CMP Distinguished

[Shooter2675]

I am thinking of getting into high power shooting with an AR-15. It seems the CMP distinguished badge is one of the highest honors a shooter can achieve, and thus I want to make that one of my long-term goals. I would like to know how difficult that is, provided that one shoots all five allowed matches per year. I am not a bad shot, but my eyes are not very good, so the new optics rule seems to be good for me. Anyways, if I were to practice a good bit and hand load my own ammo (I have been hand loading for several years now) and build a new AR upper with a good barrel, how difficult is it to learn leg points. I know it is is not easy, but I think is a good goal for me, or any other shooter, to set their sights on.

Thank you,

John

[darkgael]

You have read through all of the info on this site:
https://ct.thecmp.org/app/v1/index.p...er_value=RIFLE

Pete

[Shooter2675]

Yes, I have scoured the CMP website. I read a lot of the rule book as well, but I still have some questions. For instance, what scores are normally near the top at the various distances? Also, I was just wondering how difficult it is to get LEG points, and if you need to be a world class shooter to get any points.

Thank you,

John

[darkgael]

No, you do not have to be a world class shooter....but you do have to be good and persistent.
What kinds of scores will get you Leg points depends on the quality of the shooters at a particular match and how many of them there are.
You do, however, have to shoot a minimum of 455/500 regardless of the rest of the pack.
If I am at a match and there are thirty shooters trying for a leg, I have to be in the top 10%....if, however, I come in third with a score of 454....I am not awarded points. If i come in first with a score of 454, I am not awarded points.
Pete

[Shooter2675]

Thank you Pete, that was very helpful. How many shooters could I expect to be at an EIC match? Not Camp Perry, but at a small rifle EIC match.

[darkgael]

How many at a particular match??
Sorry, I cannot answer that one.

Pete

[4EVERM-14]

Shooter2675,
Working towards the Distinguished Badge can be a thrilling experience. It is a difficult challenge but certainly within reach. It is one of my greatest memories.
Like darkgael posted you have to be persistent. I know of one shooter,a personal friend, who took 29 years to earn his badge. The limited number of opportunities adds to the anxiety which,if unchecked, can lead to rookie mistakes.
My best advice is to shoot as many regular matches as possible. Get used to the match experience so when the EIC match comes up you will take it as just another day. Keep an accurate data book. With no sighters you'll need to know your rifle. Stay mentally upbeat. Shoot your best and wait for the results.
And don't buy lottery tickets. You don't want to waste any good luck. LOL

[P-990]

How many shooters you can expect at an EIC match varies by locale. Most of the LEG matches I've been to around New England have 30-40 shooters.

As for scores? If you're an NRA Master-class Highpower shooter, you have a pretty good chance of making LEG points. An Expert-level shooter may or may not, depends on the local competition. I earned my first hard leg with a 470-something at the end of a 3-day Memorial Day Weekend at Camp Ethan Allen in Vermont. (I think I was 2nd overall, 1st non-Distinguished.) My last EIC match, (and last Highpower match in the last 5 years incidentally) I was 1st non-Distinguished and 3rd overall with a 490 at Nashua Fish and Game in Merrimack, NH.

Basically, learn how to shoot off of your feet and keep your shots in the middle at 600, and go to work. You'll get there with time and persistence.

(I keep thinking I should go shoot enough to finish off my DR badge. I think I need 4 more LEG points to hit the required 30.)

[Shooter2675]

Thank you. I know the number of shooters at the competition was tough to answer, but I really I no idea if it was like 30 or 200 for a small competition.

Thank you.

[Unclenick]

Just to be clear, P-990 meant shooting well off your hands while standing, and not literally being off your feet (the sitting and prone positions).

Rehearse your positions at your local range. Develop a sequence of moves into each position that you memorize like a martial arts kata, and then go through every one, without fail, every time. And not just the obvious stuff, like setting up your ammo and sling and putting on your "ears" and making your sight come-ups and windage adjustment, but include taking out and positioning your stop watch, score book, and even your pencil. Put a target number under your target if your club doesn't have them. This is so you stay in the habit of checking that number as you bring the gun into position. Having a routine like this for each position will stop you from leaving something out and can save you from cross-firing if you get excited during a match. Do the same thing dry firing in the basement at home (10 foot practice target for standing and sitting attached).

