45-70 deer loads

Nathan · February 11, 2015, 12:33 PM

Looking to load ideas for a 45-70 for hunting deer with a Ruger #1.

Seems like the 250gr bullet can be loaded to go 2600fps for the best 0-300yd trajectory...

I was thinking 325FTX, but the 250 should have less recoil.

Your thoughts for 0-300yd deer?

Also looking for a "ouch" load that is close to 458 Win Mag!

Snyper · February 11, 2015, 12:43 PM

Use whatever is most accurate in your gun, since any 45 cal bullet will perform well on deer
I think lighter and faster will give you the bettr trajectories, since realistically most shots will be under 200 yds

T. O'Heir · February 11, 2015, 03:12 PM

300 is optimistic for a .45-70 with any bullet. Hornady's 325 FTX drops 27" when sighted in 3" high at 100. 42" for a Winchester 300 sighted in 0 at 100. Hornady's 250 is below marginal energy wise at 300 too. 636 ft-lbs. All of 'em drop like bricks past 200ish in both trajectory and energy. .45-70 is a 200 yard max cartridge.
Where you are hunting matters a lot though. Get many 300 yards shots on deer where you are?

**44 AMP** · February 11, 2015, 04:07 PM

I don't know about the 250s. I do know that when you push the Hornady 350gr to 2200fps (possible in a ruger) it gets into the "ouch" level, especially if you are shooting a No.3!!!

The .45-70 isn't a 200yd cartridge, it isn't a 300 yd cartridge, it is, like all of them, dependent on the shooter's ability. Drop is a constant, you can compensate for it easily. IF YOU CAN ACCURATELY JUDGE THE RANGE!!!

And that's the key, right there, being able to accurately range the target. (we'll leave wind out of it, for now,

)

With a flatter shooting round, a mis-estimation of the range isn't nearly as critical. Being "off" by 20 yards (or whatever) at 2-300 yards with a flat shooting round still means a good hit in the boiler room of a typical big game animal. Being off the same amount at long(er) range with a round like the .45-70 can mean a wounding shot, or a clean miss. You have to be able to accurately judge the range, AND be able to correctly compensate for the drop. Do that right, and you get hits at any range. Flat shooting rounds allow for a greater margin of error and still get good hits. Easier, but not better.

Where are you getting .458" 250gr bullets? I don't know how a 250gr will shoot from the 1-20" twist of a Ruger No.1. Not even sure if they will stabilize, or if they do, what kind of groups you will get. .45 handguns firing 250gr bullets use a 1-16" twist, generally.

Also, a word of advice, choose your bullet selection CAREFULLY for the velocity range you are going to be shooting. A bullet like the Speer 400gr FP, that is built to give expansion at traditional .45-70 speeds becomes explosively expansive when you up the speed to 458 levels (or close).

NoSecondBest · February 11, 2015, 05:16 PM

44 AMP said it all. I own several 45-70s and they aren't varmit rifles. They're are not flat shooting and I can tell you for a fact that the very light bullets won't even shoot that well. If you want a flat shooting rifle get something else. In this case, you just can't get there from here.

Nathan · February 11, 2015, 07:13 PM

Whoa! Not looking for a flat shooting round. Looking for a 45-70....it's the law in OH!

So, I have the 45-70....that's fixed.

I was asking about ideal bullet weights for deer.

I show 970 ft lbs at 300 yds with the 250 gr bullet. I must be doing something wrong??

Forgot to look at energy, but with a BDC scope, hits at 300 are very real. The round is about 30" low at 300 with all bullets I've looked at.

BTW, most shots are gonna be around 100 yards.

Also, any ideas on a fun high recoil loads to shoot with open sights?

Jeffm004 · February 11, 2015, 08:41 PM

This is why rifles, any rifle, was so hard to get legal in ohio. You cannot say the 45-70 is inaccurate. It is awesome artillery. In the day I spent summers with a Dillon and a prairie dog town using mostly a .270. 300 yards is a long way unless you are prone with a bag.

My rule with the kids and thus myself is no shots further than you can put three in a pie plate standing, no time limit.

The 45-70 arc is almost identical to the 12 gauge sabot, you buy nothing with the change but I love carrying a rifle again.

As to load, hornaday 350s for the show, berry 350s for the range. I'm still working the powder myself. The 405 lead at 100 can be dialed in as well. I plan to find and chase some ohio pigs this year.

Nathan · February 11, 2015, 09:17 PM

Jeff,

....3 into a pie plate standing....

So, my 12 ga is a ~50 yd gun.....

My 45-70 ought to be about a ~???yd gun? My AR might go 200 by this measure...

