catching a thieving rat in the act

[Mainah]

I went through something like this years ago when I lived in town. The police were helpful, but the kids knew how to avoid getting caught, and they definitely knew that I couldn't touch them.

I went to City Hall, got a "boys will be boys" speach. One of the kids involved is now doing life for murder, another is doing a five year stretch for robbery. They were a couple of real winners, and they put me through hell.

Here's what I learned; you can't control their behavior, only the way that you respond to it. Your angry reactions will encourage more bad behavior, they enjoy making you crazy.

If you have to stay in that house, and given the rental history I'd think about it, then try to lay low and wait them out. Don't let them inside your head, it's not worth it.

[Creature]

When you are losing the battle, sometimes you have to fight dirty!

But you will still lose...and lose bigger. Machiavelli and Sun Tsu would counter that a losing battle is a losing battle...time to retreat.

Now, try offering up something that is constructive and legal.

[VUPDblue]

I borrowed a DVR surveillance recorder from work and hooked it up to an IR capable camera outside. I cought a couple of little bastages from down the street vandalizing my property and stealing a relatively large statue from my garden. The local cops paid them a visit, retrieved my property and notified social services who arrested the MOTHER for neglect of dependents. There were other factors that led to her arrest, but the nail in the coffin, so to speak, was me notifying the local PD and them actually paying her a visit. Never underestimate the power of videotape evidence.

[9mmsnoopy]

UNFREAKING BELIEVABLE. after getting a window smashed out of my truck sat night, then my truck being looted thru sunday night, it gets even worse.

I took today off from work so i could sit up last night and keep a lookout, which i did, after sleeping a few hours this morning, i drove up to Houston(an hour) to look into some surviellance sysyems.

as soon as i get back home my neighbor tells me that someone had been trying to break into my garage! instead of coming out with his gun, which he has always said he has and would use, he comes out and yells "what the hell are you doing" and the guy looks at him, starts to walk off and after a few feet starts running. of course the cops were unable to locate this bastard.

neighbor said it was a hispanic kid looked like 15-17 years old, was wearing a hooded sweatshirt with the hood up in 95 degree weather, said if he sees him again, he would be able to identify him.

while i am very grateful for them looking out and calling the cops, i wish he had had the gumption to do something more.

thats 3 times in 4 days that i have been victimized. im going to get a camera system, looks like i might have to call Brinks too.

BROAD DAYLIGHT, how brazen can you get? i was wrong in my assumption that it was the kids next door, they always have a pack of kids over there, they see the motorcycle and nice mustang in my garage. I told that boy next door that if he knows or hears something and helped me out that i would make it worth his effort $$$$$.

When i got back from Houston, i was drop dead tired, now my heart is about to jump out of my chest. I wont be sleeping much tonight, the truck is one thing, my house is something else. had he gotten into the garage its just 1 more door to get in the house.

the police told me that they will be on "heavy patrol" in the area tonight, thats nice, but not very comforting. my nerves are just about shot already.

[Creature]

If I lived nearby, you can be sure I would sit up with you tonight and stand watch. I would even bring my own shotgun.

That said, absolutely install a surveillance and alarm system. And hire a real estate agent!

[Hosses]

No luck on picking up a surveillance system?

[Creature]

Excellent!

I know that in my house, when momma isn't happy, nobody is happy.

[9mmsnoopy]

i am not very handy when it comes to installing that sort of thing,running the wiring etc.... , i have a guy whos sposed to be calling with an estimate but i am beginning to wonder if he really wants my business.

i saw some wireless type systems, but i hear they dont work that well, get alot of interference,etc...

i want to ask all of you, if you had been my neighbor and seen someone trying to break into my garage, what would you have done??

i thanked the neighbor more than once for looking out and for calling the cops, some people wouldnt have even done that, but if hes going to run out there and yell at the scumbag, hes just going to run off as he did.

if your not going to take action to stop/subdue the perp, then it would have been better to call the cops and atleast then maybe they could have chased him down. he wasnt going to get that garage door open, i keep it jammed from the inside.

[Capt. Charlie]

Threads merged. No need for two threads on the same subject.

[K-Minus]

Shoot them with 12G beanbag rounds...That'll learn em'.
Or shoot them with a paintball gun loaded with those pepper ball rounds...

My house has been broken into three times so I know how it feels.
I only wished I had been waiting with a Mossberg 590...

Try the camaras idea so you can have some evidence.

If it were me I'd use scare tactics.You know...sittin' in a lawn chair in your yard with AR-15 all day,screaming at the moon at night,putting a dead cat in their mailbox,etc...

Like you said the cops won't do nothing.

[Derius_T]

Snoop, your situation suck big time. What do your local laws say about home defense, about using deadly force, ect? Are you allowed to use force to protect propery, or against bodily harm only? Read up on your laws and know them by heart fast.

I wish I could give you a sure fire solution, but it sounds like you are in a terrible area. I know moving is probably not an option, and I wouldn't personally do it even if it was. No one is running me off from my house and property that I paid for.

