Had To Draw Down This Morning! - Page 2

Dean C · July 29, 2006, 06:36 PM

Wild,
I know you're an ICON here, but I've got to say either you didn't call 911 because of some extra beverages or my BS meter is still working.
dean

Wildalaska · July 29, 2006, 06:42 PM

Nope last night was booze free, totally......

WildnowtonightisdifferentAlaska

Epyon · July 29, 2006, 07:02 PM

You did right, if you were in Florida, the "right-to-shoot" law would've allowed you to shoot him even if you weren't on your own property. How are Alaska's laws about shooting anyway? If you're on your property (be it business or home.) do you have to retreat first, or can you stand you ground?

Epywhydoyoutypeweirdsentencesinyournameon

tshadow6 · July 29, 2006, 07:23 PM

You did the right thing. You made it home in one piece. Some folks may say you should have done this or that, but they wern't there. Every day above ground is a good day.

Bender711 · July 29, 2006, 07:23 PM

Benbecausethatswhathedoesder

razorburn · July 29, 2006, 07:32 PM

razorbutitmakesithardtoreadburn.

cpaspr · July 29, 2006, 07:34 PM

Given the situation, disparity of size, age and physical ability, and the fact that you were backed up with no retreat possible - one more step from the perp and I'd shoot.

Years ago, had two guys force their way into my apartment. Both bigger, older, meaner (I was 22-23, 5'8", 142#). Found out later one was a semi-pro fighter. What's semi-pro anyway? Is that like being semi-pregnant? But I digress.

My watchband broke and cut my wrist when I rolled out of the first guy's grip. (Stupid me, tried to push them back out.) I back pedalled while telling them to leave, that they didn't belong there. Had a hunting knife on the bookshelf as a letter opener. I had determined that if they took one more step or reached for that knife I was turning and jetting down the hall. I could clear the bed in one jump, and there was a loaded .22 under the mattress. I would have shot if they'd have followed. By the grace of God, they realized they had the wrong apartment (my bookshelves had books, not booze bottles like my neighbor).

Sometimes, you're just one step away from a trigger pull and you know that that is all it will take. Sometimes ya gotta pull it, sometimes you don't. Glad ya didn't have to.
____________

Epyon

Why does he type in the middle of his name? Cause that's his trademark.

CPAandIforonewouldmissitifheeverstopsdoingitSPR

springmom · July 29, 2006, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Nope last night was booze free, totally......

WildnowtonightisdifferentAlaska

I certainly would HOPE SO!!!!!

Spring'causeifanybodyprobablyneedsadrinkyoudoafterthatmom

Blackwater OPS · July 29, 2006, 08:04 PM

Justifiable shoot, size and age of your attacker plus a reasonable suspicion that he under the influence of narcotics.

Funny though, I thought you gave up carry? Glad you changed your mind.

Lycanthrope · July 29, 2006, 08:17 PM

I had that happen once and my only thought (despite my 4" Kimber Compact) was that .....I wish I had a bigger gun.

I can't imagine that with a Seacamp.

Lycchallengemetappropriatelyandeveryonewenthomethrope

Gunfighter45cal · July 29, 2006, 08:26 PM

That's what I was referring to earlier. I've done this numerous times and ALWAYS wished I had a bigger gun; be it with an J frame, 1911, or even an M4 or shotgun.

garryc · July 29, 2006, 08:45 PM

Quote:

My CCW instructor here in OK said that before one can pull a handgun he/she should have already been assaulted. Specifically, I'm on the ground with a bloody nose and the attacker is kicking me.

Thats very close to the way it is in certain counties in ohio

Roberta X · July 29, 2006, 08:50 PM

Well done, WA, and I am glad it didn't come to gunfire.

...The ratio of having to fire vs. the BG deciding he's got other things to do is supposedly about 1 in ten, so the outcome's not unexpected. It's chillin' either way.

