Bullseye, the powder and game

saltydog452 · January 12, 2011, 11:31 PM

Yesterday the nice USPS Carrier left me with an 8 lb jug of Bullseye and 5,000 primers.

After getting about 20 years of dust off the Progressive and running a few rounds and measuring powder drop, I found that either my charge holes have grown of the new batch of BE powder is a tad heavier.

Charge bar that used to throw 4.0 BE now throws 4.6. The old short line charge of 3.7 now throws 4.2.

Has anyone else noticed a long term fluctuation?

Thanks,

salty

WESHOOT2 · January 13, 2011, 12:47 AM

Of your scale? (I mean, you broke out your 20-yr-old scale weight check set, ay?)

(yes re heavier)

saltydog452 · January 13, 2011, 08:34 AM

Yes I did.

The calibration weight remained the same and the balance beam did 'balance' at the calibration check points.

Took extra care to insure that the counter weights were positioned in the correct 'notchs' on the beam. Even used two pairs of reading glasses to get up close and make sure I read the 'notchs' correctly.

My older BE powder can't be retrivedto use as a comparison.

I just thought a long-time reloader who used fixed powder charge bars may have noticed a difference over time.

Sleeping has occured in the last twenty years, not all of the twenty 'tho.

Thnaks,

salty

A Quick EDIT: If the powder itself is heavier these days, and the charge bars were machined pre last Ice Age, would you make your todays powder choices by volume (existing charge bars)?... or weight (somehow modify the charge bar)?

I don't have access to a chronograph.

tnx,

sd.

zippy13 · January 13, 2011, 03:32 PM

Let's not forget, back in the day, we were loading with Hercules' Bullseye, and now it's ATK's Alliant Bullseye. Life is full of changes: some good, others not so good.

Lemmon · January 13, 2011, 04:27 PM

I recently started reloading again after 20 plus years and I pulled out my old scale to use again. It was dusty and I had to clean it and contact good to make it more sensitive. Some reason I think it is an O'haus 5-10-10??. Works great and it is more consistently accurate than my brand new RCBS electric scale. Yes I have calibrated weights to check the accuracy. It works great on my old 25 plus year old powder just as it does the recent purchased powder. The RCBS scale is faster to work with though.

Lemmon

WESHOOT2 · January 14, 2011, 08:25 AM

I personally would START with volume.

Powderman · January 14, 2011, 08:44 AM

Quote:

I personally would START with volume.

Not with smokeless powder!

The charges of Bullseye commonly used in Conventional Pistol shooting look like a tiny bit in the bottom of a .45 ACP case. Use the published data in reliable reloading manuals.

WESHOOT2 · January 14, 2011, 08:47 AM

I mean because the powder volume measure did not change, the OP should begin current testing WITHOUT CHANGING the measure.
First.

spacecoast · January 14, 2011, 11:08 AM

I would definitely go by weight, it's a much more reliable and objective measure of how much powder is there. Start at minimimum loads and work up.

saltydog452 · January 14, 2011, 11:15 AM

Got it. I think. We'll see.

My bathroom weight scale reads heavy also.

Thanks,

salty

Slamfire · January 14, 2011, 12:10 PM

Powder manufacturer's have to blend stocks because their production processes are not that precise.

They blend to meet pressure by weight. Not volume.

I had several cans of old bullseye. The difference was not that much

Code:



Kimber Custom Classic


230 gr LRN Valiant 4.5 grs Bullseye lot BE532 (80's mfgr)  Mixed Brass WLP (brass)  OAL 1.250"	taper crimp .469"

16-May-09	 high 83  °F
		
Ave Vel =	782.7				
Std Dev =	13.41				
ES =	52.05				
High = 	815.5				
Low =	763.4				
N =	28				
					
230 gr LRN Valiant 4.5 grs Bullseye 99' & 2005 mixed lot Mixed Brass WLP (brass) OAL 1.250"	taper crimp .469"

16-May-09	 high 83  °F

Ave Vel =	805.2				
Std Dev =	38.07				
ES =	136.9				
High = 	912.4				
Low =	775.5				
N =	24				
				
230 gr LRN Valiant 4.5 grs Bullseye lot 827 (60's/70's powder) Mixed Brass WLP (brass)  OAL 1.250"	taper crimp .469"

16-May-09	 high 83  °F
					
Ave Vel =	822.9				
Std Dev =	14.14				
ES =	55.24				
High = 	853.7				
Low =	798.4				
N =	26

January 12, 2011, 11:31 PM	#1
saltydog452 Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2004 Posts: 516	Bullseye, the powder and game Yesterday the nice USPS Carrier left me with an 8 lb jug of Bullseye and 5,000 primers. After getting about 20 years of dust off the Progressive and running a few rounds and measuring powder drop, I found that either my charge holes have grown of the new batch of BE powder is a tad heavier. Charge bar that used to throw 4.0 BE now throws 4.6. The old short line charge of 3.7 now throws 4.2. Has anyone else noticed a long term fluctuation? Thanks, salty

January 13, 2011, 12:47 AM	#2
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	ensure-ance (sp BFD) Of your scale? (I mean, you broke out your 20-yr-old scale weight check set, ay?) (yes re heavier) __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

January 13, 2011, 08:34 AM	#3
saltydog452 Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2004 Posts: 516	Yes I did. The calibration weight remained the same and the balance beam did 'balance' at the calibration check points. Took extra care to insure that the counter weights were positioned in the correct 'notchs' on the beam. Even used two pairs of reading glasses to get up close and make sure I read the 'notchs' correctly. My older BE powder can't be retrivedto use as a comparison. I just thought a long-time reloader who used fixed powder charge bars may have noticed a difference over time. Sleeping has occured in the last twenty years, not all of the twenty 'tho. Thnaks, salty A Quick EDIT: If the powder itself is heavier these days, and the charge bars were machined pre last Ice Age, would you make your todays powder choices by volume (existing charge bars)?... or weight (somehow modify the charge bar)? I don't have access to a chronograph. tnx, sd. Last edited by saltydog452; January 13, 2011 at 09:48 AM.

January 13, 2011, 04:27 PM	#5
Lemmon Senior Member Join Date: December 25, 2009 Location: Rural South Carolina Posts: 445	Old is good. I recently started reloading again after 20 plus years and I pulled out my old scale to use again. It was dusty and I had to clean it and contact good to make it more sensitive. Some reason I think it is an O'haus 5-10-10??. Works great and it is more consistently accurate than my brand new RCBS electric scale. Yes I have calibrated weights to check the accuracy. It works great on my old 25 plus year old powder just as it does the recent purchased powder. The RCBS scale is faster to work with though. Lemmon

January 14, 2011, 08:25 AM	#6
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	I personally would START with volume. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

January 13, 2011, 03:32 PM	#4
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Let's not forget, back in the day, we were loading with Hercules' Bullseye, and now it's ATK's Alliant Bullseye. Life is full of changes: some good, others not so good.

January 14, 2011, 08:47 AM	#8
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	all very density-suspect I mean because the powder volume measure did not change, the OP should begin current testing WITHOUT CHANGING the measure. First. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

January 14, 2011, 11:08 AM	#9
spacecoast Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2009 Location: Sunshine and Keystone States Posts: 4,461	I would definitely go by weight, it's a much more reliable and objective measure of how much powder is there. Start at minimimum loads and work up.

January 14, 2011, 11:15 AM	#10
saltydog452 Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2004 Posts: 516	Got it. I think. We'll see. My bathroom weight scale reads heavy also. Thanks, salty