ar 15 for whitetail...

zachkuby87 · August 13, 2011, 10:02 PM

First off this isnt a thread asking if i should or should not use .223 for deer because im going to ive made up my mind. what im looking for are suggestions on parts lowers uppers barrels sites the whole 9 yards. i plan on building said rifle from the ground up myself. ive already gotten a hold of a local gunsmith that has a nice collection of ar 15's and knows them well and hes going to go through the finished product and make sure everything is put together correctly and functioning properly before i shoot it. now where i hunt there are very few shots taken at over 50-60 yards thats why im confident in the .223 being able to do its job i should be able to take very accurate shots at such a short distance. now for the ar. so say you were going to build a rifle for hunting what parts would you use? i would like to keep around 800-900 dollars but im willing to spend more if needed as im buying parts one at a time i wont be ordering everything and putting it all together at once i have until november to finish it so no huge rush. so to you ar guru's what parts do i need to make an accurate reliable deer rifle? websites and links to specific parts would be awesome. thanks ahead of time

Jim243 · August 13, 2011, 11:01 PM

Zack

I know you don't want to hear it, but purchase a 6.8 Remington SPC upper. If you were looking for deer in the 100 to 140 lbs range I would say sure use a 223. But we both know MN deer are going to run bigger than that. Take a min. and check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.8_mm_Remington_SPC

It will better serve what you want to do with your rifle.

Jim

T. O'Heir · August 13, 2011, 11:35 PM

"...confident in the .223 being able to do its job..." With the right bullet and rifling twist for heavy bullets, sure. Most factory ammo is loaded with varmint bullets though. Varmint bullets are not suitable for deer sized game.
Of course, using a .223 for deer has to be legal.

mc223 · August 13, 2011, 11:50 PM

I use my AR in Wisconsin. Shots are generally not more than around 30 yds and Fed Fusion 62g will do a very good job.
The deer are bigger up here than some places in the country but they are not made of some bullet resistant hide. 223 will do just fine. In general a 100 yd shot would not be an issue. I am personally not confident in my ability with all the variables like frickin cold with huge gloves while sitting in a tree and a brisk 30mph breeze to attempt any longer shots.

T. O'Heir · August 14, 2011, 12:00 AM

"I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you." Hurt my ribs laughing.

zachkuby87 · August 14, 2011, 12:04 AM

So does anyone have suggestions as to which parts I need to use?

salvadore · August 14, 2011, 12:08 AM

I've killed two mule deer with an SP-1 using 335 and a jacketed soft point 55gr bullet and one mule deer with a Ruger #1 using the same load. One quartering away at point blank range, one broadside at about 150yds and one facing at about 50 or so yds. I think the .223 is a great deer cartridge.

mc223 · August 14, 2011, 12:11 AM

Use the best you can afford and learn to shoot very well. Brand names are your preference, It is your money after all. My rifle is a S&W M&P15 16in with a reflex red dot for sighting. Works for me, light weight and quick. I use a single point sling so the rifle is at the ready.

T. O'Heir · August 14, 2011, 12:21 AM

"...which parts I need to use?..." As mentioned, it's about your budget. If your smithy is as good as he says listen to him. In any case, for deer, it's not about the rifle. It's about the bullet and how well you can shoot it. You'll need to either work up a load with suitable bullets or try a box of as many brands, using suitable bullets, as you can to find the most accurate ammo for your rifle.
In all likelihood, if the guy hasn't already started building the rifle, it won't be ready for this year's deer season anyway. Having a rifle built takes time from a reputable smithy. A year isn't unusual. Busy bunch of guys.

Clark · August 14, 2011, 02:53 AM

For 5 years I have been shooting at white tails as they bounce and getting nothing.

I can easily fill the freezer with mule deer broadside shots a half hour before dawn, but I am challenged by the white tail.

I have two spots where I know exactly where the white tails will be hiding, I am ready, they jump up in front of me, and start bouncing. Mostly I don't even get off a shot with my M70 270 or Ruger #1 7mmMag.

