against the repeatability of the scale/balance, so use care to ensure cartridges are not overcharged.
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Old September 4, 2017, 12:24 AM   #11
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Quote:
Bullets: Remington 50gr FMJ
Powder: HP-38, 1.3gr (Hodgdon says 1.3 to start, 1.5 max)
Hornady 7th edition (the first book I could find .25acp data in),
50gr COAL 0.900

HP-38
1.0gr start, 1.3gr MAX

max load 850fps

test gun
Beretta 950BS
barrel 2 3/8" 1 in 10 twist

What gun are you using?

All of the .25acp that come to my mind are blowback guns. They don't lock shut, so, there's nothing but the inertia of the slide and a bit of spring tension to keep the pressure from comin' right back atcha!

Also, the small guns have their chamber a bit closer to you hand, so you really don't want to overload a case.

Good Luck!
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Old September 4, 2017, 10:40 AM   #12
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Did the OP ever get back with results?

I have a nice IJ 25 Auto (Walther design) I wouldn't mind reloading for but those 40 grain bullets are sooooo small I'd have to use tweezers. I get fumble fingered with 125 gr 9mm bullets!
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Old September 4, 2017, 05:52 PM   #13
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Quote:
Hornady 7th edition (the first book I could find .25acp data in),
50gr COAL 0.900

HP-38
1.0gr start, 1.3gr MAX

max load 850fps

test gun
Beretta 950BS
barrel 2 3/8" 1 in 10 twist

What gun are you using?
I noticed that 1.0-1.3 from Hornady, and also noticed what Unclenick said in post #4 regarding the different charges between HP-38 and 231 which are "the same."

I believe I'll start off with 1.1 or 1.2 grains.

It's a Beretta 950B.

Thanks.
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Old September 5, 2017, 09:35 PM   #14
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I've been using CFE Pistol. Hodgdon Reloading lists 1.2-1.5 grains for a 50 grain projectile at 584 and 727fps respectively. I've loaded 1.2 grains and cronyed at 590fps. I've also loaded Speer 35gr bullets ahead of 1.5 grains CFE Pistol and clocked at 696fps. Hodgdon lists 1.5-1.8 grains of CFE Pistol for the 35 grain projectiles. The 35 grain projectiles seem to be more consistent and have lower spread and standard deviations.
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Old December 14, 2018, 12:00 AM   #15
Carmady
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I know this thread has been dormant, but believe it's sensible to add to it rather than start another thread.

Sad news, Remington has discontinued offering their 50gr FMJ bullets for reloading.

The only 25s I could find are Speer 35gr GDHP.

If anyone knows of any other options, please share.
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Old December 14, 2018, 08:16 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmady View Post
I know this thread has been dormant, but believe it's sensible to add to it rather than start another thread.

Sad news, Remington has discontinued offering their 50gr FMJ bullets for reloading.

The only 25s I could find are Speer 35gr GDHP.

If anyone knows of any other options, please share.
When you shoot a 25 ACP through a chronograph, does the screen just display LOL?

scnr

I would probably try .250 bullets.

Casting would be a nice options:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/10...ProductFinding

Some use buckshot.

https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=456996
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Old December 16, 2018, 10:46 AM   #17
Carmady
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Quote:
When you shoot a 25 ACP through a chronograph, does the screen just display LOL?
How did you know?

I thought they were all getting 707 fps, but I had the display upside down.
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Old December 16, 2018, 03:54 PM   #18
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As a novice handloader I am so pleased to see such great advice on reloading small calibers. I love my six vintage .32acp handguns and have just begun to reload them. Because I am inexperienced i am pretty OCD about throwing accruate charges. I measuring and weighing repeatedly to be sure I am spot on. I am retired so I am in no hurry. After following this thread, I admire anyone up to the challenge of reloading .25acp.
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Old December 16, 2018, 08:02 PM   #19
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I handload .25acp for my Mauser 1914. It is the smallest caliber I have successfully loaded, and I doubt I can go any further.

Bear Creek sell cast bullets and I have been quite pleased with the results. The only powder I have used is trail boss, and I have dribble the charge. The rcbs powder dispenser simply can't handle the super light charge.

-TL

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Old December 17, 2018, 07:12 PM   #20
Carmady
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Quote:
Bear Creek sell cast bullets...
Thanks, that's what I was looking for. Their site mentions a coating which makes cleaning the bore next to unnecessary.

It's Bear Creek Supply to make the search easier if anyone else is interested.
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