Been looking for this for 24 years... Ultra-thin Model 400-22 Derringer - Page 2

jamstutz · December 17, 2008, 06:40 AM

FMiller--Many thanks in locating the patent!

mini14jac · December 17, 2008, 07:38 AM

25 years ago, very few people had CCW licenses.
Maybe there wasn't enough potential market to get the design off the ground?

Now that many thousands of people are legally carrying concealed firearms, this gun may find a more welcoming market.
If someone could produce this weapon, and keep the price close to $200, I think it could be successful.

jamstutz · December 18, 2008, 06:50 AM

Update--autofull and I have spoken on the phone, and this is what we've found:

Thanks to those of you who provided leads as to phone #'s--unfortunately we have been unable to make contact with anyone so far.

A more in depth Google search on the designer, Jody Numbers, produced this article http://imm.plasticstoday.com/?q=articles/8317 which indicates that a designer of this name from Tempe, AZ passed away about ten years ago. It appears likely that this is the same individual who invented the 400-22. Any additional leads as to tracking down surviving family members or associates may be refered to autofull or me as we are currently sharing available information.

Thanks to each of you for your interest and assistance.

azredhawk44 · December 18, 2008, 02:52 PM

Seems Mr. Numbers is a pretty cool guy, too bad he's passed away. Some other patents he's been involved with include the design of Mace dispensing containers.

Very pro-self defense individual.

PM Sent with additional contact details.

autofull · December 18, 2008, 06:27 PM

well, i just got off the phone with sam ciammitti, he was a co-patent holder with jody numbers and a nice fellow. after reading the plastic industry article i also feel that he has passed away but sam had no knowledge of that although he had no contact with jody for about 12yrs. soooo, he is going to track down some phone numbers for us to call. relatives and such. i really hope i can get some of these made, maybe a family member inherited his property and designs and is willing to sell or share. from what i have learned from sam, jody is one smart dude that grew up as a plastic mold maker so the write up on him seem,s to be the correct story, as i said, the plot thickens. kevin---autofull--

autofull · January 4, 2009, 04:49 PM

well, acording to the arizona contact, mr. numbers has passed away. his search has turned up no one with any further information on the family or heirs of jody numbers. i have talked to sandy chisolm of north american arms on this design and forwarded all the info we collected and he said he was interested in this weapon and would hand it over to his design team, so, unless someone finds a production model or naa builds it, this is the final chapter here. thank you to all who were interested and contributed . kevin.

jamstutz · January 4, 2009, 05:21 PM

Many thanks Kevin for all your help. Best to you and to Mrs. "autofull"

Perhaps someday NAA will introduce the 400-22 to America...we can only hope!

ndinnd · January 29, 2010, 05:51 PM

I have one of the original mod 400's. When I got it I was told 3 were started and this was the only one that was completed. It is in the box, with the manual.

Mateba · October 8, 2010, 01:17 PM

I'd buy one too if NAA made one

Gene · January 29, 2011, 07:20 PM

I know, old post but I'd buy one in a heartbeat if I could! Anyone hear anything else?

jamstutz · January 29, 2011, 09:42 PM

We're still hoping that Sandy Chisholm at NAA will put the 400-22 on the production schedule. Looks like that's the only way most of us will ever see one.

WANT A LCR 22LR · January 30, 2011, 09:55 AM

Interesting gun. And, I have a penchant for chasing down obscure nearly forgotten items. Has anyone contacted machine shops, gun stores, gun clubs that are local to the original designer? ( Jody Numbers )

He just has to be locally known as the guy making a gun.

There is a ever so slight chance Shot Gun News has some sort of contact info as well.

WonderWheeler · March 17, 2012, 12:03 AM

I put together a 3d CAD model of the gun. The striker mechanism seems a little flimsy, and I notice the original advertisement said something about high strength metal being used, perhaps there was a mechanical problem there.

I can understand why there might be reluctance amongst police to getting such a slim little gun available for manufacture in California. But, its such a cute little guy, that I'd like to see the design reproduced out there. Apparently this is a design that has once been manufacturered by a licensed gun manufacturer in California. If I am wrong, please let me know.

Anyone else interesting in seeing this little guy manufactured?

jamstutz · March 17, 2012, 06:19 AM

We were able to track down the original patent drawings as indicated in prior posts, as well as an obituary for Jody Numbers of Scottsdale AZ, the little gun's designer. He apparently passed away shortly after applying for the patents, and the legal firm assisting in the patent process is no longer in business. No survivors have thus far been located.