But this year, I am taking an AR15 with tracers.

shurshot · August 14, 2011, 05:15 AM

After reading these posts, I feel obsolete with my Grandfather's old lever action Winchester. Good thing the deer don't read...

darkgael · August 14, 2011, 05:26 AM

Quote:

which parts I need to use?

You are complicating a simple issue. Any AR variant will work for the job as described. Probably the only detail that may need attention is rifling twist. If it were me, I'd want a twist that will stabilize the best bullet for the job and I'd want that bullet to be the heaviest suitable bullet available.

Quote:

it's not about the rifle. It's about the bullet and how well you can shoot it

+1. Glad T. O'Heir wrote that.
The real issue is ammunition not firearm. What is the best bullet and load combination for hunting Whitetails in your neck of the woods? Once your have that dialed in, any decent AR will work.
It's not like you want to shoot Xring groups at 600 yards.
Pete

Palmetto-Pride · August 14, 2011, 08:21 AM

I would find the heaviest bullet I could and a barrel that will stabilize it. I would put most of the attention into the upper (handguards that freefloat the barrel) any decent lower will set off the bullet in the upper.

stevelyn · August 14, 2011, 09:19 AM

Neighbor lady routinely whacks caribou at 200yrds with a .223.

Abel · August 14, 2011, 09:43 AM

Quote:

But this year, I am taking an AR15 with tracers.

What? I hope you're just kiddin'.

Quote:

You are complicating a simple issue. Any AR variant will work for the job as described. Probably the only detail that may need attention is rifling twist. If it were me, I'd want a twist that will stabilize the best bullet for the job and I'd want that bullet to be the heaviest suitable bullet available.

I think that a partition bullet would be great for deer under 200 yards with a 223.

Wyosmith · August 14, 2011, 09:55 AM

If you are going to buy "parts" I would heartily suggest you buy the ones to make a 6.8SPC upper. I have used them to kill a lot of deer and antelope in Wyoming and Montana, and they work VERY well. The benefit is ballistics very much like a 257 Roberts, which makes it both effective and LEGAL in ever state that you can hunt with an AR.

CPTMurdoc30 · August 14, 2011, 10:46 AM

Any upper and lower just about.

Get a DPMS lower parts kit.
Your desired hand guard.
Your desired stock.
Your desired pistol grip.
Daniel Defense 16" barrel

Put it all together and go out and put some meat in the freezer.

chris in va · August 14, 2011, 11:05 AM

Starting in 2008, MN allowed 220 and above to be used for deer.

I be he · August 14, 2011, 12:19 PM

I dont believe its going to matter which parts you use. Im saying go with the least expensive

My stock Stag with a 3x9 will shoot 2" groups at 200yrds with a trigger thats makes my glocks seem like theyre match grade.

kozak6 · August 14, 2011, 12:29 PM

I'd say to focus on light weight so it's nicer to carry. Since you are only taking 50-60 yard shots, a 12 pound target rifle is not what you want.

So yeah, a lightweight barrel with a twist rate suitable for the bullet you intend to shoot would be fine. I don't really think the rest matters all that much.

What were you thinking about sights?

chadstrickland · August 14, 2011, 01:11 PM

as far as parts go, order you a brownells catalog and pick out the ones you like then look and see how much they weigh and then post aa list of the selected parts and get reviews and if you like what you see....shop around other places and see if you can find the stuff cheaper

tahunua001 · August 14, 2011, 01:46 PM

you can take a 250 pound WT with an AR no problem so dont listen the the 6.8 chest thumpers. blackthorn has good complete parts kits for cheap. some people knock them but they ship almost instantly, they have great customer service and I've mixed so many parts with my brothers DPMS sportical that we no longer know who has the factory DPMS and who has the blackthorn kit built on a DPMS lower so people that say that the parts are poorly fitted dont know what they are talking about. mine has a badger ordnance stabilizer handguard that greatly increases accuracy and stability. add a nice nikon prostaff and it's a deer slayer. the handguard is a little hard to come by, I think they are revamping the design because badgerordnance.com lists them as "temporarily discontinued"

Abel · August 14, 2011, 02:10 PM

Quote:

you can take a 250 pound WT with an AR no problem so dont listen the the 6.8 chest thumpers