Edward429451 · July 29, 2006, 09:28 PM

If he would have kept coming I think you should have shot him. Anyone who advances on a drawn weapon can certainly be reasonably assumed to be intent on doing you harm or worse. Plus with the disparity of force, no way you should let a big bruiser get close or ahold of you! Yay teeny Seecamp. (right where he would've expected your wallet to be!) You don't have to be a punching bag for anyone.

Now then, Mr. PC...you know the PC thing to do was to call the cops. Shame Shame.

I know why you didn't. Underneath all your PCness, you got a streak of the stubborn American pride. Your freudian slip is showing...

Glad you're OK.

Al Norris · July 29, 2006, 09:38 PM

Wild, I know exactly how you felt. Glad ya didn't have to shoot.

And yeah, I know why you wanted to talk to spiff... Me, I had a live cop there. We both talked it through.

Holman · July 29, 2006, 09:52 PM

Quote:

You did the right thing. You made it home in one piece. Some folks may say you should have done this or that, but they weren't there. Every day above ground is a good day.

+1 well said!

Al.40cal · July 29, 2006, 09:58 PM

Great job WA! You and him are alive and just maybe that POS learned a lesson in trying to take advantage of someone!

cen · July 29, 2006, 10:34 PM

Now I've got buddies who say " If I draw my gun, I'm going to shoot, that's the only reason to draw it". I disagree. In your specific situation you avoided numerous awful situations by not firing. Hey, if the guy leaves, GREAT, did you WANT to shoot him, hell no. But If he kept coming, you were ready. Who knows what kind of weapons he may have had, or maybe he was on crack or meth, who knows. I like the fact that most of the time, the presence of a weapon, stops the altercation entirely.

Series 70 · July 29, 2006, 11:50 PM

Glad you didn't have to shoot, but it's good that you were prepared. Did you have a light handy? You didn't say, but it seems like one would have certainly been handy.

CelticMP · July 30, 2006, 12:25 AM

Glad you didnt have to shoot WA. Sticky situation... do i? or dont i?. and then in the morning it is what if ?and why didnt i? but enough about the psychology of it. glad you are ok and that he decided to retreat instead of forcing your hand ( no pun intended

). besides if you went to jail <not saying you would have> but IZinter and IZhum and bunch of other people would have to shop elsewhere for discount firearms and that would break thier hearts

. oh yeah and you being in jail would suck too

symr00 · July 30, 2006, 12:37 AM

Glad you're ok but pulling a handgun on an unarmed man is a crime even if he did want to kick your ass. This is the exact reason I carry OC while carrying a handgun off-duty. Maybe you're a woman or a feeble old man and I apologize if that's the case as you would have been justified. I'm with the others that agree you should have called the cops. That guy could have called them and you would have been taken to jail most likely for assault. He also could have been looking to rob/rape or kill someone and after he left your home, looked for a better victim. Calling the cops may have stopped him from hurting another person.

leadcounsel · July 30, 2006, 12:58 AM

Are you SURE he wasn't armed with something, like a tire iron or a stick or even a big rock....

Seriously though, I'm not sure about Alaska, but most states only require that you were in fear of your life from imminent serious bodily harm. Does Alaska require a duty to retreat?

'75Scout · July 30, 2006, 12:59 AM

How long was your adrenaline pumping? If it were me I would have enough adrenaline in my system to flip over my truck til dinner time.

You handled it well. You gave him a chance to stop and saved his life by drawing when you did. Any closer and you would have had to pop him. My thoughts are the same as mentioned before. No weapon and far enough away I'd hold the fire for a moment. Any weapon in sight and its the OK Coral. Even more so if family is present, because retreating is even harder.

Although I would have called the cops for the reason that he might have placed a call too. And definatly wait to talk to LEOs if you have to shoot until you talk to your lawyer.

Blackwater OPS · July 30, 2006, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Glad you're ok but pulling a handgun on an unarmed man is a crime even if he did want to kick your ass.

