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Old March 21, 2018, 09:55 PM   #1
TunnelRat
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M&P 2.0 Compact: A Head's Up On Potential Magazine Issue

Hi all,
I've owned my M&P 2.0 Compact for about 6 months now with ~1000 rds fired of various manufacturers without a single malfunction. I think it's a big improvement over the previous iterations and I shoot it better than my Glock 19. I also find the grip seems to print less for me than my Glock 19. I really like the pistol overall. All of that said, I have noticed one issue.

The issue is this: I have found that the magazine baseplates can, and in my case do repeatedly, shift forward upon impact with a hard surface such as wood or concrete. This does not cause a malfunction, but it is somewhat concerning as with a magazine fed weapon the greatest source of failure is typically the magazine and this does give me some pause. The picture below illustrates what I mean.


In 80+ handguns I have not noticed this to this extent with another pistol. I can and have repeated this process with my CZ P-10c, SIG P320, Walther PPQ, Glock 19, HK 45c, etc. and not been able to replicate the issue. I will note that the issue is not one that is present from the start, but seems to develop over time (though not much time).

We have many experienced shooters here so this isn't meant to come off as talking down to anyone, but I need to explain how this happens for people that might not be able to visualize this. On most semiauto pistols there are two factors to keeping the baseplate both on the magazine body and seated in an exact spot. There is a plate at the base of the magazine spring that loops onto the spring (I'll call it the spring plate from hereon). On this plate is a cylinder that fits into the baseplate. This prevents the baseplate from sliding off the magazine and needs to be depressed to disassemble the magazine. Also on that plate at the front is a raised bump. That bump catches on the front of the magazine body and by doing so prevents the baseplate from shifting forward (the lip on the front of the baseplate keeps it from shifting backward). You can see all of this in this picture.


Now other pistols I have use a slightly different design where the entire lip of that spring plate catches on the magazine body. In fact the only pistol I have that uses the system I explained above other than the S&W is the Walther PPQ. In fact they look so alike that if imitation is the sincerest form of flattery Walther should be ecstatic. As a note, I have not been able to get the issue to happen with the PPQ. The picture below shows the S&W on the left and the Walther on the right and they are practically indistinguishable.


In my experience what happens is the spring plates are actually bending downward at the front. This prevents the bump from catching on the magazine body and allows the baseplate to slide forward. As I mentioned it seems to get worse over time and the plate gets bent further and further. An interesting note is a lot of designs use a polymer spring plate. To me this is slightly better as the polymer will bend and then return to the original shape, whereas the metal will, at least in this case, stay bent. The Walther doesn't seem to have the same problem so perhaps it's a tempering issue with the spring plates, or perhaps the fit of the spring plate in the baseplate on the Walther is more flush to prevent this (as a note the cylinder on the spring plate is not flush with the baseplate on the S&W magazine nor does it appear to be level in the hole, when it is with the Walther).


Now I was a bit confused as to how this happens, as the spring plate should sit flush with the baseplate and the baseplate should prevent the spring plate from bending this far, at least that's what I would think initially. In practice this isn't working. In fact in the following picture it seems that the baseplate itself is also bending as well, or was bent originally and I never noticed.


I did contact S&W and their tech had no idea why this would happen and said he hasn't heard of it before. He advised me to send in the magazines and they would ship me new ones for free. I did this and am awaiting new magazines. The thing is, it's doing this with 5 separate magazines now and after enough drops the baseplate shifts 50% of the time or more. On one magazine the bump has also seemingly flattened to the point where I can shift the baseplate without a drop.


As a note I am not slamming these magazines onto the ground. This is me depressing the magazine release with the pistol in front of my face and at slide lock. I have magazines that have done this hundreds of times without fail, and this issue started happening after say 10 drops. I'm not really convinced new mags will fix this issue, as 2 came with the pistol and 3 were bought at a separate time so the notion of a bad batch seems a bit unlikely. I will let people know what I find.

-TR
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Last edited by TunnelRat; March 22, 2018 at 07:37 AM.
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Old March 22, 2018, 03:50 AM   #2
Bartholomew Roberts
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Interesting. Just out of curiousity, have you tried swapping the PPQ spring plate into the M&P magazine to see if it solves the problem?
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Old March 22, 2018, 07:16 AM   #3
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https://youtu.be/03yGbTW6tOc

These 10-8 Performance magazine baseplates for the M&P are aluminum rather than the stock polymer baseplates, which seem to be bending downward ever so slightly in one of your pictures. Since S&W is sending you new magazines, you could try one or two of these on the old mags. I know comp shooters who use similar 10-8 Performance mag baseplates on Glock factory mags and these are good quality parts.
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Old March 22, 2018, 07:50 AM   #4
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I have not tried using the PPQ spring plates. That's not a bad idea and something I considered but didn't do originally as I didn't want to end up bending those too if the whole magazine body, spring plate, and baseplate setup was causing the issue more than just the spring plates. But I bet I might be able to order those from say Walther, so it's an option to keep in mind.