I have located one completed model out of three that were reportedly started, but I have been asked by the owner not to divulge his identity or his contact information. He received it from his father, who obtained it from a collector in one of the western states. Last I spoke with him he was unwilling to part with it. Hopefully, if and when he is willing, he will contact me.

Salmoneye · March 17, 2012, 06:41 AM

Very interesting thread, and research...

Master Blaster 2 · March 17, 2012, 07:51 AM

As a Derringer Collector this was interesting. I have seen several guns over the past 30 years advertize and never make it to retail.

spanishjames · March 17, 2012, 10:03 AM

It looks very similar to this:

http://www.heizerfirearms.com/

The .22 has a bit more class.

Master Blaster 2 · March 17, 2012, 11:45 AM

And the Heizer had been advertized for 2 years and as yet to hit retail outlets. Might fade away like so many others. If I found one tommorrow I'd buy it.

saltydog452 · March 17, 2012, 12:01 PM

I'd like to fool around with one. Not likely that'd it replace the constant duty NAA .32Guardian.

Last I heard, Mr. Grossman was domiciled in Virginia Horse Country and broadned his interests. NAA mfg facilities are elsewhere.

salty

Achilles109 · December 30, 2015, 02:31 PM

My friend was given this serial numbered-001 by Mr. Numbers himself. He is willing to sell it.

johnwilliamson062 · December 31, 2015, 10:09 PM

Am I the only one who saw post #33?

oldcabin · December 31, 2015, 10:43 PM

...too easy....
If he's been "shopping" for 24 years he's not buying anything

peggysue · January 1, 2016, 05:22 AM

Unicorn found!!

Model12Win · January 1, 2016, 06:20 AM

I want a repro of this gun.

BAD.

carguychris · January 1, 2016, 12:37 PM

Achilles109 - can your friend verify the production info given in post #33?

December 17, 2008, 06:40 AM	#26
jamstutz Member Join Date: July 4, 2001 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 85	FMiller--Many thanks in locating the patent! __________________ *Pervasive government is an unholy god.*

December 17, 2008, 07:38 AM	#27
mini14jac Senior Member Join Date: February 19, 2001 Location: The Volunteer State. Posts: 691	25 years ago, very few people had CCW licenses. Maybe there wasn't enough potential market to get the design off the ground? Now that many thousands of people are legally carrying concealed firearms, this gun may find a more welcoming market. If someone could produce this weapon, and keep the price close to $200, I think it could be successful. __________________ <><

December 18, 2008, 06:50 AM	#28
jamstutz Member Join Date: July 4, 2001 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 85	Update--autofull and I have spoken on the phone, and this is what we've found: Thanks to those of you who provided leads as to phone #'s--unfortunately we have been unable to make contact with anyone so far. A more in depth Google search on the designer, Jody Numbers, produced this article http://imm.plasticstoday.com/?q=articles/8317 which indicates that a designer of this name from Tempe, AZ passed away about ten years ago. It appears likely that this is the same individual who invented the 400-22. Any additional leads as to tracking down surviving family members or associates may be refered to autofull or me as we are currently sharing available information. Thanks to each of you for your interest and assistance. __________________ *Pervasive government is an unholy god.*

December 18, 2008, 06:27 PM	#30
autofull Junior Member Join Date: December 11, 2008 Posts: 8	still working on it well, i just got off the phone with sam ciammitti, he was a co-patent holder with jody numbers and a nice fellow. after reading the plastic industry article i also feel that he has passed away but sam had no knowledge of that although he had no contact with jody for about 12yrs. soooo, he is going to track down some phone numbers for us to call. relatives and such. i really hope i can get some of these made, maybe a family member inherited his property and designs and is willing to sell or share. from what i have learned from sam, jody is one smart dude that grew up as a plastic mold maker so the write up on him seem,s to be the correct story, as i said, the plot thickens. kevin---autofull--

January 4, 2009, 04:49 PM	#31
autofull Junior Member Join Date: December 11, 2008 Posts: 8	looks like the end of the line here well, acording to the arizona contact, mr. numbers has passed away. his search has turned up no one with any further information on the family or heirs of jody numbers. i have talked to sandy chisolm of north american arms on this design and forwarded all the info we collected and he said he was interested in this weapon and would hand it over to his design team, so, unless someone finds a production model or naa builds it, this is the final chapter here. thank you to all who were interested and contributed . kevin.

