Unfinished AR upper: pistol or rifle ?

[kymasabe]

I'm aware that the ATF might be seriously putting the screws to AR pistol builds in a week or so and that braces and shorty barrels might end up in the SBR realm whether we like it or not.
That being said...I'm at an impasse. I have a nearly complete pistol build, last item needed was the barrel, and I'm seeing some great barrel pricing but...
...should I bother, and risk having to possibly register it as an SBR in the near future, along with the forms, and waiting period, and expense involved with that process? OR, should I just ditch the brace and buy a rifle barrel?

I'm curious what the collective mind is thinking these days?
If it was your build, what would you do ?

FYI, I was thinking carbine length gas, so I bought a 10" carbon fiber free float handguard, and a KAK micro flash can, was trying to keep the build short and light (was going to buy 10.5 inch barrel). Now, I'm not sure I want to use either piece on a 16" barrel.

[dogtown tom]

kymasabe I'm aware that the ATF might be seriously putting the screws to AR pistol builds in a week or so...

Aware how?
ATF isn't changing anything in regards to anything to do with AR pistol builds.

They have proposed regulating pistols that have an "arm brace" attached. Don't attach an arm brace and nothing affects you.

[Shadow9mm]

Its far more than the arm braces. See the ATF form 4999 that goes with the regulations.https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...worksheet-4999

My thoughts, go 16in. A 10in rail is plenty good imho. Micro flash can would not be my choice, but its not a bad option. But its your build.

[taylorce1]

GOA Pistol Point Calculator will walk you through your pistol or pistol build to figure what is legal under the proposed rule change. I went down the list and my .300 BLK pistol still qualifies as a pistol.

Some things I took away from the calculator, SBA3/4 braces will automatically make you an SBR und the proposed changes. With a 7.5" barrel with a flash hider installed and my blade brace set to 10.5" LOP I'm 25" total length. So a 10.5" barrel with flash hider will make most AR pistols an SBR under the proposed changes.

Fixed or no brace on a buffer tube is your best bet for passing as a pistol. Pistol buffer tubes without adjustment notches are your friend. The only acceptable sights are reflex or pistol/scout scopes. MBUS costs you extra points and a short eye relief optic makes you automatically an SBR. You also had better have straps long enough to be used on your brace.

The last take away was, even if you pass the pistol point worksheet any ATF agent can still rule your pistol an SBR if they want to.

[kymasabe]

Originally Posted by Shadow9mm

Its far more than the arm braces. See the ATF form 4999 that goes with the regulations.https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...worksheet-4999

My thoughts, go 16in. A 10in rail is plenty good imho. Micro flash can would not be my choice, but its not a bad option. But its your build.

I'm kinda thinkin' that might be the way to go for now, and skip all the other nonsense.
I'll deal with building an SBR later.
Flash can was for the pistol build, I'll get another flash hider or brake for a 16" build.

[taylorce1]

@dogtown tom, they aren't just after the brace. They're wanting to kill the AR pistol market completely. Even without the brace you can fail to meet the requirements on the 4999 to be a pistol.

[kymasabe]

...took Shadow's advice, bought another Bushmaster QRC barrel, 16 inch, nice and light.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by kymasabe

...took Shadow's advice, bought another Bushmaster QRC barrel, 16 inch, nice and light.

Never tried a bushmaster barrel. You said another so I'm assuming the first one was good. I just got a 16in Faxon gunner profile with a pinned gas block as an upgrade for my ar. I saw their series with inrange tv on barrels and barrel making and have been dying to try one ever since. Hoping to go break it in here soon, been so busy lately. my old barrel, a brownells, got passed down to my sons build. It was in good shape, lots of life left. held a little over moa with training grade ammo. moa with my match hand loads.

[kymasabe]

Originally Posted by Shadow9mm

Never tried a bushmaster barrel. You said another so I'm assuming the first one was good.

Another QRC Barrel? Yes, I'm running one on a light build, and my daughter has one too.
Better accuracy than I was expecting for a pencil barrel. Keep in mind, it's no heavy, fluted SPR barrel, don't expect sub MOA from it. It's a light, fast, easy to handle, carry-all-day, barrel that gets the job done nicely. I haven't run one really hot and heavy yet so I can't report how the groups open up once she heats up. But, 5.56 with 16 inch, nitrided, carbine gas, 1:8 twist...check all the boxes I was looking for, and it comes with a pinned gas block and barrel nut. Bushmaster has them on their website for over $200, I've been buying mine at RightToBear for under $100. My KAK mid length gas lightweight barrel absolutely outshoots it (as does my B.A. Hanson barrel), but for $79 plus shipping, I'm not complaining, I know it's limitations and I'm OK with it.
I'm running mine with a Sig MSR red dot and getting 3 inch groups on average ( at 100 yards) with my old eyes. I'd image it's capable of much better with the right shooter and the right optic.

[stagpanther]

@dogtown tom, they aren't just after the brace. They're wanting to kill the AR pistol market completely. Even without the brace you can fail to meet the requirements on the 4999 to be a pistol.

That was my take as well at first--"death points" could also be assigned according to optics types, additional attachments etc. After reading the list I was under the impression that ALL pistols/handguns could possbly be under the threat of the same rules--BUT the Ruling title says "FACTORING CRITERIA FOR RIFLED BARREL WEAPONS WITH ACCESSORIES* commonly referred to as “STABILIZING BRACES”--which I take to mean a countdown list for any type of pistol with a brace. My pistols don't have braces of any kind--so my conclusion is that the rest of the criteria are irrelevant (except for pre-existing ones that already cover handguns/pistols).

[wild cat mccane]

like you thought... I'd just go rifle.

Where you are at, we're not even talking about a single part change that will make it be a rifle from your non barrelled pistol that is over any amount of money. The barrel you don't have would dictate the gas system. I don't think there will be much room for financial outrage in this situation. You are financially where you'd be with a rifle, minus the pistol tube. Most pistol lowers are cheaper from what I've seen because they don't give you a rear stock anyways.

The barrel on a braced "pistol" is the most expensive part, next is the receiver which doesn't care how you configure it...

Buy a rifle tube and move on. The difference you are talking is less than my pinky to thumb, not stretching hard. And I have small hands I'd spend my disappointment in buying a wicked comfy stock just to feel better about it

[imashooter]

I reckon it's a personal decision for you OP. I have more than one pistol and to quote a great American, "from my cold, dead hands".

[taylorce1]

Originally Posted by stagpanther

-BUT the Ruling title says "FACTORING CRITERIA FOR RIFLED BARREL WEAPONS WITH ACCESSORIES* commonly referred to as “STABILIZING BRACES”

I agree the first iteration of this rule only applies to the brace itself. What happens if they decide to change the definition of the rule on a stabilizing brace to where it includes a buffer tube in the designation? I really don't think this will be the end of it under this administration.

I'm hoping that this gets shot down like the EPA did in Federal court. Where SCOTUS said that congress has to pass these as laws, and not rules or guidance set by an administrative agency. I also hope that is why we haven't heard much on the rule since it was taken to the White House on the 8th.

[9x19]

I think THEY have already achieved as much as THEY can hope for, just through rumors.

I'm going to be surprised if it actually gets published in the Federal Register, between the SCOTUS ruling against the EPA, and US Rep. Jim Jordan's letter, along with his upcoming chairmanship of the House Judiciary committee...

When, as and IF, they publish that rule, I'll have 30 days to decide... but until that point, I'll just keep enjoying my braced pistols.

[GeauxTide]

I went with an 8" .45acp. Uses Glock mags and it is fantastic.