Why I stopped carrying Pistols

[Lohman446]

Why am I looking into a revolver to replace my P938?

Yes I get the logic of "carry the same gun, in the same place, all the time" but I'm not going to carry a Glock 19 or a Glock 29 all the time. Just doesn't happen. So I have always had a "soft spot" for a smaller "handier" pistol. I'm fairly young compared to many on this board but a water skiing incident, a downhill skiing oops or several, and a too many years of martial arts have taken their toll on my left arm and created nerve damage. I have taken up fitness boxing to make sure my five year old daughter is learning some basic things and my left hand lives in a state of either pain or numbness (normally numbness). I'm not giving up boxing. Racking a Glock slide, even under pressure, no big deal. Racking the P938 slide which does not give me as good a grip - that is becoming an issue and I cannot help but recall all the people who note you carry an extra magazine not because of the need for more ammo but because the way you "fix" a semi failure is to drop (the magazine), shake and turn (the pistol to remove any obstruction), insert (new magazine), and rack (slide). I'm not 100% confident in doing that under stress. I am certainly not able to do it if my right hand is tied up.

So I find myself perusing lightweight revolvers.

[TxFlyFish]

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

[USNRet93]

The G43 started to jam on me constantly. I switched magazines but that didn't help. So I did some investigation & found out that the G43 jams.

Really? My 2 sons each have one, each has shot 'about' 1000 rounds thru both, cheap to expensive ammo, new and reloads..and neither have had a jam/FTF/FTF, etc...I guess YMMV..and all that. Why I bought 2 G42s...if my EDC started to have a problem, I'd carry the other and find out what was 'up'....

[Lohman446]

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

Never ever have I run a revolver to that kind of round count and kept track. I bet my .357 Blackhawk could - especially if I was running .38 loads. I'm guessing that is not what you meant though. Can they?

[jar]

Was a law passed that says you can't carry a revolver and a semi-automatic? I can carry one of the newer alloy framed "J" size revolvers and one of the newer pocket 380s and still be carrying less weight than a 5906.

[buck460XVR]

Originally Posted by TxFlyFish

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

I have several that have, other than the occasional loose ejector rod.

As for the Semi-autos being called pistols and revolvers being called ......wait for it.....revolvers, it seems to most folks in the gun world, that it is one way to easily differentiate between the two and is readily accepted. Is is wrong to use pistol when referring to a revolver? Nope, and in most cases within the discussion, folks will not be confused. Look at Nosler bullets. They distinguish between bullets generally used for auto calibers and those used for revolver calibers by calling them either "Sporting Handgun Pistol" or "Sporting Handgun Revolver".

Nuff said.

[44 AMP]

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

Some of mine have crossed the 5k mark, Not sure about 10k, never did keep a log or close round count.

Why would that matter??

If you're going to judge entire design categories based on the behavior or misbehavior of specific individual pistols, I suggest you re-evaluate your criteria.

And be sure to remove from consideration every single example of failure that was operator induced. Every failure caused by incorrect operation (limp wristing, short stroking, incorrect loading, etc.) And remove those caused by lack of proper maint. Lack of cleaning, improper lubrication (usually too little), as well.

Having a revolver jam because of crud under the extractor is an OPERATOR failure. having a semi not go fully into battery because it was gummed up, or too dry, again, same thing.

Having a pistol choke on crap ammo, again, OPERATOR failure. You chose what ammo to put in it.

Also, they are all pistols. According to some, the term comes from the 1500s or so, when Pistoia, Italy was a major maker of "hand gonnes". Up until the invention of practical revolvers in the early 1800s, every handgun on earth was a pistol (and still is) with the chamber integral with the barrel. Colt's original patent was for a "revolving pistol".

Don't go just by regular dictionary definitions, they can be incorrect when referring to a technical application. The dictionaries themselves tell you that. They give definitions "as found in popular usage", NOT precise technical usage.

Its not a problem, unless you think that it being a revolver means its not a pistol. If you do, you're wrong.

[74A95]

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

#1. Having a revolver jam because of crud under the extractor is an OPERATOR failure.

#2. having a semi not go fully into battery because it was gummed up, or too dry, again, same thing.

#3. Having a pistol choke on crap ammo, again, OPERATOR failure. You chose what ammo to put in it.

#1. No, actually the crud is to blame. Last I heard, humans didn't have telekinetic power to dictate where debris goes when a gun is fired.

#2. See #1. In my case, I blamed it on being a Glock, because Glocks have been known to fail to return fully to battery, and even fire when not fully locked up.

#3. How do you define crap ammo? I had a gun jam up on Lapua ammo. I don't consider Lapua crap ammo. Maybe you do. And yet, the gun didn't jam with Wolf and Tulammo. Does that make them premium ammo?

Even the best ammo can have defects that are missed during quality control checks.