Maybe as a quick option, you could hire a private detective type to do some 24hr surveillence for a few days until you get set up with alarms and such.
It shouldn't be too horrible expensive, and they can make arrests, and their testimony in court will hold almost as much as a LEO if you get a reputable company that works with LEOS.

Good luck.

(sheesh, I'm a repressed sociopath cuz I wanted to dump some garbage on some @-holes lawn....... )

[workinwifdakids]

An unintentionally maladjusted halogen security light could accidentally point into the breeder's bedroom window. There's nothing illegal about that.

[9mmsnoopy]

Moving just isnt an option, even if it were, i bought and paid off this house, im not going to go into debt for 15 years because i let some braindead scum run me out.

i went to visit a buddy who lives a block over at about 11 tonight, on the walk back i found a black long sleeved hoodie in the yard of a vacant house, the hoodie that the guy who tried to break into my house was wearing, pretty easy to be spotted wearing a hoodie in 95 degree heat, so he ditched that thing fast.

IF the cops would put some heat on that punk next door he would sing like a bird, he KNOWS who tried to get in my house today.

[John28226]

There is a company in Austin, Texas that has a full line of reasonablely priced CCTV equipment, packaged in complete "kits" and with excellent instructions. Also they offer telephone technical assistance - try calling them at
1-800-335-9777. Company is Super Circuits.

I suspect that you might make some headway by talking with the property owner and, by all means, document everything by keeping a log with exact dates and times. Depending on the reaction of the property owner you can escalate from there. Department of Social Services might be a good place to call.

Depending on the ages of the "problem children" you may find some help from the local police department crime prevention team - if your city has such.

Be sure to obtain copies of any police reports involving this group and, if you have the time, you might learn a lot by a visit to your local courthouse to check for criminal records and civil records for all involved. Most courthouses have two or three long term employees who are happy to help an amateur search public records. You will need the full name of all parties but you do not need any permission or releases.

Bad scene - I wish you luck.

John
Charlotte, NC

[Semblance]

As fun as it is to be flippant about wanting to shoot the kid with beanbag loads or rocksalt or kick his ass or hire a biker gang to intimidate them or whatever the hell sort of vigilante justice we all would love to inflict, the simple fact of the matter is that these things are illegal and will get you put in jail in short order. Even getting a dog and letting him guard the yard will likely end in lawsuits if someone gets bitten - trespassing or not. The courts will look even LESS favorably on the dog owner if the trespasser is a neighbor! We live in a litigious society where thieves are allowed the benefit of the doubt, while generally good citizens have the book thrown at them if they tiptoe around wrong. You shoot some kid (a minor) with a paintball gun or a beanbag load and his momma is going to sue you faster than you can stand up. Does that stink? Yes. Can we do anything about it? Not in the short run.

Think about what you advocate others to do before you post it. The original poster's greatest allies right now would be a video camera and a bunch of inexpensive motion sensor floodlights, NOT a baseball bat, a paintball gun, a rottweiler, and a biker gang.

I don't mean any offense to anyone who offered advice in this thread, these are just some thoughts from someone who has been browsing these forums for several years and has seen too many "What do I do about my neighbor problem?" threads turn into pages of legally unsound "Bust their damn kneecaps!" sort of advice.

[VUPDblue]

If you happen to get them on video damaging your property, file a police report and let the cops handle it or not. While they are or are not handling it, take your copy of the video tape to the clerk of the court at your local courthouse, along with a list of what these damages cost you, and file a civil suit against them at the same time. They may or may not get the message but at least you will be pro-active about it.

[dralarms]

Pm me and I'll give you my phone number, I install the stuff for a living and I can help you to do it yourself (instruction wise). I can even get you the EQ. if you can't get it elsewhere.

[caz223]

Dude, get a dog.

[Fremmer]

i want to ask all of you, if you had been my neighbor and seen someone trying to break into my garage, what would you have done??

I would have called the police. I'm not sure about confronting the kid, maybe, maybe not.

Security, reinforced doors, and a dog (or two) sounds like what you need.

I do understand how frustrated you are. But be careful about how you react with taking a firearm outside of your house and using it to confront someone. We don't want you to get arrested. Please let us know how things turn out.

Even getting a dog and letting him guard the yard will likely end in lawsuits if someone gets bitten - trespassing or not. The courts will look even LESS favorably on the dog owner if the trespasser is a neighbor!

Maybe so, but he's got to do something. Of course, he'd need to build a high fence, post beware of dog signs, and make sure that those dogs can't escape from the yard and house. But the dogs will certainly help convince his fine neighborhood friends that they might want to look elsewhere for their fun.

[Derius_T]

Look, for those of you downing on people mentioning dogs, I don't understand your reasoning. There is a reason I think that my house has never been vandalized, no matter where I have lived, and while my neighbors get hit around me. I don't think its the fact that alot of people know I have guns. I try to keep that private, except for the fact that I hunt. No tell tale stickers like NRA or the like on vehicles, no gun racks, ect. I really believe that it is the DOGS that deter the most.