I too like having rifle accuracy, rifle reloading and rifle triggers! I'm sorry, but shotguns suck!

GeauxTide · February 11, 2015, 11:35 PM

I've loaded 35gr of H4198 under 405 Hard Cast from Missouri Bullets. They shoot 1500fps and is the limit of my recoil tolerance in the 7.5# M1895 with a big ole KickEZE pad. It can be loaded to 1900fps, but not for me. As others have stated, 150 yards is the practical limit for a moderate trajectory.

trobin · February 12, 2015, 12:32 AM

My CVA Optima Elite is sighted 5" high at a 100 yards and comes in 2" low at 200" using the Hornady 325 gr FTX. Shot at 8 deer and have killed 8 deer. I'm looking into reloading the 300 gr pointed soft point Barnes Original once they make another run.

**44 AMP** · February 12, 2015, 02:14 AM

Quote:

I was asking about ideal bullet weights for deer.

250gr is what I shoot out of my .45 Colt revolver.

Any of the usual .45-70 bullets, jacketed or cast will do fine for deer at any range you can make a clean killing hit. Period.

You mention a 250gr @ 2600fps for 970ft/lbs at 300yds. I don't have that particular combination in my tables, but it seem about right.

A 500gr @ 1600fps (which can be done in the Ruger) will give you 1331fpe at 300 yards. Note how the slower, heavier bullet, despite a 1000fps slower starting speed, has over 1/3 MORE energy at 300yds!

AND, it will give you all the recoil you want, until you get to actual .458 win mag, trust me on that!

tdoyka · February 15, 2015, 01:06 AM

handload

45-70 handi-rifle
405gr fnfp
h4198 27.0gr - 31.0gr

i don't have a scope and only go to 125yards. if i want to go further there's a tc encore with a 23" mgm barrel in 444 marlin and 265gr ranch dogs which go to 200-250 yards.

take it easy, deer will be there. i'm not trying to make you mad

eastbank · February 15, 2015, 04:38 AM

i shoot a ruger #3 with a 4x leupold scope and 300gr hornaday bullets with a heavy dose of 4198 is my hunting load(not target) and is running close to 2000fps. the longest shot at a deer was 165 yrds from a rest and i aimed what i judged to be 6 inches over the front shoulders and it when straight down. with out a good rest i don,t think i would have shot at it. most deer i,ve killed were with the 45-70 were under 100yds. double lung shots are deadly and no meat is wasted. eastbank.

flashhole · February 15, 2015, 11:09 AM

My 45-70 load for my Guide Gun is a Hornady 350 grain bullet over a near max charge of H-4895. I outfitted the gun with a Burris Fullfield II scope with the BDC reticle. Zeroed at 100 yards the first tick down on the scope hits bullseye at 150 yards, the second tick down hits bullseye at 200 yards. This was not by design, just happened to work out that way.

I started casting my own 340 grain bullets and using Varget powder I get about the same performance on target as with the other load. My daughter uses this load for deer hunting.

Nathan · February 15, 2015, 12:09 PM

Thanks Flashhole. . .that's what i'm talking about.

flashhole · February 15, 2015, 04:26 PM

Glad you found it helpful. I've tried lots of components and loads and these are the ones I find make the most sense for the hunting I do here in NY. If I were going after big bear I have a 525 grain bullet and load that would give me confidence in the field. For deer, 325-350 grain 45-70 stuff is very reliable at modest ranges out to 200 yards. If I know I'm going to be presented with longer distance shots I take my 7mm RM and even then I use heavy-for-caliber bullets.

Drm50 · February 16, 2015, 07:37 PM

I'm another Ohio deer hunter. I had 45/70s for 40yrs. Old 1895 Marlin and #1.
To shoot flattest and be accurate the lightest bullet practical was 300gr. Shoots
good in both rifles. I'm loading Hornady 300 Jhp / IMR 4198 at approx. 2000fps.
My big mistake was taking reciever sight off Marlin and scoping it. I was use to
shooting with them and was good at cranking for distance. I had side plate
marked from 100 to 300yds. With scope I would have be guessing holdover.
Going back to peeps next season. Have shot deer in WVA out to 150yds, with
iron sights. I'm happy to be able to use rifle in Ohio. Will be using slug barrels
for tomatoe stakes. Hunting with slugs is like putting boxing gloves on a piano
player!

Nathan · February 17, 2015, 03:14 PM

^^^can you pay that much for boxing gloves. Man, I am glad to be free of slugs! That barrel will be gone as soon as I get the 45-70 on paper!

