Fluting weight reduction?

[Thejunk07]

Roughly how much weight reduction do you get spiral fluting a 24” bartlein 3 or 3B?

The goal is to be at a reasonable hunting weight but get a barrel that will work for range days with multiple shots and maybe a competition or two down the road.

[std7mag]

Weight savings is fairly minimal.
Thought behind fluting is more for increased surface area to better transfer heat.
For a hunting rifle, the expense of the spiral fluting far outweighs any benefit in weight reduction.
Looks way cool at hunt camp though!

And what do you mean by "competition or 2"?

I've been shooting some IBR, UBR, "ground hog" matches this year. Precission is the name of the game there!
F-Class isn't as "precise" (1/2 MOA ). But F-Class will burn up thinner barrels. Your shooting more rounds in a shorter relative time span.
I've shot an F-Open with a sporter barrel in 7mm-08AI, and believe me when i say the barrel was HOT!
For competition consistancy is always important, and Bertlein is certainly know for that!

But for weight savings, and using it to shoot some competitions, i'd be leaning towards a Proof Research carbon wrapped barrel.

[HiBC]

Are you looking at a fluted barrel that Bartlein sells ? I'd suggest contacting Bartlein. If Bartlein offers them,I'm sure they have weighed them.

Or are you thinking of buying the barrel and fluting it or having it fluted?

You can do whatever makes you happy. Its my opinion that fluting is best done before the final stress relief and rifling/lapping (assuming a Bartlein cut rifled barrel)

The process of fluting will introduce stress into the barrel. I'm not condemning fluting,but there is a stage in the barrel making process to do it.

For a mediocre analogy,if you are building a house,its best if the electricians and plumbers have their rough in done before the drywall is hung,

I'm sure we will hear from the folks who A) Offer barrel fluting services and B) Have had finished barrels fluted

And they may be happy. Its your barrel,and your money.

Its my opinion that ,while the look of spiral fluting might appeal to you, a spiral fluted barrel will be less rigid than a straight fluted barrel.

I'm not knocking your idea,but if you want a fluted barrel,get in touch with your chosen barrel maker and talk with them about what they can do for you.

Hands down they can give you better information. They "been there,done that"

Fluted barrel have been discussed at length here...you might find a lot using the "search" function.

If I'm not mistaken,E.R. Shaw offers spiral fluted barrels. Or maybe Harry McGowen. You might get an idea on weights by checking their offerings.

[jmr40]

Colt, Smith & Wesson, and pretty every revolver maker have been fluting the cylinders on most of their revolvers since the 1850's to reduce weight. They leave some unfluted in heavy kicking guns to add weight and reduce recoil. If fluting a 2" long revolver cylinder can make a noticeable difference in weight then so will fluting a 22"-24" rifle barrel.

If you want to reduce weight on a hunting rifle you can either start with a thin Featherweight barrel profile. You can use a shorter 16"-18" barrel, or you can start with a standard weight and length barrel and flute the barrel.

IME a standard profile barrel that has been fluted will turn out about the same weight as one with a Featherweight barrel profile. And you don't give up any accuracy like you do with the thinner barrel profile. Plus you don't have to give up the velocity of a shorter barrel. But you don't gain any accuracy with fluting. On a hunting rifle cooling it faster is secondary and rarely a factor.

If you don't need, or want the weight reduction then an unfluted barrel is fine. I wouldn't pay to have a barrel fluted. But if buying a new barrel or new rifle the fluted versions are either the same price, or the additional cost is minimal. I don't see any downsides unless you just want the added weight.

[Jim Watson]

I recall reading that one barrel fluter was getting 14 ounces off a heavy profile AR barrel. Ought to get a pound or so off a 24" barrel.

[Bart B.]

Read this first....

https://web.archive.org/web/20141024...relFluting.asp

If the barrel is properly stress relieved and fit to the squared up receiver face, you can fire a few dozen shots 10 seconds apart and point of impact will not change. Commercial rifles typically need their receiver face squared up.

Fluting commercial rifle barrels typically changes the bore and groove diameters and accuracy is less. Fluting any barrel removes metal that resisted bending so it's not as stiff.