December 18, 2008, 02:52 PM	#29
azredhawk44 Junior member Join Date: September 28, 2005 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 6,465	Seems Mr. Numbers is a pretty cool guy, too bad he's passed away. Some other patents he's been involved with include the design of Mace dispensing containers. Very pro-self defense individual. PM Sent with additional contact details.

January 4, 2009, 05:21 PM	#32
jamstutz Member Join Date: July 4, 2001 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 85	Many thanks Kevin for all your help. Best to you and to Mrs. "autofull" Perhaps someday NAA will introduce the 400-22 to America...we can only hope! __________________ *Pervasive government is an unholy god.*

January 29, 2010, 05:51 PM	#33
ndinnd Junior Member Join Date: January 29, 2010 Posts: 1	Numbers Mod 400 I have one of the original mod 400's. When I got it I was told 3 were started and this was the only one that was completed. It is in the box, with the manual.

October 8, 2010, 01:17 PM	#34
Mateba Junior Member Join Date: March 14, 2007 Posts: 8	I'd buy one too if NAA made one

January 29, 2011, 07:20 PM	#35
Gene Member Join Date: June 1, 1999 Posts: 42	I know, old post but I'd buy one in a heartbeat if I could! Anyone hear anything else?

January 29, 2011, 09:42 PM	#36
jamstutz Member Join Date: July 4, 2001 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 85	We're still hoping that Sandy Chisholm at NAA will put the 400-22 on the production schedule. Looks like that's the only way most of us will ever see one. __________________ *Pervasive government is an unholy god.*

January 30, 2011, 09:55 AM	#37
WANT A LCR 22LR Senior Member Join Date: September 5, 2010 Posts: 389	Interesting gun. And, I have a penchant for chasing down obscure nearly forgotten items. Has anyone contacted machine shops, gun stores, gun clubs that are local to the original designer? ( Jody Numbers ) He just has to be locally known as the guy making a gun. There is a ever so slight chance Shot Gun News has some sort of contact info as well.

March 17, 2012, 12:03 AM	#38
WonderWheeler Junior Member Join Date: March 14, 2012 Location: central California Posts: 2	400-22 Derringer I put together a 3d CAD model of the gun. The striker mechanism seems a little flimsy, and I notice the original advertisement said something about high strength metal being used, perhaps there was a mechanical problem there. I can understand why there might be reluctance amongst police to getting such a slim little gun available for manufacture in California. But, its such a cute little guy, that I'd like to see the design reproduced out there. Apparently this is a design that has once been manufacturered by a licensed gun manufacturer in California. If I am wrong, please let me know. Anyone else interesting in seeing this little guy manufactured?

March 17, 2012, 06:41 AM	#40
Salmoneye Senior Member Join Date: December 31, 2011 Location: Vermont Posts: 2,076	Very interesting thread, and research...

March 17, 2012, 07:51 AM	#41
Master Blaster 2 Junior member Join Date: May 29, 2011 Posts: 895	As a Derringer Collector this was interesting. I have seen several guns over the past 30 years advertize and never make it to retail.

March 17, 2012, 11:45 AM	#43
Master Blaster 2 Junior member Join Date: May 29, 2011 Posts: 895	And the Heizer had been advertized for 2 years and as yet to hit retail outlets. Might fade away like so many others. If I found one tommorrow I'd buy it.

March 17, 2012, 12:01 PM	#44
saltydog452 Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 2004 Posts: 516	I'd like to fool around with one. Not likely that'd it replace the constant duty NAA .32Guardian. Last I heard, Mr. Grossman was domiciled in Virginia Horse Country and broadned his interests. NAA mfg facilities are elsewhere. salty

December 31, 2015, 10:09 PM	#46
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	Am I the only one who saw post #33?

December 31, 2015, 10:43 PM	#47
oldcabin Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2013 Location: st louis Posts: 235	...too easy.... If he's been "shopping" for 24 years he's not buying anything

January 1, 2016, 05:22 AM	#48
peggysue Junior member Join Date: May 20, 2014 Posts: 1,835	Unicorn found!!

January 1, 2016, 06:20 AM	#49
Model12Win Junior member Join Date: October 20, 2012 Posts: 5,854	I want a repro of this gun. BAD.

January 1, 2016, 12:37 PM	#50
carguychris Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2007 Location: Richardson, TX Posts: 7,523	Achilles109 - can your friend verify the production info given in post #33?