February 11, 2015, 12:43 PM	#2
Snyper Senior Member Join Date: December 16, 2013 Location: Eastern NC Posts: 3,047	Use whatever is most accurate in your gun, since any 45 cal bullet will perform well on deer I think lighter and faster will give you the bettr trajectories, since realistically most shots will be under 200 yds __________________ One shot, one kill

February 11, 2015, 04:07 PM	#4
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,833	I don't know about the 250s. I do know that when you push the Hornady 350gr to 2200fps (possible in a ruger) it gets into the "ouch" level, especially if you are shooting a No.3!!! The .45-70 isn't a 200yd cartridge, it isn't a 300 yd cartridge, it is, like all of them, dependent on the shooter's ability. Drop is a constant, you can compensate for it easily. IF YOU CAN ACCURATELY JUDGE THE RANGE!!! And that's the key, right there, being able to accurately range the target. (we'll leave wind out of it, for now, ) With a flatter shooting round, a mis-estimation of the range isn't nearly as critical. Being "off" by 20 yards (or whatever) at 2-300 yards with a flat shooting round still means a good hit in the boiler room of a typical big game animal. Being off the same amount at long(er) range with a round like the .45-70 can mean a wounding shot, or a clean miss. You have to be able to accurately judge the range, AND be able to correctly compensate for the drop. Do that right, and you get hits at any range. Flat shooting rounds allow for a greater margin of error and still get good hits. Easier, but not better. Where are you getting .458" 250gr bullets? I don't know how a 250gr will shoot from the 1-20" twist of a Ruger No.1. Not even sure if they will stabilize, or if they do, what kind of groups you will get. .45 handguns firing 250gr bullets use a 1-16" twist, generally. Also, a word of advice, choose your bullet selection CAREFULLY for the velocity range you are going to be shooting. A bullet like the Speer 400gr FP, that is built to give expansion at traditional .45-70 speeds becomes explosively expansive when you up the speed to 458 levels (or close). __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

February 11, 2015, 07:13 PM	#6
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	Whoa! Not looking for a flat shooting round. Looking for a 45-70....it's the law in OH! So, I have the 45-70....that's fixed. I was asking about ideal bullet weights for deer. I show 970 ft lbs at 300 yds with the 250 gr bullet. I must be doing something wrong?? Forgot to look at energy, but with a BDC scope, hits at 300 are very real. The round is about 30" low at 300 with all bullets I've looked at. BTW, most shots are gonna be around 100 yards. Also, any ideas on a fun high recoil loads to shoot with open sights? Last edited by Nathan; February 11, 2015 at 09:14 PM.

February 15, 2015, 11:09 AM	#14
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 2,000	My 45-70 load for my Guide Gun is a Hornady 350 grain bullet over a near max charge of H-4895. I outfitted the gun with a Burris Fullfield II scope with the BDC reticle. Zeroed at 100 yards the first tick down on the scope hits bullseye at 150 yards, the second tick down hits bullseye at 200 yards. This was not by design, just happened to work out that way. I started casting my own 340 grain bullets and using Varget powder I get about the same performance on target as with the other load. My daughter uses this load for deer hunting. __________________ ,,, stupidity comes to some people very easily. 8/22/2017 my wife in a discussion about Liberals. Are you ready for civil war?

February 15, 2015, 04:26 PM	#16
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 2,000	Glad you found it helpful. I've tried lots of components and loads and these are the ones I find make the most sense for the hunting I do here in NY. If I were going after big bear I have a 525 grain bullet and load that would give me confidence in the field. For deer, 325-350 grain 45-70 stuff is very reliable at modest ranges out to 200 yards. If I know I'm going to be presented with longer distance shots I take my 7mm RM and even then I use heavy-for-caliber bullets. __________________ ,,, stupidity comes to some people very easily. 8/22/2017 my wife in a discussion about Liberals. Are you ready for civil war?

February 11, 2015, 12:33 PM	#1
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	45-70 deer loads Looking to load ideas for a 45-70 for hunting deer with a Ruger #1. Seems like the 250gr bullet can be loaded to go 2600fps for the best 0-300yd trajectory... I was thinking 325FTX, but the 250 should have less recoil. Your thoughts for 0-300yd deer? Also looking for a "ouch" load that is close to 458 Win Mag!

