Bullets don't seat square

[Colorado Redneck]

When reloading straight walled cases, like 357 or 44 mag, the bullets are often not seated squarely, and as a result, there is a slight bulge in the case on the side opposite the deeper part of the bullet. I have tried adjusting how much the case is belled, fiddled with trying to set the bullet straight on the case, and thus far frustration is the only outcome. The runout is not really bad, but the case bulge is obvious. Accuracy isn't that good from these rounds. There are probably 50% of the last batch I loaded that ended up like this. New brass, sized, trimmed, deburred, champhered, belled, primed, charged, and then loaded. RCBS dies.

Any ideas?

[testuser]

I haven't found case bulges to impact accuracy, however, there are a few rounds I reload for that will do it.

Some new brass is much smaller than the diameter of the bullet. I ran into this with some "JLT" .357 brass I bought a few years ago. I'll never buy that brand again. On the initial loading the bullet bulges the case significantly, because the brass is out of spec. It's fine once it's been fired, therefore expanded, and sized again. The diameter of those cases from the factory are not correct.

Does the bullet seat normally after the initial loading? If so, then your new brass is out of spec.

Some dies also size brass down a little smaller than others. I sometimes get a bulge with 9mm Remington brass when loading with my Lee dies. It doesn't impact function and accuracy is great, so I consider it a non-issue for me.

Remington brass is considered thicker in 9mm, I think, which could also be contributing to the issue.

Have you measured the internal diameter of the case compared to the base of the bullet?

Belling helps the bullet start in the case, however, if the case is too narrow for the bullet, like my JLT brass, then it will bulge the case as it's seated.

The other issue could be bullets not seating squarely in the case. You should be able to look at a finished round and tell if that's the case or not.

That can be caused by misalignment between the shellholder and the die or possible the bench flexing as you seat the bullet. If that's the case, then the bulge will only be on one side of the case.

[m&p45acp10+1]

I had that problem with the first few rounds I tried to load for my .41 mag with RCBS dies. Try to follow the instructions for seating without crimping and see how that works. If the bullet seats straight then back off the seating stem a couple of turns then adjust the crimp down a slight little smidgen at a time. When it gets to the point it is where you want it then with the ram at the top of the stroke, and the round in the die turn the seating stem till you feel it contact the bullet. Lower the ram, and turn the stem about one eigth of a turn. You can now seat and crimp in one step.

Also if there is another seating plug in the box try it. My set came with a seating plug for round nosed, and flat points. My JHP, soft points, and semi wadcutters will not seat properly with the round nose seating plug.
Edited. You may end up having to seat, and crimp in seperate steps. This usualy tends to solve the bulge problem most of the time. The other possibility is over belling the cases.

[10-96]

Also, check with RCBS to find out if they have a seater stem designed to more closely fit the specific type of bullet you are using. I'm guessing the right seater stem can help centering. I can't remember off hand- but some die makers do sell two or three different stems for each set of dies- plus some sold separately.

EDIT: Sorry folks, didn't read M&P's post close enough.

[snuffy]

More info please. what kind of bullets, lead or jacketed?

Are the cases bulged only on one side of the brass? If the bulge is the same all-the-way-around, then don't worry about it, that's normal. As long as they chamber without hesitation, you're good to go.

If they're not accurate, it must be your revolvers don't like what you're feeding them, try some other loads.

[10 Spot Terminator]

Any chance you are using a seater plug for a round nose bullet rather than one of the flatter persuasion for semi wad cutters etc ? Are you using a progressive press or single stage ??? Certain progressive presses can have adjustment issues where the shell plate stops slightly short or long to be off alignment just enough to cause the scenario you described . If using a single stage press and you have the correct seater plug you can try what I call the "double tap" where you just touch the bullet lightly when raising the ram then lower it again and rotate the cartridge 180 degrees, bump the bullet again and then seat it. This concept is more for seating rifle bullets straight as possible but works for pistol bullets nicely too .

[PA-Joe]

Check you seating die to make certain that you are using the correct style seating stem. There should be one for RN bullets and one for flatpoints.

[GeauxTide]

Bell the case mouth just enough to place the bullet level. Viola.

