HOWA 1500 Long Range - Page 2

std7mag · December 18, 2018, 03:25 PM

USAF ret,

My longer distance rig is running an EGW 20MOA one piece base, with Warne low steel rings, and a Sightron STAC 4-20X50.
Even with the 6.5 CM your probably going to want a 20 MOA base.
The Warne rings are a little bit of a PITA to install. Not too awful bad though. And they are solid.

The Sightron STAC is a 30mm tube, MOA reticle ( for those of us that still think in inches). The reticle cross hairs are very fine, with a center dot. Side paralax adjustment. And tall capped target knobs.
Mine does "the box" just fine. And you can see the mirage to help with wind.
Priced on Amazon about $400.

Really hard to beat at that price point.

Dufus · December 18, 2018, 05:41 PM

All else being equal, how can a 6.5 Creed run circles around a 308 Win????

ndking1126 · December 19, 2018, 12:46 PM

https://www.mcarbo.com/6-5-creedmoor...ics-chart.aspx

I haven't fact checked every single statement in this article, but it gets the main reasons right. Less drift, less drop, and less recoil. I reload for the 260 Rem so I haven't checked the prices of Match 6.5C ammo, but I'd be shocked if there was any appreciable difference between the two. The ballistics don't lie.. the farther the target is away, the more advantage it will have over the .308.

If you are mathematically minded, here is a page that I'm not smart enough to fully understand:
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/0...tridge-matter/

I know people love to hate the cartridge, but it really is a fantastic offering for long range work. I chose the 260 Rem because it shoots the same bullet about 50 FPS faster, so IMO it should have gained the notoriety over the 6.5C. Add that to Remington's long list of mis-steps, but that's a conversation for another post.

As a medium game hunting cartridge its perfectly capable, but so are the other 519,399 cartridges out there. There's no reason to buy it as a hunting cartridge if you already have a hunting rifle (unless you just want another rifle.. and I'm on board with that).

SCgman · December 20, 2018, 09:54 AM

SCgman: the Hogue pilar bed stock is flimsy in the fore end.

The Hogue full bed block is very rigid and has aluminum embedded in the molded stock and is virtually immovable at the fore end.

I have both Hogue stocks, one in each bedding configuration and have no serious concerns over flex in either......however, my point is the B&C medalist HB stocks are much stiffer by comparison and a good bit heavier which would make recoil almost negligent if that is the primary concern. As far as hunting with the rifle, I probably prefer the Hogue rubber finish for surer handling in any weather condition.

Dufus · December 20, 2018, 12:04 PM

ndking1126: it really is a fantastic offering, so you bought a 260 Rem instead??

ndking1126 · December 20, 2018, 12:39 PM

Dufus, I bought the 260 Rem before 6.5C hit it's stride. The 6.5bullets were still largely endorsed by competitors only and hadn't gained mainstream notoriety yet. Articles like this one http://demigodllc.com/articles/6.5-s...creedmoor/?p=1 seemed to validate what my research was telling me. I liked the 308 case compatibility and extra velocity.

I don't regret it since I can reload my own. It would be nice to have some off-the-shelf cartridge options though. Right now the only one I can find with some regularity is the Hornady Match 130 Grain at Cabelas. Thankfully, it shoots really well out of my rifle. I've ordered Federal 142gr GMM at my LGS once, but that's not worth the effort in my opinion. If one is buying new today and doesn't reload, the 6.5C is the obvious choice over the two. If one can reload, either one is a great option. Extra velocity and a reliance on reloading, or much more available ammo and a small loss of velocity? It'd be personal preference at that point.

Dufus · December 21, 2018, 01:07 AM

I had a M70 Win chambered in 264 Win Mag. back in 1968. It was a winner, but barrels don't last too long in that caliber.

armednfree · December 23, 2018, 10:06 PM

By my experience with a 308 at 1000 yards you shouldn't even bother with 168 grain loads. Going into transonic speeds, which you will with both the 168 and the 175, I found 175's handle it better.

To do it well you have to lean on it hard. Factory loads are not made like that. Federal 168's are loaded only 50 fps faster than 175's. Both with a limiting 2600 and 2650 respectively. Remember they are made to function in the M1A.

