Stupid Horders...

[JeepHammer]

I buy local when I can,
So the gun shop calls and says they got 10 bricks of small rifle primers...
I get dressed for the weather, get lunch, show up at the gun shop, and all 10 bricks are gone!

The guy also bought up all 10 bricks of .22 Long Rifle ammo that came in.

It will probably show up at the local gun show next weekend for 1,000% increase in price...

One of the kids that work in the shop says he didn't know I was on the way, and sold the entire 10 bricks to the same guy...

The same thing happened about 3 weeks ago, that's why I had my name on the 'Call Me' list in the first place.

At one point, you could only buy one BOX (100 Primers) at a time to keep the horders from sucking up everything as soon as they came in.

The owner says they have guys that will follow the UPS truck into the shop and buy up anything they have...

Anyone else having this problem during reloading season?

[lamarw]

Would it of made any difference if five people had shown up and bought it all while you were having lunch?

How much would you of bought if it were all there when you got there?

I hardly ever buy ammunition, but I do buy large quantities of powder, primers, brass and bullets when I buy. I do not consider myself a hoarder. Another Forum Member just reported he bought $600.00 worth of various reloading powders. Is that person a hoarder? I think not.

It is the American system with freedoms many of us fought for to preserve. It is the choice of your LGS as to how they sell their merchandise.

Lets all hope availability continues to improve.

[McCarthy]

If you want to blame somebody, blame the manufacturers. They should have adjusted to demand 100% a long time ago!

[Nick_C_S]

If you want to blame somebody, blame the manufacturers. They should have adjusted to demand 100% a long time ago!

If only it were that easy.

The business decision to increase capacity is a huge one for most companies. The capital outlay and bureaucracy is immense. Especially when the current condition is mostly viewed as temporary. I don't have a business degree and I'm sure others can explain it in much better detail. But basically I'm pretty sure most manufacturers aren't willing to take the business risk at this time. I'm with you: I wish they would increase production capacity - but I understand their reluctance.

That said, I believe I read somewhere that Sierra has increased capacity (opened a new facility, I think). And my LGS seems to have a lot more Sierra bullets as of late - a lot more of their distinctive "green boxes" on the shelves.

[WVsig]

If only it were that easy.

The business decision to increase capacity is a huge one for most companies. The capital outlay and bureaucracy is immense. Especially when the current condition is mostly viewed as temporary. I don't have a business degree and I'm sure others can explain it in much better detail. But basically I'm pretty sure most manufacturers aren't willing to take the business risk at this time. I'm with you: I wish they would increase production capacity - but I understand their reluctance.

That said, I believe I read somewhere that Sierra has increased capacity (opened a new facility, I think). And my LGS seems to have a lot more Sierra bullets as of late - a lot more of their distinctive "green boxes" on the shelves.

It is all about ROI. Return on investment. How much is it going to cost you upfront and how long is it going to take to make it back and then turn a profit.

I believe that the shortages we are seeing are not going to last forever. I cannot remember the name right off the top of my head but one of the powder houses had a fire and are are now just getting back online. Add this to the panic buying of the last 6 years and you are an artificially inflate picture of the reloading market.

Many people moved to reloading because of the factory ammo panics of the same time frame. In both areas outside of 22lr you are seeing things get back to normal. Another exception is the M855 craziness but that will end one way or another soon enough.

When you look at todays market you cannot use it to predict the future because today's data is inflated IMHO. From there you have to also consider that max demand allows for higher prices per unit. More capacity might be good for the consumer but is but always good for the manufacturer or the market in general. Too much capacity is worse then under capacity.

[skizzums]

I am sorry, I am just really surprised that primers are an issue for anyone anymore. you can go to grafs.com or many others and buy a zillion at a cheaper cost to offset the 25$ shipping fee. but primers have been in stock EVERYWHERE here for a long time now, even the big box stores like academy sell them for 39$ a case. as for the "hoarder", sounds like he just got him about 6 months worth so he doesn't have to drive back up there every month. no one is going to make money buying up primers and reselling them at a mark-up with all the websites having constant sales on primers right now....22LR is different story.