[Colorado Redneck]

The round is 44 mag, new Winchester brass. 200 grain Oregon Trail Laser Cast RNFP.

Well, it looks like the seater plug was the culprit. After reading the posts that suggested that might be it, I checked and the seater plug was for round nose bullets. Tried the other one that came with the dies, for flat point, and it worked fine. Thanks again. That was kinda ticking me off. I like to produce good looking rounds as well as good shooting ones.

I looked in the box of 357 dies and there is not another seater plug. I had some problems with that caliber yeras ago. Can't remember what bullet. However, RCBS is easy to buy from direct. Have done it before.

And one more comment: The more loading I do the less I know. This is such an interesting hobby. And the FL is always great about sharing information. Thanks again!

[GP100man]

One way is to fill the seater with epoxy (5min) & form it to the nose of the bullet .

Use a release agent (litely oil the nose)

[Unclenick]

CR,

As suggested, this is usually due to a poor match between bullet nose and seater ram recess. Using one designed for SWC's to seat a round nose bullet is great for promoting bullet tipping. You can, as suggested, use some JB Weld or some Steel Bed or other bedding compound to form a ram to fit your bullets. The problem is that bullets aren't always shaped exactly identically form one set of tooling to the next, so this may only match one lot perfectly. If your bullets are cast, flashing doesn't usually line up perfectly, either. So you really want a ram that has a little wiggle room, but not too much. For that reason, if you go the epoxy route, I would build up a few layers of paint on the bullet you will mold with. Enough to add maybe 0.001" to 0.002" of thickness to it. Then wax it up and cast the impression into the epoxy.

The easier way, to my mind, is just to get a Lyman M-style expander die. This style is found in Redding and, I believe, Hornady dies these days, too. Maybe others, as the patent has long expired. It forms a short step in the brass just below the bell that lets you set the bullet in straight, and that forces centered contact with the seater. I've used my lathe to grind this profile into all my Dillon powder measure expander/drop tube/op-rods. It has stopped the uneven case bulge problem.

[joneb]

I was having that problem seating 9x18 Mak 93gr LRN with RCBS dies. The expander stem and seating stem were not centered in the dies, I took out the slop in the expander stem with teflon tape on the threads, on the seating stem I used one rap of masking tape on the smooth part of the stem. These bullets have a short driving band and seat much straighter after tuning up the dies.

[Romeo 33 Delta]

For my part, my answer's like Unclenick's ... every time I have a "problem" cartridge/bullet combination and take a side-step to a Lyman "M" die ... the problem is cleared up. The problem seems to be more likely when the bullet diameter relative to the bullet length are closer together ... longer bullets seem to NOT want to seat "cockeyed".

[wncchester]

Your cases likely have significant differences in body thickness or hardness; the thin/soft sides give way a lot more.

[Colorado Redneck]

In loading several different recipes, there was an opportunity to compare the results. Using the flat tipped seating plug really helped.

Seating 180 gr XTP it worked about perfectly. Seating 240 gr. XTP was nearly as good, but in 44 special that bullet seated as close to perfect as I have done. Something about the 44 spec brass? And the XTP has a relatively flat bottom with a sharp 90 degree shoulder. The Lasercast bullets have a slight bevel and do not sit vertically in the case mouth most of the time. I tried to make them sit upright but it was rather futile. And time consuming.

Mama Santy Clause is getting me a membership to an indoor shooting range for Christmas. And a Millet Red Dot for the 629 Smith. She likes to go too.

Thanks again for the comments and advice.

[Stargazer]

I seat my bullets with turns to the case, always. Have you tried that yet? Seat a little ways, turn the case a third of the way around in the shellholder and then seat another third of the way down and spin the case another third for the final seat. Seems to keep all squared up for me. Now it can get tricky with your fingers between the shellholder and the die, got to watch what you are doing or you will pinch yourself good.

[joneb]

RCBS needs to tighten up their tolerances and use a finer thread. With the lock ring loose do you notice play in the expander and seater stems ? When the lock ring is tight it will pivot the stems off-axis from the die body. If these stems are not centered the bullet wont seat in the center of the shell casing.