A thin barrel will shoot as accurate as a thick one. Both whip and wiggle 100% repeatable for every shot fired.

[Scorch]

Order the barrel from the barrel maker with fluting. That way if there is an accuracy issue, you will still have a warranty.

[T. O'Heir]

Fluting is purely decoration. Doesn't reduce the weight by enough to notice. They barely help with heat dissipation.
Hunting and target rifles are different critters with different needs. Trigger pull alone can and should be heavier on a hunting rifle than a target rifle. Likewise with the sights and barrel.

[stagpanther]

I've always thought of fluting as some groovy flashback to the 60's.

[Scorch]

Roughly how much weight reduction do you get spiral fluting a 24” bartlein 3 or 3B?

Reduces the weight roughly 1/4 lb IME. The heavier the barrel, the more weight reduction there is.

I recall reading that one barrel fluter was getting 14 ounces off a heavy profile AR barrel.

That would be a lot. A heavy AR barrel must mean a bull barrel, not a HBAR profile.

Fluting is purely decoration.

It has some usefulness, but not much. Weight reduction, increased surface area, but its primary purpose is to separate the customer from the cash.

I've always thought of fluting as some groovy flashback to the 60's

I never saw fluting on rifle barrels before the 1980s. Still kinda groovy, though!

If fluting a 2" long revolver cylinder can make a noticeable difference in weight then so will fluting a 22"-24" rifle barrel.

They don't leave them unfluted for weight, it's for strength.

i'd be leaning towards a Proof Research carbon wrapped barrel

They don't shoot as well as a regular barrel, about 1.5-2 MOA. Besides, carbon and epoxy are great insulators, and I thought we were trying to cool the barrel faster! Lothar Walther sells an aluminum sleeved barrel that is light and cools fast if that's an issue.

I've been discusssing a build with the OP, and he has a lot of questions and is trying to build something special and is running a lot of stuff past people who know more than he does. Not a bad thing, IMO.

[jetinteriorguy]

I believe they also flute revolver cylinders to cut down on revolving mass to lessen wear and tear on the cylinder stop.

[HiBC]

I don't know all the reasons why they flute revolver cylinders..
Looks are very important to firearm sales. Fluting cylinders can add some elegant lines.

Functionally, there is a value in more uniform wall sections. Particularly for heat treating.

Thin sections quench or cool much quicker than thick sections. That can cause cracking .I don't know about revolver cylinder heat treat,but I have seen non-uniform cross sections crack in heat treat.

I don't doubt there is advantage in reducing rotating mass.

Overall weight matters. Aircraft and race vehicles are lightened at every screw,hole and detail because every bit adds up.

Done right,there is SOME potential to optimize the tradeoff between weight and rigidity with fluting...

But its good to look at the whole rifle. How often is a "light" rifle compromised by bolting a 50 mm + objective astronomical telescope on top.Maybe using a 2x to 7x variable instead will save as much weight as fluting.

Dumping the Mauser type steel guard and floorplate/mag box in favor of a blind magazine and a Rem 700 ADL aluminum trigger guard is a chunk of weight.

A vacuum bagged,foam cored Kevlar and glass epoxy stock can weigh about 20 OZ. A laminated hardwood stock is heavier.

A barrel is a big piece of steel,and it seems the obvious place to save weight,but the barrel is key to accuracy. I suggest not getting tunnel vision on lightening the barrel.


I don't know all the tech details of composite or aluminum sleeved barrels.
An obvious bug to work out is different materials have different coefficients of expansion. Thats how a bimetal strip works. They change shape with temp. Thats how some thermostats,circuit breakers,etc work.


I don't know Bartlein's profile code. A 3 or 3A profile conjures up a vision of a standard Remchester 30-06 hunting rifle barrel. Which,FWIW,is probably a good compromise. Stepping up to a 300 Win Mag will likely get you a #4.

These contours don't have all that much extra steel to flute.....At least as far as removing weight. You can make token cosmetic cuts. A .030 or .040 depth of cut will look fluted,but remove very little weight.

IMO,you start getting into the target contours before there is enough steel to effectively flute to make a weight difference.