Switching from Semi-Auto to S&W 642

[wmg1299]

I've been shooting on a regular basis for almost 15 years, but almost all of my handgun experience has been with semi-autos (mainly Glock). I have always been curious about revolvers, and found a deal on a brand new 642 that I couldn't pass up. In had my first prolonged range session with the 642 today, and shot very poorly from distances 10 yards and over.

I like the gun and plan to keep practicing. I'm not looking to make modifications to the gun, but was curious to know how long it took other new small-frame revolver shooters to develop accuracy at 15-25 yards.

[223 shooter]

The 642 with the heavy long trigger pull, minimal sights, tiny grips and light weight is one of the worst revolvers available for accurate shooting at 15 - 25yards. Very few shooters will be able to fire a 642 anywhere near the level of something like a Glock at very close distances let alone 15 - 25 yards.

I can fire my Smith Shield or little Walther 380 semi auto or far more accurately than I could ever hope to with my 642.

[Bill DeShivs]

One of the most accurate pistols I ever shot was a S&W model 60.
The snub guns are very accurate, if you do your part.

[UncleEd]

If you've learned and were proficient with double
action revolvers shot in DA, you'll find all other
handguns easy. See Lucky Gunner site for
analysis of why revolver shooting is the basis
for good handgun handling.

The Smith J-frames have always had extremely
heavy DA triggers compared to the Smith K and
L frames or Ruger GP-100. It's a safety factor
among other things.

While many have become proficient with the J-frames
at reasonable handgun distances, they are in
practical use for the average shooter out to about
5 yards which is really the distances those gun
were intended.

The Ruger polymer revolvers, the LCRs, in comparison
have really smooth, easy DA triggers and one of those
might surprise you and perhaps your ability at
handling it.

[tranders]

The Airweights are a joy to carry,but difficult to shoot without lots of practice.

In my opinion the snubs are for the very experienced shooter.

[HighValleyRanch]

I shoot my lightweight snubs as accurately as any of my other semi's. But with the snubs and DA only, I use very different trigger techniques and hold.

For the longer double action pull get a deep hook on the trigger instead of the finger pad press. This will give more strength on the pull. For accuracy, learn how to stage the trigger.
This means feeling when the cylinder locksup right before the trigger break. So you are taking up half the pull before the final break. Sometimes the final break will have a clean wall, others might be more a rolling break. Just pull through the break and concentrate on a steady hold accepting your amount of wobble. The worst thing that you can do with a DA only revolver is to jerk the trigger. Yes you can do a smooth pull through trigger break as well, but that is more like a condensed surprise shot.

Get a very high hold on the gun. With some of the hump back and LCR's you can get much higher hold than semi's. With no hammer to worry about hammer bite, you can use the thumb over the back technique to help with recoil on the super light guns. A rubber grips that covers the backstrap will help with heavier loads.

[2damnold4this]

Grips that fit your hand, proper trigger technique and lots and lots of dry fire/snap cap practice will help.

[unit 900]

I carried a J frame 36 for 20 years as an off duty gun before we transitioned to Glocks. The qual course was modified to a max distance of 15 yards vs. the 25 for a service revolver. Sights and trigger pull work against practical accuracy. Practice and patience can offset that. Staging the trigger is great for range accuracy. I would caution against that approach (apologies to High Valley Ranch) for self defense use. The break point between staged and discharged can be razor thin. At typical SD range, a smooth pull with the first finger joint on the trigger always worked for me. Snap caps and practice will get you where you want to be.

[HighValleyRanch]

No, I agree that staging should not be used for self defense. But it's practical for learning trigger control for someone new at revolvers. That's why I talked about the pull through "condensed suprise shot"

[scsov509]

Snap caps and practice will get you where you want to be.

+1!! My wife got me a 642 for an anniversary gift almost 15 years ago, and it took me about 3-4 months to get to where I could shoot with consistent accuracy out to 25 yards. The key for me was lots of dryfire practice to learn the trigger and build the muscle memory/strength in my hands to consistently operate the trigger while keeping the sights on target until the sear broke. I also spent a lot of time with snap caps practicing my reloads until I could also do that quickly and consistently. You can gain and awful lot of proficiency through simple dryfire practice.

One idea you may consider, I know you said you're not looking at upgrades right now, but for about $25 the Apex Tactical Duty/Carry Spring Kit is an exceptional upgrade. It lightened my trigger by about 3lbs and has still been 100% reliable, and I highly recommend it as an inexpensive way to greatly improve the shootability of a little revolver. Whether you do that or not though, lots of dryfire is key with the little snubbie.