I don't understand this statement. The AR15 comes in 6.8SPC. What do you mean? Did you mean to say, "You can take a 250 pound WT with a 223 no problem so don't listen the the 6.8 chest thumpers"? Help me out here.

chadstrickland · August 14, 2011, 06:27 PM

Abel....I believe he ment that the ar15 original and intended caliber is 223 or really 5.56.
the 6.8, 6.5 grendal, 243, or any other calibers are not originally what the rifle was intended to shoot. Or so I believe, I may be 100% wrong

zachkuby87 · August 14, 2011, 06:41 PM

just ordered a brownells catalog and ive narrowed it down to a few parts. or i may just buy a s&w m&p 15 i really like them just to get around all the bs. my only thing im having a hard time figuring out the whole twist rate thing. so correct me if im wrong but from my understanding im going to want a 1in7 or 1in8 twist rate because it can stabilize a heavier bullet that im going to wanna shoot with. now the m&p 15 i want uses a 1in9 twist rate is there that big of a difference or? for sights i think some plain jane quality iron sites will suit me just fine i because have perfect vision that and when i use a scope i end up staring through it for 30 seconds trying to line up the PERFECT shot where with iron sites i usually take the shot within 5-6 seconds because i just aim for the kill zone and let one fly 9 times out of ten the deer drops where it stands the rest of the time i usually find it within a few hundred feet ive only lost one deer due to an angry farmer that wouldnt let me onto his land to track it down i probably could have just went in got it and left without him ever knowing but i believe you should never enter someones property without permission and i even marked where the deer went in with an orange flag so he could find it and the meat wouldnt go to waste. sure enough i drove by his place 15 minutes later and saw him in his orange with a rifle over his shoulder tracking my deer.. oh well sorry for rambling but if your were me would you go with the m&p15 with the 1in9 or build one with a 1in7 barrel? i really wanna get this right.

August 13, 2011, 11:01 PM	#2
Jim243 Senior Member Join Date: January 5, 2009 Location: Just off Route 66 Posts: 5,067	Zack I know you don't want to hear it, but purchase a 6.8 Remington SPC upper. If you were looking for deer in the 100 to 140 lbs range I would say sure use a 223. But we both know MN deer are going to run bigger than that. Take a min. and check this out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.8_mm_Remington_SPC It will better serve what you want to do with your rifle. Jim __________________ Si vis pacem, para bellum Last edited by Jim243; August 13, 2011 at 11:09 PM.

August 13, 2011, 11:35 PM	#3
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...confident in the .223 being able to do its job..." With the right bullet and rifling twist for heavy bullets, sure. Most factory ammo is loaded with varmint bullets though. Varmint bullets are not suitable for deer sized game. Of course, using a .223 for deer has to be legal. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

August 13, 2011, 11:50 PM	#4
mc223 Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2007 Location: n/w Wisconsin Posts: 365	I use my AR in Wisconsin. Shots are generally not more than around 30 yds and Fed Fusion 62g will do a very good job. The deer are bigger up here than some places in the country but they are not made of some bullet resistant hide. 223 will do just fine. In general a 100 yd shot would not be an issue. I am personally not confident in my ability with all the variables like frickin cold with huge gloves while sitting in a tree and a brisk 30mph breeze to attempt any longer shots. __________________ . I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you. 0° 5150

August 14, 2011, 12:00 AM	#5
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you." Hurt my ribs laughing. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

August 14, 2011, 12:11 AM	#8
mc223 Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2007 Location: n/w Wisconsin Posts: 365	Use the best you can afford and learn to shoot very well. Brand names are your preference, It is your money after all. My rifle is a S&W M&P15 16in with a reflex red dot for sighting. Works for me, light weight and quick. I use a single point sling so the rifle is at the ready. __________________ . I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you. 0° 5150