Not always, and probably not in this case.

Quote:

This is the exact reason I carry OC while carrying a handgun off-duty.

Do you carry cuffs and a radio as well?

(Not that carrying OC is a bad idea)

Quote:

He also could have been looking to rob/rape or kill someone and after he left your home, looked for a better victim. Calling the cops may have stopped him from hurting another person.

Because they could charge him with what, walking at someone in a parking lot?

PATH · July 30, 2006, 01:16 AM

WildAlaska,

You exhibited good ol' common sense in your confrontation with this individual. Disparate size and age made you a target. Presenting your firearm saved that idiots life and prevented you from getting hurt.

If you had to make a decision to shoot I am sure it would have been as a last resort. I guess in the end it is one of those "you had to be there" sort of things. Tough call. I'm sure glad you are okay though!

July 29, 2006, 06:36 PM	#26
Dean C Senior Member Join Date: June 13, 2004 Location: Mill Creek (Just north east of Seattle) Posts: 343	Wild, I know you're an ICON here, but I've got to say either you didn't call 911 because of some extra beverages or my BS meter is still working. dean __________________ Viet Nam Vet American Legion Member Former NRA Member (Still thinking about that) Pro 2A Washington (Charter Member)

July 29, 2006, 07:02 PM	#28
Epyon Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2006 Location: Awesome, Colorado Posts: 700	Glad you're safe... You did right, if you were in Florida, the "right-to-shoot" law would've allowed you to shoot him even if you weren't on your own property. How are Alaska's laws about shooting anyway? If you're on your property (be it business or home.) do you have to retreat first, or can you stand you ground? Epywhydoyoutypeweirdsentencesinyournameon __________________ Vote Epyon for president in 2008, if you vote for Epyon all of your wildest dreams will come true: This campaign was brought to you by Epyon; funded in part by the Pizza Party, Surprise Party, Birthday Party, and Slumber Party.

July 29, 2006, 07:23 PM	#29
tshadow6 Senior Member Join Date: June 26, 2005 Posts: 619	a good day You did the right thing. You made it home in one piece. Some folks may say you should have done this or that, but they wern't there. Every day above ground is a good day.

July 29, 2006, 07:23 PM	#30
Bender711 Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 340	Benbecausethatswhathedoesder __________________ From a Mod "Seeing as how "butt Smurf" is not profanity in the usual sense and humorously creative, I'll leave this up for now"

July 29, 2006, 07:34 PM	#32
cpaspr Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2005 Location: Oregon Posts: 304	Good Job WA Given the situation, disparity of size, age and physical ability, and the fact that you were backed up with no retreat possible - one more step from the perp and I'd shoot. Years ago, had two guys force their way into my apartment. Both bigger, older, meaner (I was 22-23, 5'8", 142#). Found out later one was a semi-pro fighter. What's semi-pro anyway? Is that like being semi-pregnant? But I digress. My watchband broke and cut my wrist when I rolled out of the first guy's grip. (Stupid me, tried to push them back out.) I back pedalled while telling them to leave, that they didn't belong there. Had a hunting knife on the bookshelf as a letter opener. I had determined that if they took one more step or reached for that knife I was turning and jetting down the hall. I could clear the bed in one jump, and there was a loaded .22 under the mattress. I would have shot if they'd have followed. By the grace of God, they realized they had the wrong apartment (my bookshelves had books, not booze bottles like my neighbor). Sometimes, you're just one step away from a trigger pull and you know that that is all it will take. Sometimes ya gotta pull it, sometimes you don't. Glad ya didn't have to. ____________ Epyon Why does he type in the middle of his name? Cause that's his trademark. CPAandIforonewouldmissitifheeverstopsdoingitSPR

July 29, 2006, 06:42 PM	#27
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	Nope last night was booze free, totally...... WildnowtonightisdifferentAlaska

July 29, 2006, 07:32 PM	#31
razorburn Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2006 Posts: 260	razorbutitmakesithardtoreadburn.