Don't ever make any sort of last minute changes in equipment or routine just before an actual match. That's a rookie mistake. (Don't ask me how I know.) If, at the last second, you suddenly get this great idea for something that might raise your score, write it down and try it at your next rehearsal, but never do it for the first time at a match.

Check your zeros and come-ups at the local range. My prone windage zero is always about an moa right of my sitting and offhand due to some fluke in my shoulder geometry that introduces a recoil moment that moves the POI left in prone. With iron sights, at 600 yards I am always a couple of moa below table or computer predicted come-ups just because of how my eyes find the bottom edge of the bull. Use a computer to say how high your bullet should be on the 100 yard paper when you are zeroed at 600 yards. It will be around 18". Just make your backer tall enough to capture that on a target center placed at the predicted height above the aiming center so you can score it and make any necessary adjustment.

[4EVERM-14]

The number of shooters will always vary. Matches connected with regional or state championships usually brings a bigger crowd. Also the number of legs and the value of the legs will be determined by the participation. My first points came at a match with 155 non distinguished. But I have assisted at events with as few as 18. Don't know if that answers the question. EIC matches are the real marksmanship test both of equipment and shooter. Any success in one should be a proud and fulfilling time.

[kraigwy]

To give you an idea of the scores needed, this is the results of last week's EIC match at the OK City CMP games.

These are lower then normal but it will give you a idea of what to shoot for.

https://ct.thecmp.org/app/v1/index.p...63&tab=results

First match I've seen where scopes were allowed. From what I've seen, they don't seem to be much of a benefit. But its just one example.

I'm not eligible since I got my DR badge, but I think next year I'm going to shoot "out of competition" with a M1903A3 just to see what happens.

[Randy A]

All crutial advice, many have heard these words before but there is so much truth to them, "The winner of a match isn't necessarily the best shooter, they just happen to be the one that made the fewest mistakes."
That is the key, practice and make sure you develop good habits and do everything the same every time. Changing up your routine will lead to inconsistency, identify and eliminate any issues or bad habits immediately.
Same thing goes with equipment, if it doesn't fit or work right get rid of it. Trying to cope with or "make do" will cost you. Slings, jackets, butt stocks, all of it has to fit and work right. For example, if you have short arms and find that the pull of an A2 stock it too long, you can install an A1 stock (it's 5/8 inch shorter). What I'm getting at, is don't under estimate its effects and convince yourself that you can adapt.

Know your weapon and have a well rehearsed routine. There are some good DVDs out there too, grab some from the AMU.

[Hummer70]

For some it is hard, for some it is a breeze. For instance I have heard of young new shooters going Distinguished in one season ! ! ! !

I shot for ten years before I got mine as I was primarily a bolt gun shooter and I shot the leg matches because they were there. I would have made it quicker had I had a good M1 earlier. When I got my M1A rebarreled with a NM barrel and bedded correctly I took off.

For the older guys that shot at Perry Joe Smith was one of the head honchos and I knew he was going to retire so I pushed and legged out about two weeks before he retired. I called him and told him I wanted to be the last one he signed a Distinguished Certificate for as his last official act.

He signed it and added a note it was not his last official act as he next submitted a leave slip to take all his leave time he had not used and was walking out the door right then.

It used to be quite hard as the military had the clear advantage of having access to MATCH ammo every day and we did not so it was hard just getting zeros. When the MATCH ammo dried up handload was authorized so we competed against the Pros on a more equal footing.

[4EVERM-14]

Hummer 70,
Nice work getting Mr. Smiths signature. That has to be a piece of history now.
I really enjoyed getting issued match ammo. There was something about shooting The Presidents Match for $2.00 that felt right plus getting the brass form every Marine within ten firing points. Days gone by.