223 for Bolt Action - opinions welcome

[Tallest]

I've read around on here a bit trying to find a good starting point for this, but it seems a lot of 223 loads are semi-auto geared.

What I'm wanting is input/experienced opinions on powder and brass preferences for hand loading 223 for a bolt gun, with 55-60 grain varmint bullets. 22" barrel. 1 in 8" twist. I know my gun will be it's own creature, but I'd like to know what has worked well for others.

Reloading manual says Benchmark is most accurate, but it's also fastest. And since this is for a field rifle shooting groundhogs, coyotes and various feral felines, I wonder if a target powder may be out of it's element...? Varget has decent numbers too, but it's over max, and that's something I'm not too experienced with. These are the things I don't know and am still endeavoring to learn. Has any ever used TAC or IMR4198? Both are showing decent velocities without going over max.

Any opinions on brass? There's a ton of 223 brass for bulk reloading and stuffing into AR mags, I suppose that would be suitable and affordable, but if anyone has used higher grade stuff and seen a big difference, please advise!

Thanks all!

[rg1]

Several good powders for bolt action .223. For cases in bulk you can't beat LC once fired military cases. They do have a primer crimp though, no problems to swage it out. Also they can be sorted by weight and make decent target cases. IMR 8208XBR, Tac, Benchrest, Varget, or even H335 would all work well.

[std7mag]

I'm using range pick up Lake City brass.
Alliant Varmint, Win 748, Hodgdon BLC2 also work well.

[BBarn]

I've gotten good results with H335, BL-C2, and Varget in mine using 55 gr. bullets. But it's a 26" heavy barrel in the standard 1 in 12" twist. Have used mostly use older Lake City brass.

[hounddawg]

If you want to go with Lapua Brass then head over to the Ammunition store where you can get loaded Lapua Match ammo for the same price as empty brass.

http://ammunitionstore.com/products/...round-box.html

31 bucks for 50 Lapua's loaded with 55 grain pills

[jugornot]

Bolt 223 CFE and 80 grain Sierra Matchkings
AR 8208 XBR and 77 grain Sierra Matchkings

[603Country]

I get excellent accuracy with H335 behind Nosler 40 gr Ballistic Tips, 55 gr Nosler, 60 gr Nosler Partitions, and 65 gr Sierra Gamekings.

That little 40 gr Nosler will knock a coyote flat. Amazing. Not so spectacular with medium to large hogs, however, so that’s what the Partitions are for.

[chris in va]

335 has worked very well for me at near max loads. Quite the fireball though!

[muleman11]

Accuracy is accuracy, a target powder will work just as well on varmints as it does on paper.

[hdwhit]

Tallest asked:
What I'm wanting is input/experienced opinions on powder and brass preferences for hand loading 223 for a bolt gun, with 55-60 grain varmint bullets. 22" barrel. 1 in 8" twist. I know my gun will be it's own creature, but I'd like to know what has worked well for others.

About 1980, I standardized on a loading of 20.3 grains IMR-4198 under a 60 grain Hornady soft (or hollow) point bullet. This was below maximum at the time (Hornady Handbook #4) but later editions reach maximum at lower loadings.

During the powder drought of the early 1980's, I had to redevelop this load using IMR-3031 and Winchester 74, but was able to achieve equivalent ballistic performance.

Reloading manual says Benchmark is most accurate, but it's also fastest.

Oh, for heaven's sake, stop selecting loads off of burn rate charts.

First, there is no industry standard for measuring burn rates, so everyone's burn rate chart reports powders in a different order.

Second, if you consult Hodgdon's website (they're the people who make/market) Benchmark as well as IMR-4198, H332, and IMR-3031, all of those powders are faster than Benchmark.

And since this is for a field rifle shooting groundhogs, coyotes and various feral felines, I wonder if a target powder may be out of it's element...? Varget has decent numbers too, but it's over max, and that's something I'm not too experienced with. These are the things I don't know and am still endeavoring to learn. Has any ever used TAC or IMR4198? Both are showing decent velocities without going over max.

Yes, as mentioned earlier, I built a standardized load that I have regularly loaded for 38+ years around IMR-4198.

Follow standard load development procedures (i.e. begin with the Starting load and work up in fractions of a grain until you find the most accurate loading) and you should come up with something acceptable using any powder suitable for 223/5.56.

Any opinions on brass? There's a ton of 223 brass for bulk reloading and stuffing into AR mags, I suppose that would be suitable and affordable, but if anyone has used higher grade stuff and seen a big difference, please advise!

