Reloading for the 30-06

JUSTinTYME · April 30, 2014, 06:38 PM

I pulled some bullets out of some 7.62x51 I had laying around. Naturally they measure out to .308. I was going to use these bullets to reload for my 30-06. When I weighed them they came out to be 143 grains. My question is, should I use load data for a 140 grain bullet and be extremely conservative? I'm new to reloading and this is my first venture into rifle so far. You guys helped a lot for my pistol reloads and I know you'll help me here. Thanks in advance.

Brian Pfleuger · April 30, 2014, 06:40 PM

3gr won't make a wit of difference. Load them to 140gr data and don't worry a second. Start low and work up, like always.

JUSTinTYME · April 30, 2014, 06:41 PM

Thank you Brian! Somehow, I knew you would end up helping me out here to lol

Brian Pfleuger · April 30, 2014, 06:50 PM

Ha! You're welcome.

Just as an example... the difference between 130gr and 150gr in Hodgdon data for IMR3031 is 3.6gr. Assuming it's more or less linear, each grain of bullet weight would change the charge by 0.18gr. So, in theory at least, a 143gr bullet would use 0.54gr less than a 140gr.

That assumes all else is equal. All else isn't equal, so 0.5gr is no more than a guesstimate.

There's only a 2.0gr difference with H414, so 3gr bullet difference would only be 0.3gr powder.

If you really want to feel safe, look at the difference between two bullet weights with your powder of choice and do the math... or just don't worry about it. The differences in primers, chambers, brass, powder lots and bullets more than covers a 3.0gr difference in a 140gr bullet.

NWPilgrim · April 30, 2014, 09:49 PM

Agree with Brian, it is a trivial weight difference and you will be working up from minimum listed load anyway.

As a general rule when I have a bullet weight not listed in my data references I will use load data for the next heavier similar type bullet listed. Charge weights go down as bullet weight goes up so this tactic keeps me on the safe side. But differences of less than 5 grains is insignificant for bullets in that weight range.

medalguy · April 30, 2014, 11:37 PM

Be sure those aren't tracer bullets. They generally weigh right at 143 - 144 grains. They are longer than ball bullets and are tapered back slightly at the rear much like M80 bullets. Compare the length to a known ball bullet, or look at the back end and see if there's lead showing or a copper cap.

DaleA · May 1, 2014, 09:10 AM

Like most folk here I appreciate the information Brian and the other staff members post.

In this case he provided a good answer for you... I'm just a little puzzled by the delay in getting you the information. First post 6:38, answer 6:40.

I'm guessing he might have gone over to one of the ballistic calculators on line or one of the reloading component web sites to check on your question...he's very thorough that way.

JUSTinTYME · May 2, 2014, 09:05 AM

Yes, Brain has provided me with a lot of information already in my short time as a member here. And those bullets do have lead showing on the bottom of them. I believe they are just m80 ball ammo. I had them laying around from when I owned a .308.

JUSTinTYME · May 2, 2014, 09:19 AM

This is probably a dumb question but it seems like every time I turn around I need to buy something new for reloading. Is it really necessary to trim your rifle cases? I have some 30-06 very close to the trim length listed in my lyman manual. They say to trim it to 2.484 and I have some at 2.487 and 2.489.

mehavey · May 2, 2014, 09:33 AM

Max case length for the `06 is 2.494"
"Trim-to" length is usually 0.010" shorter than that to permit growth over several firings before retrimming.

Your're fine for now.

But you are correct -- Reloading is akin to dealing with women.
There's always more stuff to buy as time goes on.

If you don't have some digital calipers already [and you should

], here is a simple gauge to sort cases that might eventually need trimming.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...rtridge-types/

HankB · May 2, 2014, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Is it really necessary to trim your rifle cases? I have some 30-06 very close to the trim length listed in my lyman manual. They say to trim it to 2.484 and I have some at 2.487 and 2.489.

You probably know this, but the lengths should be measured after sizing; squeezing the case down in a full length sizing die will generally cause it to grow a bit, as will dragging the expander ball back through the neck.

JUSTinTYME · May 2, 2014, 09:52 AM

I read that so I did resize them already. I was at the trimming stage when I stopped because of the overall length issues. Thank you tho. Turns out 20 cases out of 50 some were still within specs to be reloaded.

**44 AMP** · May 2, 2014, 10:08 AM

Cases that are too long can have the mouth extend beyond the chamber, where there isn't room in the barrel for the case mouth to expand enough to properly release the bullet. This causes pressure to jump dramatically, and is a BAD thing.