February 11, 2015, 03:12 PM	#3
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	300 is optimistic for a .45-70 with any bullet. Hornady's 325 FTX drops 27" when sighted in 3" high at 100. 42" for a Winchester 300 sighted in 0 at 100. Hornady's 250 is below marginal energy wise at 300 too. 636 ft-lbs. All of 'em drop like bricks past 200ish in both trajectory and energy. .45-70 is a 200 yard max cartridge. Where you are hunting matters a lot though. Get many 300 yards shots on deer where you are? __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

February 11, 2015, 05:16 PM	#5
NoSecondBest Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2009 Location: Western New York Posts: 2,736	44 AMP said it all. I own several 45-70s and they aren't varmit rifles. They're are not flat shooting and I can tell you for a fact that the very light bullets won't even shoot that well. If you want a flat shooting rifle get something else. In this case, you just can't get there from here.

February 11, 2015, 08:41 PM	#7
Jeffm004 Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2013 Location: SW Ohio Posts: 255	This is why rifles, any rifle, was so hard to get legal in ohio. You cannot say the 45-70 is inaccurate. It is awesome artillery. In the day I spent summers with a Dillon and a prairie dog town using mostly a .270. 300 yards is a long way unless you are prone with a bag. My rule with the kids and thus myself is no shots further than you can put three in a pie plate standing, no time limit. The 45-70 arc is almost identical to the 12 gauge sabot, you buy nothing with the change but I love carrying a rifle again. As to load, hornaday 350s for the show, berry 350s for the range. I'm still working the powder myself. The 405 lead at 100 can be dialed in as well. I plan to find and chase some ohio pigs this year.

February 11, 2015, 09:17 PM	#8
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	Jeff, ....3 into a pie plate standing.... So, my 12 ga is a ~50 yd gun..... My 45-70 ought to be about a ~???yd gun? My AR might go 200 by this measure... I too like having rifle accuracy, rifle reloading and rifle triggers! I'm sorry, but shotguns suck!

February 11, 2015, 11:35 PM	#9
GeauxTide Senior Member Join Date: April 20, 2009 Location: Helena, AL Posts: 4,424	I've loaded 35gr of H4198 under 405 Hard Cast from Missouri Bullets. They shoot 1500fps and is the limit of my recoil tolerance in the 7.5# M1895 with a big ole KickEZE pad. It can be loaded to 1900fps, but not for me. As others have stated, 150 yards is the practical limit for a moderate trajectory.

February 12, 2015, 12:32 AM	#10
trobin Senior Member Join Date: February 26, 2013 Location: Louisiana Posts: 133	My CVA Optima Elite is sighted 5" high at a 100 yards and comes in 2" low at 200" using the Hornady 325 gr FTX. Shot at 8 deer and have killed 8 deer. I'm looking into reloading the 300 gr pointed soft point Barnes Original once they make another run.

February 15, 2015, 01:06 AM	#12
tdoyka Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2013 Location: windber, pa Posts: 300	handload 45-70 handi-rifle 405gr fnfp h4198 27.0gr - 31.0gr i don't have a scope and only go to 125yards. if i want to go further there's a tc encore with a 23" mgm barrel in 444 marlin and 265gr ranch dogs which go to 200-250 yards. take it easy, deer will be there. i'm not trying to make you mad

February 15, 2015, 04:38 AM	#13
eastbank Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2008 Location: pa. Posts: 2,450	i shoot a ruger #3 with a 4x leupold scope and 300gr hornaday bullets with a heavy dose of 4198 is my hunting load(not target) and is running close to 2000fps. the longest shot at a deer was 165 yrds from a rest and i aimed what i judged to be 6 inches over the front shoulders and it when straight down. with out a good rest i don,t think i would have shot at it. most deer i,ve killed were with the 45-70 were under 100yds. double lung shots are deadly and no meat is wasted. eastbank.

February 15, 2015, 12:09 PM	#15
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	Thanks Flashhole. . .that's what i'm talking about.

February 16, 2015, 07:37 PM	#17
Drm50 Senior Member Join Date: November 10, 2014 Posts: 1,380	300gr 45/70 I'm another Ohio deer hunter. I had 45/70s for 40yrs. Old 1895 Marlin and #1. To shoot flattest and be accurate the lightest bullet practical was 300gr. Shoots good in both rifles. I'm loading Hornady 300 Jhp / IMR 4198 at approx. 2000fps. My big mistake was taking reciever sight off Marlin and scoping it. I was use to shooting with them and was good at cranking for distance. I had side plate marked from 100 to 300yds. With scope I would have be guessing holdover. Going back to peeps next season. Have shot deer in WVA out to 150yds, with iron sights. I'm happy to be able to use rifle in Ohio. Will be using slug barrels for tomatoe stakes. Hunting with slugs is like putting boxing gloves on a piano player!

February 17, 2015, 03:14 PM	#18
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	^^^can you pay that much for boxing gloves. Man, I am glad to be free of slugs! That barrel will be gone as soon as I get the 45-70 on paper!