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Old November 12, 2016, 12:21 PM   #1
Pond, James Pond
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Why are SHTF threads disallowed, and...

... do bug-out bag threads constitute SHTF threads (assuming there is firearm content to the question)?

Hoping this is the right forum. It was this or general discussion....
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Old November 13, 2016, 12:38 AM   #2
JohnKSa
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Below are a few reasons why TSHTF threads are unacceptable.

1. They are often an excuse to discuss shooting people without having to deal with responsibility issues like legal justification and morality. Along the same lines, they are often brought up as a context in which it might seem reasonable to discuss various illegal activities without having to deal with responsibility issues.

2. Even if they don't start out to be as described above; they almost invariably devolve to that level.

3. They tend to be fantasy-based, or to devolve to that level and therefore are difficult to discuss in terms of real-world principles and concepts.

Discussions about SPECIFIC, REAL-WORLD scenarios could possibly acceptable as long as they don't devolve into thinly disguised zombie scenarios and as long as the discussion starts out and remains rooted in real-world principles and concepts and doesn't depart from the TFL purpose which is the "discussion and advancement of responsible firearms ownership".

Discussion about a bug-out bag wouldn't necessarily run afoul of the prohibition against doomsday/TEOTWAWKI/zombie/TSHTF threads.
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Old November 13, 2016, 04:40 AM   #3
Pond, James Pond
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Understood. And therefore where does this lie?

There have been recent geo-political events that have implications far beyond the borders of the country that decided the outcome.

Certain influential parties within that process have expressed views that, quite rightly, cause significant concern in my country of Estonia. Particularly as they were specifically about Estonia, a fellow NATO member...

The possibility of their being large-scale, aggression against my country by a belligerent, nuclear-capable and nuclear-ready neighbour has been real for a number of months now, and these recent events bring with them a great deal of uncertainty.

That uncertainty behoves me to consider all possibilities and outcomes and how I might deal with them because they are not solely hypothetical, or highly unlikely, but rather now possible if not clear and present possibilities.

Part of that is accepting the possibility that I, my wife and our toddler and baby daughters may have to flee our home or even the country.

As such, would a discussion on this topic and how to prepare for this specific and real-world situation be under the plausible and therefore more acceptable category of SHTF threads?
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Old November 13, 2016, 07:58 PM   #4
Evan Thomas
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The general rule here is also that topics must be firearms-related. It strikes me that in the situation you describe, things like current passports, visas, and funds in other countries would be far more useful than firearms, as would a willingness to leave well before there are tanks coming over your border. I say this as the son of a father whose mother got him and his brothers out of Russia in 1918 by walking through a succession of war zones, and who left Germany in 1939. All things considered, he was quite lucky.
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Old November 14, 2016, 03:48 AM   #5
Pond, James Pond
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Quote:
The general rule here is also that topics must be firearms-related.
I am a firearms owner.
I may have to move my family whilst in possible harm's way.
I think we can agree that firearms are relevant to that discussion.

Your remarks about the difficulties faced by your grandmother in 1918 only serves to underscore that.

So, can I confirm therefore that such a thread will not get closed prematurely?
As present, that is not clear to me.
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Old November 14, 2016, 08:02 AM   #6
Evan Thomas
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Assuming it isn't driven into silliness by other members, no, it won't be closed. You might include something in the OP to the effect that you're posting with staff permission subject to replies staying focused on your specific situation.
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Old November 14, 2016, 08:46 AM   #7
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Quote:
It strikes me that in the situation you describe, things like current passports, visas, and funds in other countries would be far more useful than firearms, as would a willingness to leave well before there are tanks coming over your border.
Absolutely - the time to buy insurance is well before the storm hits.
Having all of your documents including birth certificates and having them backed up on an easy to carry memory stick might be a good idea.

Hoping I stay within the confines here, it seems you would have 5 means of escape - plane, train, motor vehicle, ship or walking. Not knowing all of the rules in Europe, is it possible for someone from one country to travel to another with a handgun checked in baggage? If not, that would preclude escape plans by air and possibly train if having a gun with you is paramount. By ship I imagine having a gun would depend on what type of ship - a ferry, maybe not; a freighter, maybe so. Travel by automobile should be OK with a longgun (at least from what friends who have traveled in Europe have told me) - but those were sporting arms, not defensive weapons. Last would be walking - allows the easiest means of carrying a handgun - but as you said, you have young children, so mobility and the ability to tend to them on what could an arduous journey would make this method the choice of absolute last resort, IMO.

Besides traveling with some form of protection, gold and diamonds and similar things of international exchange would be a good thing.

IF it is as bad as you are implying, I would make plans now to determine a final destination and develop several plans on how to get there, gun or not.

Good luck.
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Old November 14, 2016, 11:10 AM   #8
Mal H
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FITASC - we will leave your post visible, but this forum is not a discussion forum in the general sense. It is only used for technical, policy, and procedure questions.

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