I have two american chows, outside dogs, securely chained, AND electric hidden fenced area, with collars, and No Tresspassing, and Beware Guard Dogs, and DOGS WILL BITE, BEWARE signs. Also my bull mastiff/great dane mix 200 lb lap dog in the house, but he sure doesn't SOUND or LOOK like a lap dog that would just as soon lick you to death as bite you. And nobody is going in the house hearing that very alert bull moose roaring if he hears a noise.

(the chows however, WILL bite you)

And as far as the laws go, if your dogs are properly liscenced and properly restrained, and you have the appropriate signage posted, I don't see you being held responsible if someone trespasses and fools around and gets bitten.

[9mmsnoopy]

I sure do appreciate all of the suggestions! e
Even the unpractical ones, that could result in ME going to jail(belive me, alot of those ideas had already crossed my mind).

I definately will be getting some sort of camera system put up here, i think that catching them on tape is about the only way im going to see thier sorry asses in the back of a police car.

The motion sensing lights are great, i should have had those already, but now i'm looking to catch them, not scare them off when a light comes on.

I have never been much for big dogs, but am starting to consider it, i just dont have the $$$ for fencing,etc....

Those punks next door have been laying real low the last couple of days, i havent seen a peep of them, and thats very unusual.

The lady that lives behind me said she saw the kid who was trying to get in the house also trying to break/knock down the floodlights i mounted over the garage door. I think they are wanting cover of darkness and my being gone to try the house again, you would think they wouldnt be back anytime soon, but then i never would have thought they would try to get in my house in broad daylight a day after breaking into my truck.

[Mainah]

I'm not a fan of keeping dogs chained outside 24/7. They'll bark non-stop and alienate you from the neighbors that you don't have problems with.

For the same money that you'd invest in a dog you could get a good alarm system, and you don't have to scoop alarm poop.

[120mm]

I actually registered here just to make a comment:

+1 to all those folks who think you need to stay "legal" in your response.

But, to deter these creeps, and to give yourself some satisfaction of a "job well done" have you considered some completely harmless "booby-traps?" There is an invisible marker dye that security firms sell, that turns bright blue or purple once it contacts water. Makes really good fingerprints, and the best part? It is absolutely permanent. Your bad boys will be walking around blue in every place they've touched themselves after trying to break in, and leave blue prints all over the place until they've noticed what they've gotten into. It comes as a powder, I believe, and you can sprinkle it around where they may walk, and I "believe" you can mix it with vaseline and paint the underside of door handles, etc.. We used it to catch a peeper at a store where I once worked.

Stink-bombs are both fun and harmless, and strong, bad smells guarantee that these lil' vermin won't be having much of a "social life" for awhile. Kids are paranoid about how they smell, so one time will probably deter them forever. Your local sporting goods store might have some bait that you can use, say, in a dead-fall (remember the bucket over the door trick?) You keep it from smelling bad until the little idiot opens the door by putting a soft, yet heavy item on a piece of rigid plastic. (A zip-loc baggie full of sand?)

Most of all, you need to find what they value most, and find a way that by abusing you, they remove that by their own actions.

There are several ways to get revenge that are legal, harmless, good deterrence from future act, and very satisfying.

(I liked the "unintentionally maladjusted halogen light that shines into the mama sow's bedroom". That would just help her know what her kids are up to)

[ibfestus]

Been there done that. I bought a house with my life savings and did not believe I would ever cut and run from a fight. It started when the neighbor died and his house was sold to a slum lord that put it in a HUD low rent program. Problems from the git go. Then the guy on the other side of that house sold out and another HUD renter moved in. My car was stolen, my garage broken into but the final straw was one day I came home to find a couple of 11 year olds had piled a bunch of leaves and paper up against the garage and were in the process of lighting it off with matches.

I sold the house and most of my possessions at auction (including 23 firearms), then rented an apartment where we lived for over a year. I found 60 acres out in the county and managed to get a small ranch style house built. I was 51 at the time and hated to think about taking out a mortgage. It was the best thing I have ever done! the $10 grand I lost on the other home was nothing! My new home has appreciated by 10X that and more while the old neighborhood is now like an inner city ghetto (plus I LOVE IT HERE!).

My advice is get out now, you will probably have to sooner or later.

[Derius_T]

I'm sorry, some may find it silly or arrogant or whatever, but no way would I let some gutter trash run me off from my PAID FOR house and property. Something would have to be done. And while I realize that some people may get their panties in a wad at the slightest mention of retaliation, there comes a point where, if the LAW will NOT PROTECT or HELP yu in any way, then sometimes you might just have to help yourself. Is it the moral "high road"? No, but do you wait till it comes to the point where they catch your wife or kids home alone and burn the house down around them, or cut your brake lines, or some other terrible thing? And to say kids can't do that stuff is just assinine.

Put your foot down, one way or the other, and do what you have to do to protect your family and your home. PERIOD.