August 13, 2011, 10:02 PM	#1
zachkuby87 Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2010 Location: st paul mn Posts: 190	ar 15 for whitetail... First off this isnt a thread asking if i should or should not use .223 for deer because im going to ive made up my mind. what im looking for are suggestions on parts lowers uppers barrels sites the whole 9 yards. i plan on building said rifle from the ground up myself. ive already gotten a hold of a local gunsmith that has a nice collection of ar 15's and knows them well and hes going to go through the finished product and make sure everything is put together correctly and functioning properly before i shoot it. now where i hunt there are very few shots taken at over 50-60 yards thats why im confident in the .223 being able to do its job i should be able to take very accurate shots at such a short distance. now for the ar. so say you were going to build a rifle for hunting what parts would you use? i would like to keep around 800-900 dollars but im willing to spend more if needed as im buying parts one at a time i wont be ordering everything and putting it all together at once i have until november to finish it so no huge rush. so to you ar guru's what parts do i need to make an accurate reliable deer rifle? websites and links to specific parts would be awesome. thanks ahead of time

August 14, 2011, 12:04 AM	#6
zachkuby87 Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2010 Location: st paul mn Posts: 190	So does anyone have suggestions as to which parts I need to use?

August 14, 2011, 12:08 AM	#7
salvadore Junior member Join Date: January 1, 2007 Location: Idaho Posts: 2,282	I've killed two mule deer with an SP-1 using 335 and a jacketed soft point 55gr bullet and one mule deer with a Ruger #1 using the same load. One quartering away at point blank range, one broadside at about 150yds and one facing at about 50 or so yds. I think the .223 is a great deer cartridge.

August 14, 2011, 12:21 AM	#9
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...which parts I need to use?..." As mentioned, it's about your budget. If your smithy is as good as he says listen to him. In any case, for deer, it's not about the rifle. It's about the bullet and how well you can shoot it. You'll need to either work up a load with suitable bullets or try a box of as many brands, using suitable bullets, as you can to find the most accurate ammo for your rifle. In all likelihood, if the guy hasn't already started building the rifle, it won't be ready for this year's deer season anyway. Having a rifle built takes time from a reputable smithy. A year isn't unusual. Busy bunch of guys. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

August 14, 2011, 02:53 AM	#10
Clark Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 1999 Location: WA, the ever blue state Posts: 4,678	For 5 years I have been shooting at white tails as they bounce and getting nothing. I can easily fill the freezer with mule deer broadside shots a half hour before dawn, but I am challenged by the white tail. I have two spots where I know exactly where the white tails will be hiding, I am ready, they jump up in front of me, and start bouncing. Mostly I don't even get off a shot with my M70 270 or Ruger #1 7mmMag. But this year, I am taking an AR15 with tracers. __________________ The word 'forum" does not mean "not criticizing books." "Ad hominem fallacy" is not the same as point by point criticism of books. If you bought the book, and believe it all, it may FEEL like an ad hominem attack, but you might strive to accept other points of view may exist. Are we a nation of competing ideas, or a nation of forced conformity of thought?

August 14, 2011, 05:15 AM	#11
shurshot Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2006 Posts: 1,819	After reading these posts, I feel obsolete with my Grandfather's old lever action Winchester. Good thing the deer don't read...

August 14, 2011, 08:21 AM	#13
Palmetto-Pride Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2009 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 2,071	I would find the heaviest bullet I could and a barrel that will stabilize it. I would put most of the attention into the upper (handguards that freefloat the barrel) any decent lower will set off the bullet in the upper. __________________ “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.” -Margaret Thatcher-

August 14, 2011, 09:19 AM	#14
stevelyn Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2004 Location: Fairbanksan in exile to Aleutian Hell Posts: 2,655	Neighbor lady routinely whacks caribou at 200yrds with a .223. __________________ Stop Allowing Our Schools To Be Soft Targets! http://fastersaveslives.org/ East Moose. Wear Wolf.

August 14, 2011, 09:55 AM	#16
Wyosmith Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2010 Location: Shoshoni Wyoming Posts: 2,713	If you are going to buy "parts" I would heartily suggest you buy the ones to make a 6.8SPC upper. I have used them to kill a lot of deer and antelope in Wyoming and Montana, and they work VERY well. The benefit is ballistics very much like a 257 Roberts, which makes it both effective and LEGAL in ever state that you can hunt with an AR.

