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May 30, 2007, 10:10 AM | #76 | |||
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Slugthrower, thanks for the spirited passionate debate, it is healthy to share differing points, we can all grow from them.
Her are some humble opinions about wahat you had to say... Quote:
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Killing someone who is projecting serious harm or death on an innocent IS justified, morally and legally.
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May 30, 2007, 09:46 PM | #77 | ||
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As far as being smart, do you know what is required to be promoted to O-7 (BG) and above? As far as being smart is concerned, there is another Colonel that has written at length about armed combat, and that is Col. Charles Askins. Any comments about him? By the way, since you have seen "so many" men reach the rank of COL, what rank were you? Also, Quote:
By the way, the moves I mentioned can be done in about 15-20 seconds, if you move with a purpose. And what I said still stands. Hesitate or show fear, even for a second, and your adversary will be all over you. Just what I have learned from "other people's experiences".
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May 30, 2007, 10:13 PM | #78 |
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well said powderman
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June 1, 2007, 04:10 PM | #79 |
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would i
I'd be there in a heartbeat...that kind of B.S. doesn't happen down here in Texas. Once I got done with the carjacker, I just might have to knock some sense into those standing by...No excuse at all...I, too, would like to see how 5'9" slim build does against 6'3" 285 lb. ex-linebacker/farmboy turned bouncer.
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June 1, 2007, 04:47 PM | #80 | |
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Get involved but do foolishly put yourself in harm's way. |
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June 1, 2007, 10:01 PM | #81 |
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kcshooter, we have similar backgrounds as far as growing up on the wrong side of the tracks. Having lived the poor boy's life, it isn't easy. You are quite correct when you say, that when violence is required that it should be blindingly violent and without hesitation. You know as well as I do that guns aren't always the best means to put a person down. Sometimes one must get their hands bloody.
Col. Copper was indeed an intelligent man. Much of his writings are profound. This still gives no reason to place this man above all others. There are many others, such as Fairburn, Applegate, Skeeter, etc. that are as qualified to advise people on the use of firearms in combat and their effectiveness. I am in no way detracting from Col. Cooper. I am not a man of one book or of one experience. There many ways to skin a cat. Cooper's methods are but one way. Limiting one's solutions to a myriad of situations from one man's philosophy is folly. Yes, it may upset some folks to know that some others do not worship any man. That would be their problem. I wasn't a commissioned officer and wouldn't have wanted to be. If given the opportunity, I would have become a Warrant Officer, as their skills require a much more technical understanding than any general officer would most likely be capable of. Still, that is neither here nor there, as the Army wouldn't allow me to change MOS. The MOS I was in was a shortage MOS. Anyone that was an FO wasn't going to be able to change MOS period. So instead of getting screwed by the Army, I left them behind. No need to be used like a puppet. My ASVAB was 98%, GT 129, in addition to having an IQ of 136 on a max 143 scale. Would you say that those numbers make me a dull kitchen knife? I could have chosen any MOS in the enlisted ranks, and possibly became a CWO. That is if the Army hadn't put me in the worst unit in the entire army. How did I learn that my unit was the worst? The Army Times reported it in one of their posts. Luck of the draw I suppose. When it comes to officers, they come in many flavors, we had a Major, that barley spoke English, he kept trying to tell me how to operate the FBCB2 system in a particular manner that the system wasn't capable of. For some reason he thought that he knew more about it than a soldier that was trained in it's proper usage. I have seen far too many commissioned officers that were arrogant self import pricks, whom no one could convey to them their lack of understanding of a particular system and it's capabilities. So pardon me when I speak of personal experiences with commissioned officers. I bet you would have loved to find out that when on a road march that your CO was marching with a ruck sack full of pillows, while yours was over 100 lbs. Seems that my CO wanted to appear as if he was leading by example. So yes, I have a problem with deceptive, self righteous, officers that push pencils and like to think that they are tough as nails, when the real soldiers are in the enlisted ranks. The best commissioned officers that I ever had the pleasure to operate under were those that came from the enlisted ranks. The officers that come from cadet schools tend to not be as good. I hope that answers your questions. We may not all agree on the same philosophies, but we can agree that the POS, who was beating the old man, needed to have his skull caved in.
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June 1, 2007, 10:51 PM | #82 |
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How many 'read between the lines' pick ups did you fellow vets pick out of that last post?
The volumes of info people TELL while trying to SAY something else.
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June 2, 2007, 07:52 AM | #83 |
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Rank... Let's see. Does that fact that Audie Murphy was only a Second Lieutenant, U.S. Army, Company B, 15th Infantry, 3d Infantry Division, make him any less qualified to speak in comparison to Col. Cooper? But hey we are free to speak in America as we chose. How about Sgt York for those of us that only reached the NCO level.
Bruxley, read between those lines.
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June 2, 2007, 09:23 AM | #84 |
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I don't put Cooper above all others. There are alot of great teachers out there. But, if any professional has an opinion on a profound issue that sharply contrasts Cooper's, I would be very leery.
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June 2, 2007, 10:44 AM | #85 |
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Well, I am misinterpreting a previous statement then. Either way it is just an opinion. The hardest thing to convey is tone of reply. We all get worked up sometimes. That is when I will use exclamation points, otherwise there isn't any malice intended in my replies. Relax guys, the Internet isn't a very good medium to convey a persons demeanor. My being blunt isn't graceful by any means, but that is what I have to work with, you guys should be able to understand. Too bad we can't use voice communications. Then it would be a little easier to convey. Wish you folks well. Bear with me please, sometimes it isn't easy to make a statement that is pleasing to all.