I use "previously fired" brass exclusively and segregate it by headstamp because different headstamps "feel" different when I am resizing them in my single stage press. But, after the bullet is seated, I treat them as if they were identical.

[Marco Califo]

http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/223rem/

[Tallest]

Oh, for heaven's sake, stop selecting loads off of burn rate charts.

First, there is no industry standard for measuring burn rates, so everyone's burn rate chart reports powders in a different order.

Second, if you consult Hodgdon's website (they're the people who make/market) Benchmark as well as IMR-4198, H332, and IMR-3031, all of those powders are faster than Benchmark.

Oh, for heaven's sake, stop jumping to conclusions...

I am not looking at burn rate charts... I am looking at the reloading data out of the Nosler reloading manual for the Nosler bullets I want to shoot. During their test, the highest velocities for that bullet were achieved with Benchmark. Based on the factory ammo I've tried, the top end velocities are not the most accurate from my rifle.

[Tallest]

Anyway... a lot of good information here. I appreciate it.

I think I may pick up a can of H335 and maybe one of IMR4198 to really test some options.

[griz]

What do you mean by "over max". The Nosler manual, any manual, shouldn't list over max loads.

[Marco Califo]

I wonder if a target powder may be out of it's element...? Varget has decent numbers too, but it's over max, and that's something I'm not too experienced with.

I do not believe powders care if they are considered "target" or not. Varget is an excellent powder for heavy loads with heavy bullets in 223/5.56 (Varget = Varmint and Target), and is really an Aussie version of IMR type extruded powders. Full loads of Varget are generally compressed (as much as the case will hold), so I am further unclear what you mean by over max. The choice of this, or that powder, (ALWAYS using published load data, that is by definition not over Max) is mainly driven by what you will do with it. Also, which powder(s) you have on hand can be pretty darned relevant. Specifically bullet weight is a primary variable determining what powder will work well.

For general purpose 223/5.56 across almost all bullet weights, I use WC844 which is surplus grade H335, and the exact powder used in USGI 5.56 military ammo. It works well, which should not be surprising to anyone since it had to pass military specifications tests to be adopted. It is very accurate, and meters well, in addition to being well suited in burning speed. I find it throws fireballs most noticeably in bolt rifles, and will heat up a sporter-taper barrel faster than I like to shoot. When it is available you can find WC844 8 lb. jugs for under $100. Or just buy new H335 ~$22 per pound.

I also use CFE223 which is a modern ball powder, which allows fastest velocities in many bullet weights, and has a tin additive to negate/remove any copper residue in the barrel.
223 is not picky about which powder you use. Any specialized powder choice should be driven by bullet weight. So, read load data for different powders to select what is right for you. You may need to buy another powder, or make do with what you have available. Differences between powders will probably be difficult to quantify quickly. I think most non-competition shooters find a load that works for their rifle, and use that.
I would consider Nosler data with a grain of salt. https://load-data.nosler.com/ I look at it and use it for BT's, but it is far from an exhaustive authority on all powder and bullet combinations. I salute that they do their own testing, as do most bullet and powder manufacturers. Hodgdon is another good data source: https://www.hodgdon.com/products/smokeless-powder/
I do not like today's new format, but the previous format made it very easier to compare powders for for a given bullet.
Update: Yesterday, Hodgdon's Reloading Data Center URL was different, I had to rebookmark it, and it was showing me one load at a time; today it is back to the list format, although the old URL does not work.

[T. O'Heir]

"...223 loads are semi-auto geared..." Nope. Load manuals do not give loads for specific rifles or types of rifles. It makes no difference what rifle you use. Load manuals are about SAAMI specs. Velocities will only be close if your rifle has the same length barrel too.
"...but it's over max..." Max what? Different powders have different Max loads mostly because of the size of the granules.
Benchmark uses a bit less powder for roughly 100 FPS less velocity than Varget with 55 and 60 grain bullets. Powder names are about marketing and have nothing whatever to do with what they're use for. Mind you, I've found using whatever powder is given for the accuracy load, regardless of the cartridge, is a good place to start. Usually where I stop too. The groundhogs, coyotes and various feral felines won't know or care what powder was used.

[Marco Califo]

Nope. Load manuals do not give loads for specific rifles or types of rifles. It makes no difference what rifle you use. Load manuals are about SAAMI specs.