[Doyle]

Nick_C_S has it right. Manufacturers can increase production only so much (by adding shifts, etc.) before they have to invest big bucks in permanent capacity additions. They have to be convinced those investments will pay off over a long period.

The place where manufacturers have totally missed the boat is .22LR. I'm wondering how long it will take them to realize that the increase in demand for rimfire is a permanent shift. I personally believe that much of this increase is due to the very recent explosion in sales of high-capacity .22LR AR-type firearms. In the days of a 15rnd tube fed magazine, a typical shooter would shoot a box or two at the range and then go home. With the high-capacity .22s, they can go through that much in a matter of minutes. Hopefully, the manufacturers will soon recognize this and plan their production accordingly.

[serf 'rett]

...they have guys that will follow the UPS truck into the shop and buy up anything they have...

You snooze, you lose - otherwise called a free market economy. I actually doff my hat to the dedication of the folks who put in the time and effort of watching for the UPS trucks. And how do we define “hoarder”? Someone who bought what the store offered to sell? Someone who got what they felt they needed to be prepared just in case they couldn’t get the item again? Would the person marking up the product for resale at the local gun show be a rip off artist or a shrewd entrepreneur? I guess it depend on one’s point of view.

In times of shortage it may be necessary to develop other sources of supply, cultivate relationships and keep a weather eye out for UPS trucks. The rifle primers are available online. Don’t want to pay the Hazmat fees? Perhaps you could put together a group purchase to spread the cost.

[Snyper]

So the gun shop calls and says they got 10 bricks of small rifle primers...

The smart reply would have been, "Hold X number of boxes for me, and here's my CC number".

Cash in the store trumps anyone not there

You had a chance to buy it first, and chose to dally

[Clark]

22 ammo has taken a long time and is still price a 3X fair price.

I think the reasons it has taken too long are:
1) Cheap compared to disposable income
2) Easy to store
3) Consumption is normally small for average gun owner
4) Manufacturers did not tool up for more, but just ran 3 shifts of production in reaction to increased demand.

So If I have 2,000 rounds and fire 20 rounds per year, I have 100 years worth of ammo.
Then the panic starts, and at 3 cents a shot, I can double my stash for $60.

So the market expects to supply me with 20 rounds/year, a panic starts, they staff up to supply me with 60 rounds per year, but I order 2,000 rounds.

That situation, if repeated by every schmuck like me, will take 30 years to settle out.

[McCarthy]

If only it were that easy.

The business decision to increase capacity is a huge one for most companies. The capital outlay and bureaucracy is immense. Especially when the current condition is mostly viewed as temporary. I don't have a business degree and I'm sure others can explain it in much better detail. But basically I'm pretty sure most manufacturers aren't willing to take the business risk at this time. I'm with you: I wish they would increase production capacity - but I understand their reluctance.

That said, I believe I read somewhere that Sierra has increased capacity (opened a new facility, I think). And my LGS seems to have a lot more Sierra bullets as of late - a lot more of their distinctive "green boxes" on the shelves.

I have that degree in business administration (and 2 more). I also own an international operating company with offices and warehouses in North America and Europe. If we (as a company) would act as slowly as the US ammunition industry on increasing demand we would have been off the screen a long time ago. This is not a short term spike or a seasonal issue. I know people getting into guns that used to be the average libtard.

[Gravedigger56]

Early bird catches the worm. Just next time don't take a timeout to eat it.

[TimSr]

We've had every primer available and on the shelves at the stores here for quite some time, along with falling prices. I can't imagine it being a supply problem for primers at this point, and I sure can't imagine making money hoarding them. I'm still not seeing large inventories of .22, but I am seeing inventories.

[KEYBEAR]

I agree if I need Powder/Primers/Bullets and they are hard to find if I have an opportunity I buy . You should of said I will buy X amount and gave a CC number and a time to pick up . I do hope it was a nice lunch .

