45-70 mould ?

Old 454 · June 14, 2021, 10:40 AM

I have this Lyman/Ideal mould 457127 would this be considered a collar button mould ?
Can’t upload pics due to security token missing uggg

**Unclenick** · June 14, 2021, 11:14 AM

No, that's a light round-nosed bullet for single-shot guns. 210 grains, according to one reference I found. It's no longer cataloged, so you have to look for it. Collar button bullets are even lighter, at 140 grains, and have a slightly conical nose form. Here's an article about them with photos and also showing some actual old-fashioned collar buttons so you can see the connection of the name to the form.

Old 454 · June 14, 2021, 03:51 PM

I have located it in three Lyman books from 1955 and 1957 that state 195 grain and one from 1958 that says 210 grain same mold numbers 457127

gwpercle · June 17, 2021, 05:34 PM

Ideal/Lyman #457130 is the collar button 45 mould , 145 grain and a very short conical point ... it literally looks like a collar button .

#457127 is a short RN with 2 grease grooves and weighs 210 grains .

I would upload photo's but that is above my pay grade see Lyman Ideal Bullet Mould Chart http://www.three-peaks.net/Lyman_and...llet_Molds.pdf there is a pdf you can print for future reference .
Gary

**Unclenick** · June 18, 2021, 08:53 AM

Both are next to each other near the bottom right side of page 9 of that file. Thanks for sharing it, Gary. I made your link go directly to it.

Old 454,

195 to 210 is about the difference you'd get using linotype and pure lead in the same mold. Don't know why anyone would run pure lead, though. The difference from Lyman #2 would be only about 1/3 that much.

Old 454 · June 19, 2021, 08:52 AM

Thanks for all the information

You all are the best …. I will be giving this mold to a friend who shoots the 45-70

gwpercle · June 25, 2021, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unclenick

Both are next to each other near the bottom right side of page 9 of that file. Thanks for sharing it, Gary. I made your link go directly to it.

Old 454,

195 to 210 is about the difference you'd get using linotype and pure lead in the same mold. Don't know why anyone would run pure lead, though. The difference from Lyman #2 would be only about 1/3 that much.

Thanks for the help Unclenick ... I'm about as computer illiterate as a person can be ,
I had no idea how to make a link to go directly to it and you saved the day !

If you don't have a copy of this chart , use the link Unclenick provided and print out a couple copies ... if you shoot cast bullets you find yourself referring to it quite often .
Finding my printed copies is a lot easier than finding that link ... trust me.
Gary

reinert · December 28, 2021, 09:27 AM

FWIW, I know this is an older post, but there's some info I found in the article Uncle Nick posted on the collar button bullet. Good article, and in the article there, was this website that might be of interest to the old gun cranks and bullet casters looking through it. I know I'll spend some time looking at the old books/manuals offered by these folks:

www.cornellpubs.com

Thanks for the posting, Uncle Nick.

**Unclenick** · January 5, 2022, 04:35 PM

Thanks for the link, Reinert. That could be a useful resource for many. I'm going to add it to the sticky thread for manuals in the gunsmithing forum.

June 14, 2021, 10:40 AM	#1
Old 454 Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2011 Location: Chesterton Ind. Posts: 822	45-70 mould ? I have this Lyman/Ideal mould 457127 would this be considered a collar button mould ? Can’t upload pics due to security token missing uggg

June 18, 2021, 08:53 AM	#5
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	Both are next to each other near the bottom right side of page 9 of that file. Thanks for sharing it, Gary. I made your link go directly to it. Old 454, 195 to 210 is about the difference you'd get using linotype and pure lead in the same mold. Don't know why anyone would run pure lead, though. The difference from Lyman #2 would be only about 1/3 that much. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

January 5, 2022, 04:35 PM	#9
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	Thanks for the link, Reinert. That could be a useful resource for many. I'm going to add it to the sticky thread for manuals in the gunsmithing forum. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

June 14, 2021, 11:14 AM	#2
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	No, that's a light round-nosed bullet for single-shot guns. 210 grains, according to one reference I found. It's no longer cataloged, so you have to look for it. Collar button bullets are even lighter, at 140 grains, and have a slightly conical nose form. Here's an article about them with photos and also showing some actual old-fashioned collar buttons so you can see the connection of the name to the form. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

June 14, 2021, 03:51 PM	#3
Old 454 Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2011 Location: Chesterton Ind. Posts: 822	I have located it in three Lyman books from 1955 and 1957 that state 195 grain and one from 1958 that says 210 grain same mold numbers 457127

June 17, 2021, 05:34 PM	#4
gwpercle Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2012 Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana Posts: 1,752	Ideal/Lyman #457130 is the collar button 45 mould , 145 grain and a very short conical point ... it literally looks like a collar button . #457127 is a short RN with 2 grease grooves and weighs 210 grains . I would upload photo's but that is above my pay grade see Lyman Ideal Bullet Mould Chart http://www.three-peaks.net/Lyman_and...llet_Molds.pdf there is a pdf you can print for future reference . Gary Last edited by Unclenick; June 18, 2021 at 08:52 AM. Reason: Made link direct to file mentioned

June 19, 2021, 08:52 AM	#6
Old 454 Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2011 Location: Chesterton Ind. Posts: 822	Thanks for all the information You all are the best …. I will be giving this mold to a friend who shoots the 45-70

December 28, 2021, 09:27 AM	#8
reinert Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 646	FWIW, I know this is an older post, but there's some info I found in the article Uncle Nick posted on the collar button bullet. Good article, and in the article there, was this website that might be of interest to the old gun cranks and bullet casters looking through it. I know I'll spend some time looking at the old books/manuals offered by these folks: www.cornellpubs.com Thanks for the posting, Uncle Nick.