The baseplate swap might actually work even better given what I've seen at this point. I do think the basplate should be preventing the bending more than it is, so maybe an aluminum baseplate would help. I also notice that in that video the cylinder on the spring plate seems to sit more flush with the baseplate than on my 2.0 Compact when the baseplate is locked in the correct position.

Edit: unfortunately on the product page for the 10-8 M&P baseplates they mention it doesn't fit the 2.0 Compact as the corners will protrude out from the frame. Looks like it's only for the fullsize models.
http://www.10-8performance.com/s-w-m-p-base-pad/
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Old March 22, 2018, 01:39 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tunnel Rat:
Edit: unfortunately on the product page for the 10-8 M&P baseplates they mention it doesn't fit the 2.0 Compact as the corners will protrude out from the frame. Looks like it's only for the fullsize models.
True that, seems to me that you could “assume” that S&W made the magazine baseplates compatible between the fullsize & compact magazines, but you know what happens when you “assume”.
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Old March 22, 2018, 02:15 PM   #6
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That would have been too simple.

As a note since it might not have been clear, I had to send in the 5 magazines I already had in order to get the replacements. I can test the new ones but I won't be able to compare them to the old ones.
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Old March 22, 2018, 05:13 PM   #7
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Stop dropping your magazines onto hard surfaces. Problem solved.

Just kidding. I'm just a little away from receiving a brand-new S&W M&P40C 2.0 and it will be interesting to me to see if I experience a similar problem. Thanks for the head's up. This has not been a problem with my M&P9 Shield (1.0?) or my M&P9 2.0 (full-size) as yet. Just checked both sets of mags a minute ago. Maybe just a bad set of mags? I'll be paying close attention when my new M&P arrives.
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Old March 22, 2018, 07:38 PM   #8
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I don't remember any such issues with M&P 1.0 fullsize I had, or the 1.0c either. That's why this surprised me as much as it did.
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Old March 23, 2018, 07:36 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerrich99:
Stop dropping your magazines onto hard surfaces. Problem solved.
Some gun magazines you can afford to be reckless with. I love the Magpul GL9 mags for the Glock 17 & 19, they work great & you don’t feel bad if you step on a $15 magazine. Easy to replace these.

Now the Sig factory OEM P225 / P6 single stack 8 round magazines that I used to throw around, I now treat with kid gloves, since these are impossible to find new, and it’s getting hard to find decent used ones. These are built like Patton tanks but you can’t throw these around anymore! I just bought 2 good ones off of a co-worker for $25.00 each, since he would rather have the Pro-Mag 10 rounders(?!) LOL, who am I to argue with him? I gave him $50, grabbed the 2 mags & ran like hell!!
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Old March 23, 2018, 08:18 AM   #10
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I just bought a bunch of factory Glock mags for $21 each, so even factory mags can be affordable. Frankly I'm not worried about the cost of magazines. If I have to buy more I buy more. The point is that these magazines shouldn't develop this issue this easily.
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Old March 28, 2018, 11:40 PM   #11
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I got home tonight to a nice FedEx envelope from S&W. I opened it to find 5 new magazines and nothing else (I had included a copy of the original post hoping to maybe get some ideas, but to be fair it was sent to more of a receptionist, not the warranty department). The interesting thing was they sent me two 2.0 Compact magazines, and three fullsize mags. I imagine someone thought they were doing me a favor in doing this, I mean who doesn't like more capacity. Thing is I sort of liked them all that capacity since that's what I plan to carry in the pistol and it makes sense to train with them all in that capacity (though I could carry the larger ones as backup magazines). Also the 2.0 Compact magazines are harder to find than the fullsize.

I included a picture because I noticed something interesting. On the far left is the 2.0 Compact magazine, and then the center and right are fullsize mags. Looks like they switched baseplate designs at some point. My guess is the far right, which matches the 2.0 Compact, is the newer model as both the baseplate locking method and logos appear the same as the Compact magazine, which is the newest design of the two. What's interesting is the older design has a tab on the spring plate that catches on the baseplate rather than the cylinder and has a solid shelf that catches on the front of the magazine body instead of the bump (the shelf is also wider than the bump). The spring plate is also made of polymer on the older design. The baseplate actually shifts around more on the older design, maybe 1/16", but it seems to me it would be less likely to have the issue I'm encountering currently, both from the design and materials. I also notice that the spring plate on the newer design fullsize magazines sits more flush in the baseplate than on the compact magazines.



Anyway, maybe some of this has been useful to people. I'd like to test these mags, but I want to keep at least two compact magazines in good shape in case the issue happens again and now I only have two.
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Old March 29, 2018, 10:17 PM   #12
Ride Madone
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Me Too

A few weeks back I was in a public restroom at a park, and my S&W 2.0 Compact was dragging my pants down onto the filthy floor. I usually don't, but I pulled my gun out and set it on the TP holder which was about two feet off of the concrete floor. Someone entered the stall next to me and when he shut his door, my gun fell to the floor. I am guessing it landed on the magazine and it (the magazine) exploded. The baseplate hit the ceiling and my rounds went EVERYWHERE including the stall next to me. I collected 13 rounds and had to ask the guy in the other stall if he could kick my rounds out which he did. When I got home I ordered aftermarket baseplates for all my S&W magazines so I could avoid this very embarrassing situation from occurring again.
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Old March 29, 2018, 11:22 PM   #13
TunnelRat
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Wow, that doesn’t fill me with a lot of confidence. Would you mind sharing what baseplates you ordered?