Trimming the case shorter by 0.010 allows for several firings before it stretches back to max length.

If you rifle is in spec, max length cases are fine, once, but should be checked for length before reuse.

Case length consistency is important when crimping.

As to the bullet weight, when was the last time you verified the accuracy of your scale? Not doubting the 143gr weight, but its a tad below the specs for M80ball, which are 149-3gr. The 06 "150gr M2 ball is 152-3gr, and the 7.62 tracer is supposed to be 146-3gr. (I an assuming the "-3" is the way the data I saw wrote +/-). In conversation we call them 150s, or 147s (7.62mm).

an average of 143gr seems light, for what should be a 147/150gr bullet, but could be the actual weight. Or your scale could be reading a tad low. Best to find out.

Bart B. · May 2, 2014, 11:45 AM

I doubt any .30-06 case will ever have a case mouth extend beyond the chamber. Here's why.....

Chamber length SAAMI specs are 2.502" +.015"
Case length max SAAMI specs are 2.494" -.020"

By chance, if a case has a longer neck than max, say 2.505", but its headspace is OK, it will not chamber at all in a minimum length chamber. The bolt won't close (without a lot of force) and may crunch the case mouth back. And the case mouth won't crimp down any significant amount into the bullet jacket. At least my tests with .30-06, .270 Win and .308 Win they wouldn't let the bolt close on cases a few thousandths longer than the chamber. The angle on the chamber mouth is about 45 degrees.

The reason there's .008" clearance between max case length and minimum chamber length is the .30-06 is notorious for having its shoulder set back from firing pin impact. Sometimes, they grow a few thousandths in length from such impacts. If the case is too long to begin with, the case mouth will do a hard stop against the chamber mouth. And that'll cause pressure problems.

All cases are made to a max length to have several thousandths clearance to the chamber mouth limit. 'Twas common for competitive shooters through the 1960's to trim .30-06 cases to an even 2.485" or thereabouts to have plenty of room for case length growth over several full length sizing cycles.

DaleA · May 2, 2014, 07:19 PM

Quote:

But you are correct -- Reloading is akin to dealing with women.
There's always more stuff to buy as time goes on.

Sure guns and shooting are dangerous but it doesn't even come CLOSE to the near death experiences you can get with a slip of the lip.

April 30, 2014, 06:38 PM	#1
JUSTinTYME Member Join Date: April 25, 2014 Location: PA Posts: 77	Reloading for the 30-06 I pulled some bullets out of some 7.62x51 I had laying around. Naturally they measure out to .308. I was going to use these bullets to reload for my 30-06. When I weighed them they came out to be 143 grains. My question is, should I use load data for a 140 grain bullet and be extremely conservative? I'm new to reloading and this is my first venture into rifle so far. You guys helped a lot for my pistol reloads and I know you'll help me here. Thanks in advance.

April 30, 2014, 06:40 PM	#2
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	3gr won't make a wit of difference. Load them to 140gr data and don't worry a second. Start low and work up, like always. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

April 30, 2014, 06:50 PM	#4
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Ha! You're welcome. Just as an example... the difference between 130gr and 150gr in Hodgdon data for IMR3031 is 3.6gr. Assuming it's more or less linear, each grain of bullet weight would change the charge by 0.18gr. So, in theory at least, a 143gr bullet would use 0.54gr less than a 140gr. That assumes all else is equal. All else isn't equal, so 0.5gr is no more than a guesstimate. There's only a 2.0gr difference with H414, so 3gr bullet difference would only be 0.3gr powder. If you really want to feel safe, look at the difference between two bullet weights with your powder of choice and do the math... or just don't worry about it. The differences in primers, chambers, brass, powder lots and bullets more than covers a 3.0gr difference in a 140gr bullet. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

May 2, 2014, 09:19 AM	#9
JUSTinTYME Member Join Date: April 25, 2014 Location: PA Posts: 77	This is probably a dumb question but it seems like every time I turn around I need to buy something new for reloading. Is it really necessary to trim your rifle cases? I have some 30-06 very close to the trim length listed in my lyman manual. They say to trim it to 2.484 and I have some at 2.487 and 2.489. __________________ 12B

May 2, 2014, 09:33 AM	#10
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,883	Max case length for the `06 is 2.494" "Trim-to" length is usually 0.010" shorter than that to permit growth over several firings before retrimming. Your're fine for now. But you are correct -- Reloading is akin to dealing with women. There's always more stuff to buy as time goes on. If you don't have some digital calipers already [and you should ], here is a simple gauge to sort cases that might eventually need trimming. http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...rtridge-types/ Last edited by mehavey; May 2, 2014 at 09:52 AM.