[weedsnager]

Like everyone else has stated, how hungry were you that you had to go out to lunch first? If the store has a rare item for sale that everyone and their cousin wants to buy why didn't you go to the store immediately ?

[Pathfinder45]

I feel for ya, JeepHammer. But there are lessons to be learned from this so you don't let it happen again. You had every advantage in the fact that they called you to give you a heads-up. While on the phone, did you not ask them to hold some back for you as you were hastening on your way? I can't believe you ate lunch! You must not have really needed the ammo and primers. They told you they had primers, ammo and such, but you had other priorities. You have only yourself to blame.
Eating is way over-rated in this country.........

[sawdustdad]

I just got back from a lunch time trip to Green Top in Ashland, VA. Large retailer, long local history.

I almost had a stroke while there.

For the first time in a year, there was a large supply of Alliant pistol powder--1lb and 8lb jugs of Bullseye, Red Dot, Promo, Unique, Power Pistol, as well as 800x, 700x, AR Comp, BLC2, BE86, , etc. etc.

I didn't buy any because you guys made me feel like a hoarder!

If they had had either W748 or H4895, I would have purchased. Had neither. But lots of other IMR rifle powders--4198, 3031, 4064 etc. and some W760.

Now I'm having convulsions... maybe I need to stop by there on the way home...just one 8lb jug of Bullseye... I can always use that, right?

Right?

Just a couple more pounds of Unique...

[45_auto]

Originally Posted by jeephammer

Stupid Horders...

Oh the irony ..... if you're going to call them names, at least spell it correctly!

Originally Posted by mccarthy

I have that degree in business administration (and 2 more). I also own an international operating company with offices and warehouses in North America and Europe. If we (as a company) would act as slowly as the US ammunition industry on increasing demand we would have been off the screen a long time ago. This is not a short term spike or a seasonal issue. I know people getting into guns that used to be the average libtard.

It appears that you don't believe that the ammo companies have reacted as quickly as they could (within financial reason) to the demand for .22 ammo. Is there some reason that you believe that they don't like making more money?

[salvadore]

Tough room.

[Snyper]

I also own an international operating company with offices and warehouses in North America and Europe

What does your company manufacture?

[Fox84]

I buy two bricks of primers every gun show I go to. They are $30 a brick as opposed to $40 locally. I have all the primers and powder I can store. It's bullets I struggle to catch a deal on these days.

[RickB]

Stupid Horders...

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I buy local when I can,
So the gun shop calls and says they got 10 bricks of small rifle primers...
I get dressed for the weather, get lunch, show up at the gun shop, and all 10 bricks are gone!

The guy also bought up all 10 bricks of .22 Long Rifle ammo that came in.

It will probably show up at the local gun show next weekend for 1,000% increase in price...

Didn't you hear; the shortage is over.
A guy posted on another forum that .22 rimfire is available in my city for seven cents a round. I haven't seen a round for less than ten cents in three or four years, and prior to seeing two boxes at that price very recently, it was closer to fifteen cents.
Nothing on the shelves, but they tell me when they get their ammo deliveries, so I can stand in line when the doors open.

[Pathfinder45]

If you needed 748 you should buy that BLC2. It's almost the same thing, maybe better.

[Salmoneye]

Here we go again...

[jrobin3360]

from: Pathfinder45

Priorities?

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I feel for ya, JeepHammer. But there are lessons to be learned from this so you don't let it happen again. You had every advantage in the fact that they called you to give you a heads-up. While on the phone, did you not ask them to hold some back for you as you were hastening on your way? I can't believe you ate lunch! You must not have really needed the ammo and primers. They told you they had primers, ammo and such, but you had other priorities. You have only yourself to blame.
Eating is way over-rated in this country.........

Hmmm, cheeseburgers (of which there is an abundance of) or reloading supplies (which tend to disappear from shelves as quick as they appear).

Which to get first?

Looks like the cheeseburgers have a higher priority.

Your failure to follow the "7P's" bit you in your cheeseburger storage.