False. Western Powders, Barnes Bullets, and Sierra all publish separate load data for 223 bolt and semi's. It does turn out they use mostly the same powders, but they also breakdown by barrel length and chambering (Barnes and Western Powders 223 and 5.56). It is also important to note that chamber dimensions can, and do, vary within the same chambering, and leade or throat in a rifle can change the firing characteristics, and must be understood for safe and effective reloading (e.g.: some 223 chambers may allow longer bullet seating, but a different rifle may not chamber it).

http://www.barnesbullets.com/load-data/
http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-con...1-2016_Web.pdf
Sierra's two articles are here: http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/223rem/

SAAMI Specs Note the difference, but do not provide 5.56 specs.
http://saami.org/specifications_and_...mbinations.pdf
- CENTERFIRE RIFLE
(continued)
In Firearms Chambered For ______Do Not Use These Cartridges
223 Remington _________________5.56mm Military

[Tallest]

Sorry for my poor terminology...

What I meant by "over max" is that it's over case capacity, ie. a compressed load.

Not that there's anything wrong with compressed loads, I just prefer to avoid them.

[Marco Califo]

There is nothing wrong with published compressed loads.

Actually, they might be your most consistent, accurate and fastest. Extruded tube type powders like Varget (and IMR 4895, 4064, etc.). can be safely compressed because there is some settling and "give" in the way the powders fill the case, and space between granules. A slight "crunching" sound is normal when seating.

Compressed loads absolutely prevent anomalies like powder forward in the case from pointing down.

[Tallest]

Marco Califo -

I see what you're saying. I currently have some Varget, maybe I'll start with that and see how it does.

In all honesty, I am pretty green to reloading, and it seems there is a great deal to learn right out of the gate. Assembling normal loads without having anything to interfere with seating depth still takes all the finesse I have thus far. (Insert self deprecating laugh )

I'll give these a go and see what I learn.

[m&p45acp10+1]

I used mix head stamp brass, and 55 grain Hornady VMax with h335 powder. I shoot them in my AR, and my Savage 12FSSV. The bolt action can put them into under a half inch 5 shot group at 100 yards. I have used it to kill coyotes out to 450 yards with those loads.

H335 for 55 grain bullets.
Reloader 15 or Varget for 68 to 77 grain bullets.

[hounddawg]

I have not really settled on a load for my .223 bolt gun. Savage with a 26 inch 1 in 8 barrel. I have been messing around with Varget with some 69 grain Nosler CC that gives OK results also had a box of ancient 77 grain sitting on the back of the shelf which I shot with CFE 223 and had some good results with. I have not really settled on a main load yet. Best speed and velocity I achieved was with IMR 4895 and 69 SMK's but I only had a quarter pound of powder so I never really fleshed it out. Everything so far has seemed to give decent results, I don't think the .223 is a picky cartridge

[RC20]

If you go with Hogden, they are going to give you every variation of Hogden that will shoot, but they are not going to give you accuracy.

That's why I like Sierra and Hornady (Berger etc) they list what shot best with their bullets. Sierra and Hornaday have pretty well every bullet shape covered. Its a good . Not all powders are the same between the two and they change as they go up the grain scales.

Hornady Powders Listed by Grain for 223 Bolt.
35 Gr: 11
40: 11
45: 13
50: 18
50 GMX: 8
52-52: 20
55: 21
55 GMX: 9
60: 19

Semi Auto Tested:
68: 14
70 GMX: 10
73-75: 17
80: 13

TAC is common 35-53 Then TAC and Varget. Maybe others, not my area.

[Marco Califo]

TAC is another excellent powder for 223, and meters very well. It is made in Belgium, and can be found cheaply at times. I picked up 4 pounds with No HazMat on a Midsouth Shooters Supply promotion (www.midsouthshooterssupply.com).

I reload 223 and 308 mostly in rifles, and the same range of powders work very well in both. Take a look at the burn rate chart linked below and #80 through #115 are roughly the right range for both. That is 35 out of 148 smokeless powders (including pistol and shotguns powders). #85 through #99 or 100 are the sweet spot where if you could only use one powder for 223 and 308, any of those would do about anything you want it to.

I started reloading 223 and 308 with 8 lbs of AA2460 (sold then as Data 2230C; uses 2460 load data). I found that powder to be a very good "do all" powder, when I did not have the luxury of personally stocking more than 20 different powders. Now I that I have used it up, I keep eyeing the 8 lb jugs 2460.

https://imrpowder.com/wp-content/upl...nratecolor.pdf

Actual load data is available free for all powders mentioned in this thread. At the top of this forum is a "sticky note" thread of official on-line data sources available on the internet.

[Chainsaw.]

Ill throw ARcomp on the heap. The great thing with 223 is there are soooo many options. The best brass around is lapua, will last dozens of loads if treated right.