April 30, 2014, 06:41 PM	#3
JUSTinTYME Member Join Date: April 25, 2014 Location: PA Posts: 77	Thank you Brian! Somehow, I knew you would end up helping me out here to lol

April 30, 2014, 09:49 PM	#5
NWPilgrim Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 2,346	Agree with Brian, it is a trivial weight difference and you will be working up from minimum listed load anyway. As a general rule when I have a bullet weight not listed in my data references I will use load data for the next heavier similar type bullet listed. Charge weights go down as bullet weight goes up so this tactic keeps me on the safe side. But differences of less than 5 grains is insignificant for bullets in that weight range.

April 30, 2014, 11:37 PM	#6
medalguy Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,033	Be sure those aren't tracer bullets. They generally weigh right at 143 - 144 grains. They are longer than ball bullets and are tapered back slightly at the rear much like M80 bullets. Compare the length to a known ball bullet, or look at the back end and see if there's lead showing or a copper cap.

May 1, 2014, 09:10 AM	#7
DaleA Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2002 Location: Twin Cities, MN Posts: 5,312	Like most folk here I appreciate the information Brian and the other staff members post. In this case he provided a good answer for you... I'm just a little puzzled by the delay in getting you the information. First post 6:38, answer 6:40. I'm guessing he might have gone over to one of the ballistic calculators on line or one of the reloading component web sites to check on your question...he's very thorough that way.

May 2, 2014, 09:05 AM	#8
JUSTinTYME Member Join Date: April 25, 2014 Location: PA Posts: 77	Yes, Brain has provided me with a lot of information already in my short time as a member here. And those bullets do have lead showing on the bottom of them. I believe they are just m80 ball ammo. I had them laying around from when I owned a .308.

May 2, 2014, 09:52 AM	#12
JUSTinTYME Member Join Date: April 25, 2014 Location: PA Posts: 77	I read that so I did resize them already. I was at the trimming stage when I stopped because of the overall length issues. Thank you tho. Turns out 20 cases out of 50 some were still within specs to be reloaded. __________________ 12B

May 2, 2014, 10:08 AM	#13
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,812	Cases that are too long can have the mouth extend beyond the chamber, where there isn't room in the barrel for the case mouth to expand enough to properly release the bullet. This causes pressure to jump dramatically, and is a BAD thing. Trimming the case shorter by 0.010 allows for several firings before it stretches back to max length. If you rifle is in spec, max length cases are fine, once, but should be checked for length before reuse. Case length consistency is important when crimping. As to the bullet weight, when was the last time you verified the accuracy of your scale? Not doubting the 143gr weight, but its a tad below the specs for M80ball, which are 149-3gr. The 06 "150gr M2 ball is 152-3gr, and the 7.62 tracer is supposed to be 146-3gr. (I an assuming the "-3" is the way the data I saw wrote +/-). In conversation we call them 150s, or 147s (7.62mm). an average of 143gr seems light, for what should be a 147/150gr bullet, but could be the actual weight. Or your scale could be reading a tad low. Best to find out. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 2, 2014, 11:45 AM	#14
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	I doubt any .30-06 case will ever have a case mouth extend beyond the chamber. Here's why..... Chamber length SAAMI specs are 2.502" +.015" Case length max SAAMI specs are 2.494" -.020" By chance, if a case has a longer neck than max, say 2.505", but its headspace is OK, it will not chamber at all in a minimum length chamber. The bolt won't close (without a lot of force) and may crunch the case mouth back. And the case mouth won't crimp down any significant amount into the bullet jacket. At least my tests with .30-06, .270 Win and .308 Win they wouldn't let the bolt close on cases a few thousandths longer than the chamber. The angle on the chamber mouth is about 45 degrees. The reason there's .008" clearance between max case length and minimum chamber length is the .30-06 is notorious for having its shoulder set back from firing pin impact. Sometimes, they grow a few thousandths in length from such impacts. If the case is too long to begin with, the case mouth will do a hard stop against the chamber mouth. And that'll cause pressure problems. All cases are made to a max length to have several thousandths clearance to the chamber mouth limit. 'Twas common for competitive shooters through the 1960's to trim .30-06 cases to an even 2.485" or thereabouts to have plenty of room for case length growth over several full length sizing cycles. Last edited by Bart B.; May 2, 2014 at 12:29 PM.