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Old December 2, 2019, 05:42 PM   #1
stagpanther
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AR disease strikes again

I have no idea why--but when an ad popped up for EA Brown advertising 18" Shaw barrels in 350 legend for $149 I went ahead and ordered one.
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Old December 2, 2019, 10:16 PM   #2
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Let us know what you think of the cartridge... I was interested when it was first announced, but some of the later details didn't help to sustain that.
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Old December 2, 2019, 10:20 PM   #3
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STAG: Are you going to shoot commercial... or handload for it?
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Old December 2, 2019, 11:01 PM   #4
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I bought a box of commercial Winnie stuff just to light her off when done and 100 starline cases. EAB says the barrel ships by Dec 6--we'll see about that.

Right now, as far as I can tell, there are not many bullet offerings, though hopefully some momentum will develop for more. In any case, KAK has addressed that issue and developed a 358 legend wildcat to use those more prolific rifle profile bullets; which I may default to in the future if nothing comes of more 357's. I also may have jumped the gun a bit--the specs look a bit odd for the barrel; an 18" barrel with carbine gas and a 9/16 x 24 muzzle thread. Luckily Joebobs has a linear comp for 10mm/40 S&W with that pitch which should fit the bill. Since I have a spare Aero lower lying around, I also bit on one of Aero's Black Friday builder's set; I like the way their rails are precision tuned to their upper receivers.
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Last edited by stagpanther; December 2, 2019 at 11:12 PM.
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Old December 2, 2019, 11:11 PM   #5
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Pick up a box of Speer 180 358FP hot cores.
Size down to .357 with a Lee push-through/imperial wax.
Load over a full/compressed case of RL-7/magazine length 2.26"
https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/r...ml#post8071827

Point-blank minute of ground squirrel out to 200 w/your 18" barrel.
https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/r...ml#post8071005
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Old December 2, 2019, 11:18 PM   #6
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Thanks meheavy; I'll look that up. I already have other 358 caliber cartridges so am well stocked in bullets but they tend to be heavier ones in 200 to 225 gr, though I do have some 180 tsx's (which I suspect would have opening velocity issues in the legend). Winnie's bullets look a lot like hotcores

Oh--I also see you're well down the research path in your links, I like that point blank range, really 200 yds is perfect for New England woods purposes. This cartridge may go the way of the 25-45 sharps (which I also have and also shoots hotcores extremely well), I'm just curious to see how it shoots in an AR.

You got some pretty heady performance for a small capacity 16" barrel 357--well done! I was wondering why your labradar dropped tracking at 90 yds--but it has a "weak spot" for pistol like bullets at the 1700 fps transition (or maybe you just wanted those 5 inputs alone?)
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Last edited by stagpanther; December 2, 2019 at 11:48 PM.
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Old December 2, 2019, 11:55 PM   #7
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Barnes makes a great tac tx for 300 BO--I hope they develop one for the legend.
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Old December 3, 2019, 07:30 AM   #8
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Chuck Hawks ventures the opinion that straight-up 358 bullets can be used as long as you work the loads up carefully and watch the velocities--I'm wondering if the .001 difference really is of any notable consequence?
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Old December 3, 2019, 01:29 PM   #9
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The problem with bigger bullets is the chamber neck and throat dimensions.

Most guns will not chamber rounds with Winchester brass and 0.357" bullets.

The Starline brass is a little thinner and some do OK with 0.357" bullets.

I have not heard of anyone using 0.358s in an AR without sizing them down.

The "made for 350L" bullets do seem to include some that are working pretty good. The 170s and the 180s appear to be more consistent for deer than the 150s and 165s.

Midway shows the following:
- 165s ($35 a box in stock)
- 170s ($27 a box in stock)
- 180s ($24 a box, backorder ok).

Some guns like one weight much better than a different weight. For a new gun, I would try both the 170s and the 180s before even considering anything else.

If you do end up with 150s or 165s, over expansion is the concern. Try to avoid hitting a shoulder on the near side.
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Old December 3, 2019, 01:38 PM   #10
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Quote:
Midway shows the following:
- 165s ($35 a box in stock)
- 170s ($27 a box in stock)
- 180s ($24 a box, backorder ok).
Are these bullets--or loaded ammo? I haven't seen any 350 L specific bullets listed as such on any reloading supplier.
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Old December 3, 2019, 02:22 PM   #11
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"...for $149..." That's why. Question is why is it so cheap?
Factory ammo is an issue though. Of the 9 brands/bullet weights Midway lists, only Hornady 170 grain 'American Whitetail' is currently available at $21.99 per 20. Everything else is either not available yet or is on Backorder.
Grafs shows Winchester 180's on sale at $17.89 pr 20. And the Whitetail stuff at $19.69 per 20.
No brass listed at all from Midway. Graf's shows Hornady, Starline and what appears to be 'once fired', semi-processed(cleaned I think).
It uses .357" jacketed bullets. 1 thou won't matter though.
The whole thing is a re-hash of the .351 and .401 Self-Loading. Although the .350 is a bit faster.
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Old December 3, 2019, 05:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
...haven't seen any 350 L specific bullets listed....
There aren't any. not need there be.
Use 357/358(rifle) and size down a thou if you believe req'd.
If there aren't any Midway brass right now, it's `cause I got`em

Cabelas does have loaded ammunition though.
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Old December 3, 2019, 05:58 PM   #13
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I like your idea of resizing the 358 hotcores since it's got a good reputation for opening and staying together due to it's bonding. I only order the factory stuff in case there's a hang-up in the delivery of the rest of the stuff--a very high probability this time of year; "Tis the season to sell stuff we don't actually have."
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Old December 3, 2019, 06:08 PM   #14
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Quote:
Factory ammo is an issue though. Of the 9 brands/bullet weights Midway lists, only Hornady 170 grain 'American Whitetail' is currently available at $21.99 per 20. Everything else is either not available yet or is on Backorder.
Have seen plenty of it on the shelves at various LGS, Bass Pro, Cabela's, and Academy.