[TailGator]

Blanket statements that G43s always jam, or that semis are always less reliable than revolvers, are simply false. Lots of people are happy with their G43s, and lot of people experience good reliability with major brands of semis. A fair number of people have owned revolvers with problems. Both revolvers and semis have advantages and disadvantages, and folks are completely free to choose which they prefer. Those blanket statements made to influence other people's decisions are misleading, though.

As far as pistols and revolvers, it is quite common to hear both uses of the word pistol, and is usually pretty clear from the context what way it is meant. Why argue it?

[shafter]

The only time I've ever had a semiauto fail was with a bad batch of ammo. With revolvers I've had a transfer bar break on a Ruger, and a cylinder pin get backed out on a Smith and Wesson. In both cases the revolver was out of commission with no way to repair it during a fight.

[dgludwig]

Um, revolvers are pistols....

This is true. But from the time I was a kid growing up in the fifties, and for an awfully long time afterwards, the term "pistol" meant a semi-auto handgun and the term "revolver" meant, well, a revolver. Truth is, though, the term pistol does "technically" mean either a revolver and/or a semi-auto handgun. Still, old habits are hard to shuck...

[TxFlyFish]

A gun that is sensitive to crud and ammo is not neccessarily operator error. Some guns can go thousands straight out of the box with no lube, no break in, no maintenance, no cleaning.

[fastbolt]

Okay, please forgive me for posting before reading through the many posts, but I've got more chores to do before one of our granddaughters arrives for her normal sleepover, but thought I'd respond with a casual comment to the OP ...

Originally Posted by Doc Holliday 1950

I had 2 Pistols or Semi-Automatics. Both were Glocks, a G19 & a G43.
The G43 started to jam on me constantly. I switched magazines but that didn't help. So I did some investigation & found out that the G43 jams. When your carry stops working 100% that gets very scary. I sold my G43 & put my G19 into my safe. I can carry it ITW holster put that's uncomfortable or I can get a sholder holster for it. But in my mind, there's that little whisper that kepps saying what if it jams too?
My 3 Revolvers have never misfired or jammed yet. I have a Ruger 6 shot LCR 327, a EAA 6 shot 357 & my newest, a 4" Colt Python 357. The first 2 I can carry ITW & the Python I will carry using a sholder holster. Lastly,all of my Revolvers have better stopping power than my 9mm Glock.
So I've gone full cycle of carrying Revolvers then to Pistols then back to Revolvers.
Has anyone else have their Pistol jam on them?

Day and day out, at the end of the day the significant majority of "pistol problems" can be attributed to "shooter problems" in one way or another, followed by ammunition problems and then, lastly, actual "pistol problems".

Listening to many folks (engineers, techs, reps, etc) from some of the gun companies, as well as LE firearms instructors, this "ratio" can usually be broken down to fall along the lines of 95% shooters, 3% ammo and 2% pistols.

Now, being a long time revolver guy myself, and having carried issued revolvers back in the day, and having gone through one of the S&W revolver armorer classes, etc ...

... I'd not go out of my way to particularly disagree with someone who decides it's "better" for them to choose to carry a revolver as a dedicated personal defense weapon. However ...

... I'd also not express any particular shock to ever hear that the revolver carrier might someday discover, to his shock and dismay, that the long trigger recovery required for a DA revolver ended up being "short-stroked" by him under unexpected stress and duress. That's a bit of a sticky shooter-induced mechanical situation to resolve when the fur is flying and your trigger finger just keeps defaulting to CRUNCHING the jammed trigger mechanism, desperately hoping for a different result for each trigger press.

FWIW, while I still quite often choose to carry one of my many different pistols as retirement weapons (and over the years invested a respectable number of hours using them for training/drill and range qual hours), I still more often rely upon one of my several J-frames for retirement weapon roles. I spent ample years carrying belt holstered weapons to now enjoy being able to pocket-holster lighter wheelies.

Gotta go with what works for you.

I'd just not totally dismiss and ignore the idea of a shooter-induced functioning issue with a "reliable" revolver occurring under the worst of unexpected conditions, when time compresses and muscles may not want to easily relax from clenched states.

[RickB]

Quote:
Um, revolvers are pistols....
This is true. But from the time I was a kid growing up in the fifties, and for an awfully long time afterwards, the term "pistol" meant a semi-auto handgun and the term "revolver" meant, well, a revolver. Truth is, though, the term pistol does "technically" mean either a revolver and/or a semi-auto handgun. Still, old habits are hard to shuck...

Colt invented the thing, and called it a revolving pistol . . .

[TxFlyFish]

I was taught that everything is an AR15 and everything not AR15 is an AK47.

[ms6852]

In my more than 35 years of shooting revolvers I have yet to have a failure to fire or a timing issue. On my 22lr revolver a 617 S&W which is brand new I have shot more than 1500 rounds in a matter of 2 weeks and have yet to have a misfire using CCI and Aguila ammo. I did have to clean the 617 after 1000 rounds because the barrel leaded up and started to keyhole my shots at 3 yards.