December 18, 2018, 03:25 PM	#26
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	USAF ret, My longer distance rig is running an EGW 20MOA one piece base, with Warne low steel rings, and a Sightron STAC 4-20X50. Even with the 6.5 CM your probably going to want a 20 MOA base. The Warne rings are a little bit of a PITA to install. Not too awful bad though. And they are solid. The Sightron STAC is a 30mm tube, MOA reticle ( for those of us that still think in inches). The reticle cross hairs are very fine, with a center dot. Side paralax adjustment. And tall capped target knobs. Mine does "the box" just fine. And you can see the mirage to help with wind. Priced on Amazon about $400. Really hard to beat at that price point. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

December 19, 2018, 12:46 PM	#28
ndking1126 Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2008 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 1,932	https://www.mcarbo.com/6-5-creedmoor...ics-chart.aspx I haven't fact checked every single statement in this article, but it gets the main reasons right. Less drift, less drop, and less recoil. I reload for the 260 Rem so I haven't checked the prices of Match 6.5C ammo, but I'd be shocked if there was any appreciable difference between the two. The ballistics don't lie.. the farther the target is away, the more advantage it will have over the .308. If you are mathematically minded, here is a page that I'm not smart enough to fully understand: http://precisionrifleblog.com/2015/0...tridge-matter/ I know people love to hate the cartridge, but it really is a fantastic offering for long range work. I chose the 260 Rem because it shoots the same bullet about 50 FPS faster, so IMO it should have gained the notoriety over the 6.5C. Add that to Remington's long list of mis-steps, but that's a conversation for another post. As a medium game hunting cartridge its perfectly capable, but so are the other 519,399 cartridges out there. There's no reason to buy it as a hunting cartridge if you already have a hunting rifle (unless you just want another rifle.. and I'm on board with that). Last edited by ndking1126; December 19, 2018 at 01:08 PM.

December 20, 2018, 12:39 PM	#31
ndking1126 Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2008 Location: Madison, AL Posts: 1,932	Dufus, I bought the 260 Rem before 6.5C hit it's stride. The 6.5bullets were still largely endorsed by competitors only and hadn't gained mainstream notoriety yet. Articles like this one http://demigodllc.com/articles/6.5-s...creedmoor/?p=1 seemed to validate what my research was telling me. I liked the 308 case compatibility and extra velocity. I don't regret it since I can reload my own. It would be nice to have some off-the-shelf cartridge options though. Right now the only one I can find with some regularity is the Hornady Match 130 Grain at Cabelas. Thankfully, it shoots really well out of my rifle. I've ordered Federal 142gr GMM at my LGS once, but that's not worth the effort in my opinion. If one is buying new today and doesn't reload, the 6.5C is the obvious choice over the two. If one can reload, either one is a great option. Extra velocity and a reliance on reloading, or much more available ammo and a small loss of velocity? It'd be personal preference at that point. Last edited by ndking1126; December 20, 2018 at 12:47 PM.

December 18, 2018, 05:41 PM	#27
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	All else being equal, how can a 6.5 Creed run circles around a 308 Win????

December 20, 2018, 09:54 AM	#29
SCgman Member Join Date: March 6, 2013 Posts: 67	SCgman: the Hogue pilar bed stock is flimsy in the fore end. The Hogue full bed block is very rigid and has aluminum embedded in the molded stock and is virtually immovable at the fore end. I have both Hogue stocks, one in each bedding configuration and have no serious concerns over flex in either......however, my point is the B&C medalist HB stocks are much stiffer by comparison and a good bit heavier which would make recoil almost negligent if that is the primary concern. As far as hunting with the rifle, I probably prefer the Hogue rubber finish for surer handling in any weather condition.

December 20, 2018, 12:04 PM	#30
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	ndking1126: it really is a fantastic offering, so you bought a 260 Rem instead??

December 21, 2018, 01:07 AM	#32
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	I had a M70 Win chambered in 264 Win Mag. back in 1968. It was a winner, but barrels don't last too long in that caliber.

December 23, 2018, 10:06 PM	#33
armednfree Senior Member Join Date: October 30, 2016 Posts: 211	By my experience with a 308 at 1000 yards you shouldn't even bother with 168 grain loads. Going into transonic speeds, which you will with both the 168 and the 175, I found 175's handle it better. To do it well you have to lean on it hard. Factory loads are not made like that. Federal 168's are loaded only 50 fps faster than 175's. Both with a limiting 2600 and 2650 respectively. Remember they are made to function in the M1A.