Been thinking about a Legend for my next build, but with a 300 BO, and 450 Bushy already in the safe I think I'm going for a 224 Valkyrie this time.
But of course building AR's being a disease the Legend will be coming in the future.
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Old December 3, 2019, 06:15 PM   #15
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I'm not allowing myself to get caught up in the myriad debates pro or con, I've had enough experience with 223 case wildcats to not allow fantasies of performance expectations run wild--there's only so much powder and bullet you can fit in it and I'll be plenty happy if it can drop a nice deer reliably at 100 to 150 yds. The way I see it everything depends on the bullet itself since it occupies an unusual velocity "zone."
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If you’re ever hiking in the woods and you get lost, just look up and find the brightest star in the sky and you’ll know which way space is.
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Last edited by stagpanther; December 3, 2019 at 06:22 PM.
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Old December 3, 2019, 06:19 PM   #16
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Quote:
I'm going for a 224 Valkyrie this time
Brave man--welcome to the rabbit hole. haha
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Old December 3, 2019, 06:32 PM   #17
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I looked up hornady's 170 gr offering which uses a new interlock bullet--interestingly it is listed as having a .355 OD.
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Old December 3, 2019, 07:00 PM   #18
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The three bullets I described above are new products created specifically for the 350L and appear to be the same as what they are using for their respective loaded ammo they are selling.

As such they have a better chance of appropriate expansion than a bullet for a pistol or most of the 0.358" rifles.

The 165 is a Hornady plastic tip
The 170 is a more traditional Hornady
The 180 is a more traditional Winchester

They are all 0.355" which matches the the bore on the barrels.
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Old December 3, 2019, 08:32 PM   #19
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That .355" bore size and bullets is one of those 'later details' I mentioned.
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Old December 3, 2019, 08:50 PM   #20
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Quote:
better chance of appropriate expansion than a bullet for a pistol or most of the 0.358" rifles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/336/65388-speer-180-fn-velocity-performance-post735973.html#post735973
Re: Speer 180 FN velocity/performance
The velocity's listed in the SPEER manual for the #2435 180gr FN bullet in the .35 Rem. range from a low (not reduced load) of 1679 fps to a high of 2224 fps.
Does this range sound familiar?
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Old December 3, 2019, 09:46 PM   #21
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The Speer 180 does sound ok. But it will require sizing. Most are sizing down to 0.356" so that they can use all available brass.

Before the Legend, I recall 357 Max shooters complaining that most 35 cal rifle bullets were geared for faster rounds.
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Old December 3, 2019, 09:54 PM   #22
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There's a group buy on the NOE forums right now for a .350 Legend bullet.
Buy: http://noebulletmolds.com/smf/index....ic,2912.0.html
Discussion prior to the group buy starting: http://noebulletmolds.com/smf/index....ic,2867.0.html

Although, now that I look closer, they appear to be running with a .357" diameter. Their throats are going to be loaded with lead, if the bullets are not coated.
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Old December 3, 2019, 09:55 PM   #23
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So far, sizing only a thou [from .358 --> .357 w/ starline brass] the Speer 180 has worked superbly well.
In the 190-200 cast range, the classic Lee 358-200GC sized 0.358" is also a ready made fit.

As far as sizing/shooting .357 cast (thinnest ALOX coat) leaves an absolutely mirror-finish bore at 37/38,000 psi

Last edited by mehavey; December 3, 2019 at 10:30 PM.
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Old December 3, 2019, 10:22 PM   #24
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Some are having good luck with 0.357", others are not. It is all about actual chamber dimensions and wall thickness on your brass.

There are some barrels being made with 0.355" barrels (typically, but customs can be made with larger blanks), but with the chamber neck / throat opened up to allow 0.358 bullets. These are called 358 Legend guns. With 0.355" barrels, they will shoot factory ammo, and handloads with bullets ranging from 0.355" to 0.358". They will probably even shoot 0.359" cast boolits. The only bullets I would not shoot in a 358 Legend with a 0.355" bore are the 0.357" & 0.358" solids.
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Old December 3, 2019, 10:57 PM   #25
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Frankenmauser,

I have been using cast in my guns. I actually do not have a 350 L, I have a 357AR (350 L with slightly shorter brass, 0.358 bore and uses 0.223 brass) and bunch of 357 Max.

I had problems with the nose on my 200 Lee bullets being beat up too much. I made a custom NLG mold (PC coating required) with a 180 cavity and a 200 cavity. The profile is not a lot different than the NOE you posted a link to.

I then made a loner mold that is in circulation. Although my molds drop big enough for my 0.358 guns, they size down to 0.356 just fine. Discussion starts at post 166 of:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-Boolits/page3

Last edited by P Flados; December 3, 2019 at 11:07 PM.
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