[HighValleyRanch]

....and you don't have to rack the slide each time to dry fire!

[scsov509]

....and you don't have to rack the slide each time to dry fire!

True story!

[James K]

Uncle Ed wrote: "The Smith J-frames have always had extremely
heavy DA triggers compared to the Smith K and L frames or Ruger GP-100. It's a safety factor among other things."

Small guns usually have small, light hammers, so the hammer has to have a stronger spring to achieve the same force as a heavier hammer and ensure firing. There are few "tricks" to change that, so I can only recommend practice, practice.

Jim

[Minorcan]

The S&W Model 60 has a heavy DA trigger but use the hammer and go to SA and the trigger is wonderfully light. The hammer spring can be lightened as well. Knowledge, practice and technique can turn a 10 yard shooter in to an accurate 25 yard shooter. Not for the beginner but achievable with practice.

[redlevel42]

I consider a 2 inch j-frame to be a ten yard max piece.
With practice, one can become somewhat proficient beyond
that range.

Lots of dry fire. Also, if you have or can find a .22 caliber j-frame
Kit gun, it really helps you to learn trigger control. I have fired
thousands of rounds through my Model 63. Lots of fun, and lots of
good practice.

Someone mentioned the Apex spring kit. I purchased a 442 for my wife
with the Apex kit already installed. I much prefer the Wolff kits I installed
in my 642 and my daughter’s 442. The Apex gun feels almost mushy. It
seems to be reliable, though. We put several hundred rounds through it
with no problems.

[wmg1299]

I appreciate the tips, and plan to work on staging the trigger. I am actually looking forward to the challenge.

[Model12Win]

You most likely will NEVER need the gun at that distance.

3 shots.
3 yards.
3 seconds.

That's all you'll ever need. As long as you can keep all shots (3 shots fired in 3 seconds) on a paper plate from 3 yards away, you'll be golden.

[scsov509]

Someone mentioned the Apex spring kit. I purchased a 442 for my wife
with the Apex kit already installed. I much prefer the Wolff kits I installed
in my 642 and my daughter’s 442. The Apex gun feels almost mushy. It
seems to be reliable, though. We put several hundred rounds through it
with no problems.

Wolff makes great springs, and Wilson Combat also makes a spring kit that I've felt on a friend's gun and liked. I've had good luck with Apex kits though and haven't felt like any of the triggers I felt were mushy at all. The Apex kit also includes an aftermarket firing pin which is a little longer and heavier to reduce the possibility of light strikes, and I can't say I've had any problems with my 642 since installing that kit several years ago.

[Bill DeShivs]

You most likely will never need the gun at all.
If you are going to carry a gun, learn to shoot it-and learn to shoot it a further than 3 yards.
Learn to shoot 5 inch groups at 25 yards. If you can do that, you can damn sure hit something at 3 yards.

[Minorcan]

Many posters state that 2” S&W J Frames aren’t accurate past 10 yards. Then mention they are using the 642 which is a hammerless DA only trigger. If you go to the Model 60 it can be fired DA or Single Action and the SA trigger is excellent which makes for much tighter groups farther out. Also if you put that cute little revolver in a vice and fire it you’ll find it to be very consistent at 25 yards. The inaacuracy is dependent on the trigger action used and the shooter. It’s not fair to group all 2” S&W revolvers together.

[slabside 1911]

The Ruger LCR trigger put the S+W J frames to shame. Yeah I know it’s not the best looking revolver but I’ve had mine for three years and put hundreds of rounds through it and love it there’s no comparison and believe me I’ve owned my share of J frames over the years. Once you get used to the trigger reset on the Ruger you love it.

[UncleEd]

I guess the OP set the ball rolling down the
road about shooting at 15 to 25 yards.

Of course J-frames can be shot accurately
at those distances but that's not the purpose
of a defensive revolver in that size.

Those talking about their shooting accurately
out to 25 yards with a J-frame are not, I would
bet, talking about letting loose two or three
quick accurate shots in double action after a speed draw
or even not so speedy a draw.

The mistake the OP made is buying a J-frame
when his expectations would be better suited
to a K-, L- or GP-100 frame sized revolvers,
even with say a 3-inch barrel.

[2damnold4this]

You may want to purchase the book by Grant Cunningham: Protect Yourself With Your Snubnose Revolver

[David R]

25 yards, 1 7/8" Airweight 38. Model 637 fired Double Action.

It can be done
David

38.jpg

[peterg7]

OP now you know why you got a deal


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