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Old March 30, 2018, 09:00 AM   #14
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Quote:
A few weeks back I was in a public restroom at a park, and my S&W 2.0 Compact was dragging my pants down onto the filthy floor. I usually don't, but I pulled my gun out and set it on the TP holder which was about two feet off of the concrete floor. Someone entered the stall next to me and when he shut his door, my gun fell to the floor. I am guessing it landed on the magazine and it (the magazine) exploded. The baseplate hit the ceiling and my rounds went EVERYWHERE including the stall next to me. I collected 13 rounds and had to ask the guy in the other stall if he could kick my rounds out which he did. When I got home I ordered aftermarket baseplates for all my S&W magazines so I could avoid this very embarrassing situation from occurring again.
I'm sorry that happened to you, but your description of the event is hilarious. It's awesome that the person in the stall next to you was cool about it. This whole thread is interesting. I haven't had this problem with mine. I guess I don't drop on concrete though. Where I shoot most of the time in the desert is sandy and rocky.... but still, I guess i would have expected to see it.

The compact base pad definitely does have that slight downward curve towards the front, but even my old 1.0 compact had that. I think it's just the design. I would like to try the 10-8/Apex base plates.
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Old March 30, 2018, 10:00 AM   #15
TunnelRat
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M&P 2.0 Compact: A Head's Up On Potential Magazine Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Malice View Post
I'm sorry that happened to you, but your description of the event is hilarious. It's awesome that the person in the stall next to you was cool about it. This whole thread is interesting. I haven't had this problem with mine. I guess I don't drop on concrete though. Where I shoot most of the time in the desert is sandy and rocky.... but still, I guess i would have expected to see it.

The compact base pad definitely does have that slight downward curve towards the front, but even my old 1.0 compact had that. I think it's just the design. I would like to try the 10-8/Apex base plates.


Thanks it’s good to know the curve is there regardless. I couldn’t remember from when I got them.

I actually used my 1.0 Compact on the same floor for the same class years ago (I wanted to do a refresher). Never had the issue with those. In taking apart the mags last night these ones seem to have a more pronounced bump on the spring plate. Maybe I did have a bad batch? I also found that how far around the magazine spring loop the spring plate is attached does affect how flush the spring plate seats in the baseplate.


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Last edited by TunnelRat; March 30, 2018 at 10:37 AM.
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Old April 1, 2018, 01:02 PM   #16
Ride Madone
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Apex Tactical 10-8 from Amazon.
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Old April 1, 2018, 01:17 PM   #17
TunnelRat
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And they fit okay? I'd like to see a picture of it if possible.
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Old April 1, 2018, 01:21 PM   #18
Ride Madone
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Here are a couple of photo's.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0172.jpg (191.3 KB, 95 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0173.jpg (186.7 KB, 91 views)
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Old April 1, 2018, 01:28 PM   #19
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Not perfect, but I would rather they work than fit exactly perfect. I dropped one of my magazines fully loaded about 20 times the other day and I had no failures. I was dropping them from about five feet with the new base plate of course.
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Old April 1, 2018, 01:33 PM   #20
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Thanks for the info!
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Old April 1, 2018, 03:48 PM   #21
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I almost wish I never saw this thread. I never noticed the curved baseplate before, now my OCD won’t let me not think about it. Might be buying some after market baseplates too. Thanks for the good info and enlightenment.

But I’ve never had my 2.0 compact in a class or dropped in a bathroom or dropped at all for that matter. I just wish S&W could’ve made a decent fitting baseplate from the get go.
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Old April 1, 2018, 04:19 PM   #22
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M&P 2.0 Compact: A Head's Up On Potential Magazine Issue

FWIW I dropped the full-size magazines ten times or so a piece with no issues. When I get some replacement compact magazines I’ll do another round. I do note that on mine even when they do shift they don’t come off the magazine body.

For me I’ve had a lot of S&W products now. There’s always some minor QC issue. I like the brand and I love the designs, but my luck with them is what it is.


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Old April 11, 2018, 11:02 AM   #23
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Minior FYI, TunnelRat, I ordered a set of the Apex 10-8 base pads to try out on my 2.0 Compact. I should have them on Friday and will take some photos and start testing them.

As mentioned, I haven't had a problem with them coming apart, but the bowed lip on the base pad annoys me, so we'll see how they fit. I know they are made for the full size magazines, so I'm curious to see what it's like on the smaller compact.

Will update accordingly.
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Old April 11, 2018, 11:51 AM   #24
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Thanks let me know! The full-size mags I got from S&W have been dropped a bunch now with no issues. I have new Compact mags coming this week so it will be interesting to see how those fair. I have a course this weekend and if they get here on time I'll bring them.

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Old April 14, 2018, 09:16 AM   #25
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Posted a stand-alone review with photos of the Apex base pads. I think they will help.

https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho....php?p=6601073
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