August 14, 2011, 10:46 AM	#17
CPTMurdoc30 Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2008 Location: Stafford VA Posts: 969	Any upper and lower just about. Get a DPMS lower parts kit. Your desired hand guard. Your desired stock. Your desired pistol grip. Daniel Defense 16" barrel Put it all together and go out and put some meat in the freezer. __________________ Solving Virginia's Ground Hog problems 50gr at a time.....

August 14, 2011, 11:05 AM	#18
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Starting in 2008, MN allowed 220 and above to be used for deer.

August 14, 2011, 12:19 PM	#19
I be he Member Join Date: July 30, 2011 Posts: 20	I dont believe its going to matter which parts you use. Im saying go with the least expensive My stock Stag with a 3x9 will shoot 2" groups at 200yrds with a trigger thats makes my glocks seem like theyre match grade.

August 14, 2011, 12:29 PM	#20
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	I'd say to focus on light weight so it's nicer to carry. Since you are only taking 50-60 yard shots, a 12 pound target rifle is not what you want. So yeah, a lightweight barrel with a twist rate suitable for the bullet you intend to shoot would be fine. I don't really think the rest matters all that much. What were you thinking about sights?

August 14, 2011, 01:11 PM	#21
chadstrickland Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2011 Location: alabama Posts: 537	happy to see another 223 fan out there as far as parts go, order you a brownells catalog and pick out the ones you like then look and see how much they weigh and then post aa list of the selected parts and get reviews and if you like what you see....shop around other places and see if you can find the stuff cheaper __________________ Two weapons that was designed by the same man still in use by the us military 100 years later...1911 and m2...is there anything that comes close.....lol annd maybe perhaps a sig sauer p226 tac ops edition..

August 14, 2011, 01:46 PM	#22
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	you can take a 250 pound WT with an AR no problem so dont listen the the 6.8 chest thumpers. blackthorn has good complete parts kits for cheap. some people knock them but they ship almost instantly, they have great customer service and I've mixed so many parts with my brothers DPMS sportical that we no longer know who has the factory DPMS and who has the blackthorn kit built on a DPMS lower so people that say that the parts are poorly fitted dont know what they are talking about. mine has a badger ordnance stabilizer handguard that greatly increases accuracy and stability. add a nice nikon prostaff and it's a deer slayer. the handguard is a little hard to come by, I think they are revamping the design because badgerordnance.com lists them as "temporarily discontinued" __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

August 14, 2011, 06:27 PM	#24
chadstrickland Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2011 Location: alabama Posts: 537	Abel....I believe he ment that the ar15 original and intended caliber is 223 or really 5.56. the 6.8, 6.5 grendal, 243, or any other calibers are not originally what the rifle was intended to shoot. Or so I believe, I may be 100% wrong __________________ Two weapons that was designed by the same man still in use by the us military 100 years later...1911 and m2...is there anything that comes close.....lol annd maybe perhaps a sig sauer p226 tac ops edition..

August 14, 2011, 06:41 PM	#25
zachkuby87 Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2010 Location: st paul mn Posts: 190	just ordered a brownells catalog and ive narrowed it down to a few parts. or i may just buy a s&w m&p 15 i really like them just to get around all the bs. my only thing im having a hard time figuring out the whole twist rate thing. so correct me if im wrong but from my understanding im going to want a 1in7 or 1in8 twist rate because it can stabilize a heavier bullet that im going to wanna shoot with. now the m&p 15 i want uses a 1in9 twist rate is there that big of a difference or? for sights i think some plain jane quality iron sites will suit me just fine i because have perfect vision that and when i use a scope i end up staring through it for 30 seconds trying to line up the PERFECT shot where with iron sites i usually take the shot within 5-6 seconds because i just aim for the kill zone and let one fly 9 times out of ten the deer drops where it stands the rest of the time i usually find it within a few hundred feet ive only lost one deer due to an angry farmer that wouldnt let me onto his land to track it down i probably could have just went in got it and left without him ever knowing but i believe you should never enter someones property without permission and i even marked where the deer went in with an orange flag so he could find it and the meat wouldnt go to waste. sure enough i drove by his place 15 minutes later and saw him in his orange with a rifle over his shoulder tracking my deer.. oh well sorry for rambling but if your were me would you go with the m&p15 with the 1in9 or build one with a 1in7 barrel? i really wanna get this right.