I normally carry a 1911 both of mine are Springfields and I must honestly say that at the range I have had some failure to feed or fire about 6 times since I bought them more than 20 years ago. Luckily it has been at the range. My 686 or python has always worked flawlessly.

[MoArk Willy]

Originally Posted by TxFlyFish

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

Revolvers inherently are more accurate. They do not need multiple rounds to hit a target.

[Nanuk]

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

I have a S&W 686 no dash That I bought new in 1985 with probably close to 50k rounds thru it with no problems. Probable half full power magnums. I also have a S&W model 13-2 made in 1982 with probable 20K rounds thru it.

Heck I even have an old High Standard 22 LR from the 60's that has had no malfunctions. I have a Ruger Single six I bought new in 1975 that has many thousands of rounds thru it with no problems.

[44 AMP]

#1. No, actually the crud is to blame. Last I heard, humans didn't have telekinetic power to dictate where debris goes when a gun is fired.

It is the user's responsibility to do the maint. needed for the gun to function properly. No, we don't have the power to dictate where the debris goes, but we do have the power to clean it and even the power to chose an ammo that doesn't give us enough crud build up to be a problem during a course of fire.

And we have the power to learn approximately how many rounds of whatever you are using, that you can fire before lack of cleaning and/or lube will cause a malfunction. Few people do know, but that doesn't change their responsibility.

#3. How do you define crap ammo? I had a gun jam up on Lapua ammo. I don't consider Lapua crap ammo. Maybe you do. And yet, the gun didn't jam with Wolf and Tulammo. Does that make them premium ammo?

Aside from obvious physical defects, my standard for defining "crap ammo" is the same one the gun used. if it doesn't work in my gun, its crap. Doesn't matter who made it or how much, or how little I paid for it, if my gun won't run it, then for that gun, its crap.

And some guns are more picky than others about what they like, and what they don't. The pickiest seem to be rimfires, but centerfires have their quirks, too.

A gun that is sensitive to crud and ammo is not neccessarily operator error. Some guns can go thousands straight out of the box with no lube, no break in, no maintenance, no cleaning.

I disagree, to a degree. if the gun won't go "thousands of rounds" without lube, cleaning and any other required maintenance, it is the operator's responsibility to know that, and do the work needed to prevent failure. This is one of the things that should be learned during practice and training with your gun and ammo. Its more than just being able to get rounds on target in X amount of time. Its also about learning how to operate and care for the gun as you do it. Learning how to do things to minimize the negatives inherent in every mechanical system.

Learning how to work the gun so it works its best. In a way its like learning a standard transmission, getting the feel of the clutch, etc. There are several different ways one can operate it and shift gears, but some methods of operation are better than others.

Different cars and trucks have different "sweet spots" where things work their best, and so do firearms.

One time I found a .22 Luger at a gunshop. Gun looked 95% or better, but was priced well below usual market price. The shop owner was looking to sell it because he had briefly used it as one of his range rental pistols, and it was a "jammo-matic" so he was offering it at a discount.

I bit. Took it home, and sure enough, it jammed every 2-3 rounds. Then I OILED IT. Surprise, surprise it ran flawlessly through the couple hundred rounds I shot after that...and, its worked ok ever since. It just needed a little proper care and attention.

[ms6852]

Originally Posted by TxFlyFish

Can a revolver go thru 5 thousand rounds without a failure? 10k rounds?

You ever think that if the gun whether pistol or revolver does not go bang, it could be the round? Stuff happens!

[TxFlyFish]

Do you know how to determine if it’s faulty ammo? Do you think they include squibs in a reliability test?

[peterg7]

I’d have no concerns about that G19 as it’s earned it’s bonafides in many of LEO/ military holster around the world.

Your revolver selection suggests you’re more of a casual carrier so anything would serve you well.

I’ve only been a semi-auto guy since 03 and out of the half dozen or so I’ve possessed only a P-11 has given me pause and that was an accuracy issue.

If it wasn’t for my state passing CC in 04 I’d Probably still be a happy clam with just revolvers.


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[HighValleyRanch]

Your revolver selection suggests you’re more of a casual carrier so anything would serve you well.

That is quite an assumption on your part. So anyone who chooses to carry a revolver for CCW is not an "operator" in your view and only a casual carrier?

[dgludwig]

Revolvers inherently are more accurate.

What makes you think revolvers are "inherently more accurate?"

[44 AMP]

Revolvers inherently are more accurate.

Actually, the reverse is true, mechanically speaking. Revolvers are "inherently" less accurate, because you have 5 or 6 SEPARATE chambers, each one needing precise alignment with the single barrel.

The amazing thing is that revolvers shoot as well as they do, with multiple separate chambers, compared to a barrel with a single integral chamber.

The reason revolvers often outshoot service class semi autos had more to do with the tilt barrel lock up common to most of those guns. The single barrel and chamber move, in relation to the sights, (and the frame), and because tolerances are needed to allow for this, the barrel doesn't return to EXACTLY the same spot every single time.