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History is a freak show and a dark comedy. Mankind is a spectacle all to itself. Play your role, let the jesters play theirs. In the end...who has the last laugh? |
June 2, 2007, 10:45 AM | #86 | ||
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Quote:
Here's what I said in response to the statement that you should run up and attack the attacker physically: Quote:
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June 2, 2007, 10:58 AM | #87 |
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I see, easy enough. Thanks for the correction. I guess, being a hands on type. I am a little rash. Still it has worked for me many times. It would be much better if men had to fight with swords and shields as opposed to firearms, as many would be less inclined to engage in war or unadulterated violence of any kind, IMO. There are many people who just want to get through life the easy way. Sometimes the choices are not so easy. I suppose what I am saying in the least words is... Do what works for you and don't expect to come out of any fight unscathed, no matter the method used to win that fight.
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History is a freak show and a dark comedy. Mankind is a spectacle all to itself. Play your role, let the jesters play theirs. In the end...who has the last laugh? |
June 2, 2007, 01:39 PM | #88 |
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I love the discussions in this thread. Lots of thoughts here. I have to admit one thing. While I couldn't pull it off, if you ran up to that guy and started pummeling him, I bet it would have been the surprise of his life! That alone would have given anyone quite an advantage, at least initially. What would happen next just has too many variables to figure.
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June 2, 2007, 04:48 PM | #89 |
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OK, I HAVE to comment even though those that have been in and are in already know this. The disrespect paid here toward commisioned officers and the military (Army in this case) is chompin at me.
Those how are considering enlistment or a commision I'd like you to know that commisioned officers are rarely bugs. The few that are can be found in charge of bug units where the other bugs serve untill they inevitably prove they can't or refuse to find thier place in the community and are seperated. Virtually every installation of much size has one of these units. The military is just that, a community. One STRUCTURED to perform the difficult to impossible. Every single member has a function and every single part is needed for the whole to perform. Team players with an ability to see beyond themselves can thrive there and will. Obviously, this community and culture are not for everyone. But it is not the role of the military or it's officers to mold to individuals emotional or psycological needs or desires, quite the opposite. A person needs to see themselves as a part of the whole. Given enough time, experience, and observation, it becomes very clear why everything is done the way it is. In fact, it becomes obvious how important the structure is. Enlisted make it all a reality. They are accountable only to an Officer for thier own role and the role of the few below them if any. You only need to volunteer. Commisioned Officers are the drive. They are commision by Congress. They are accountable for the life and role of every enlisted man under them and any Jr. Officers. They are accountable to the point of inprisonment for those that serve under them. They are held to a FAR higher standard. They are required to prove self relience, self discipline, and goal oriented achievement. This is typically done by achieving a bachelors degree but field commisioned officers still exist. Warrent Officers, actually Chief Warrent Officers come from senior enlisted ranks, must be an E-6 to apply, still have to attend OCS, and are considered the experts of the military on the military. All that said, I cannot stomach slander of any of the Branches or stations of service. Freedom of expression about these branches and stations is gauranteed by them. This gaurantee is DAMN grueling, lonely, painfull, heartrending, and hard fought to maintain. Those that do it and ask for nothing. The doing is enough. Take it for granted and slander em anyway. I'm alive. Many are not. Is respect too much to ask?
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June 2, 2007, 05:23 PM | #90 |
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Nope, it sure isn't Bruxley. That respect is demanded of the soldier while in service. I know it may eat at you sir. Just know that I do respect them, even if I may not like them. Just as your Drill instructor/Sergeant may have said to you or any other recruit. " You may not like me, but you will respect me. " When in service one must conform to the structure of command. When out of the service we are free to speak our minds. One of the hardest things for people to do, is to agree to disagree. One thing you can be sure of. We all know, or at least should know, that service to one's country isn't easy and any who have served with honor deserve that respect for their service.
Relax man, don't let me get under your skin. If you do that, you have given me control over your mind and actions. I know you are tougher than that, besides I wouldn't want to take credit for doing such a thing as that. Make it a great day and if it makes you happy draw a self conceived picture of me and blast it to ribbons. I respect you for standing up for what you believe Sir.
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History is a freak show and a dark comedy. Mankind is a spectacle all to itself. Play your role, let the jesters play theirs. In the end...who has the last laugh? |
June 2, 2007, 06:57 PM | #91 | |||||
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Is it possible for you to simply pick up your trash without a thinly veiled sarcastic comment to sneekingly drop more? I know 1st ups often can't cope with the emotional sacrices that are bound to arise from isolation from thier homes. Cheating wives/girlfriends, ill family members, friends and family in trouble, etc. These are the most common resons for UAs. The Red Cross is the mechanism the military relys upon to notify them of the emergencies that would require the presence of a service member. And every command heads thier recomndations and accomodates if at all poss. If you have had an admin seperation I feel for you. I'm sure it is a hard thing to carry. I encourge you to find new service. The military isn't the only place to make a difference in this world. Enough with the jabs though. The Army, Officers, or any of us didn't bring the to your door. you decsions did. So, please, enough garbage on sacred soil. BTW, Dignify your reply by causing it to lack the sneaky drop of more trash if you can, if not then a reply need not be made.
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If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Last edited by Bruxley; June 2, 2007 at 07:52 PM. |
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June 5, 2007, 01:27 AM | #92 |
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None then.
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If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. |
June 5, 2007, 04:54 PM | #93 | |
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June 5, 2007, 05:01 PM | #94 | |
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June 6, 2007, 09:03 PM | #95 |
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I probably would have gotten involved. I've done it before, usually just a harsh word to make the BG leave, but if not..........well the idea of breaking his knee and using the door on his head when he goes down sounds rather exciting after viewing the video, and seeing the beaten and bruised victim's interview.
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