July 29, 2006, 08:04 PM	#34
Blackwater OPS Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,152	Justifiable shoot, size and age of your attacker plus a reasonable suspicion that he under the influence of narcotics. Funny though, I thought you gave up carry? Glad you changed your mind. __________________ "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Ben Franklin Spc. Jeremy M. Campbell Died 9/1/2005 and the best DS ever MSG Matthew Ritz Died 11.23.2005 matthewritz.com For those who have had to fight for it, Life holds a special meaning that the protected will never know. (\__/) (='.'=) Someone set us up the bunny! (")_(")

July 29, 2006, 08:17 PM	#35
Lycanthrope Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2001 Location: PA Posts: 1,752	I had that happen once and my only thought (despite my 4" Kimber Compact) was that .....I wish I had a bigger gun. I can't imagine that with a Seacamp. Lycchallengemetappropriatelyandeveryonewenthomethrope

July 29, 2006, 08:26 PM	#36
Gunfighter45cal Member Join Date: December 18, 2005 Location: east tn Posts: 24	That's what I was referring to earlier. I've done this numerous times and ALWAYS wished I had a bigger gun; be it with an J frame, 1911, or even an M4 or shotgun. __________________ Thunder Ranch THG & UR Gunsite 250C Yavapai Firearms Academy HG1, HG2 & SG NRA Life Member

July 29, 2006, 08:50 PM	#38
Roberta X Senior Member Join Date: May 2, 2006 Location: Indianapolis, IN Posts: 165	Well done, WA, and I am glad it didn't come to gunfire. ...The ratio of having to fire vs. the BG deciding he's got other things to do is supposedly about 1 in ten, so the outcome's not unexpected. It's chillin' either way. __________________ Proud rider of a 2006 Bajaj Chetak motorscooter. --And just bought a small motorcycle. I've got the fever bad. Girl Gunblogger: The Adventures Of Roberta X

July 29, 2006, 09:28 PM	#39
Edward429451 Junior member Join Date: November 12, 2000 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado Posts: 9,494	If he would have kept coming I think you should have shot him. Anyone who advances on a drawn weapon can certainly be reasonably assumed to be intent on doing you harm or worse. Plus with the disparity of force, no way you should let a big bruiser get close or ahold of you! Yay teeny Seecamp. (right where he would've expected your wallet to be!) You don't have to be a punching bag for anyone. Now then, Mr. PC...you know the PC thing to do was to call the cops. Shame Shame. I know why you didn't. Underneath all your PCness, you got a streak of the stubborn American pride. Your freudian slip is showing... Glad you're OK.

July 29, 2006, 09:38 PM	#40
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Wild, I know exactly how you felt. Glad ya didn't have to shoot. And yeah, I know why you wanted to talk to spiff... Me, I had a live cop there. We both talked it through.

July 29, 2006, 09:58 PM	#42
Al.40cal Member Join Date: February 1, 2006 Location: Ohio Posts: 36	Great job WA! You and him are alive and just maybe that POS learned a lesson in trying to take advantage of someone! __________________ Understood by few, misinterpeted by many "You think you got enough.....?" "Brotha you can never have enough!"

July 29, 2006, 10:34 PM	#43
cen Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2005 Posts: 128	Good job Now I've got buddies who say " If I draw my gun, I'm going to shoot, that's the only reason to draw it". I disagree. In your specific situation you avoided numerous awful situations by not firing. Hey, if the guy leaves, GREAT, did you WANT to shoot him, hell no. But If he kept coming, you were ready. Who knows what kind of weapons he may have had, or maybe he was on crack or meth, who knows. I like the fact that most of the time, the presence of a weapon, stops the altercation entirely.

July 29, 2006, 11:50 PM	#44
Series 70 Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Minnesota Posts: 23	Glad you didn't have to shoot, but it's good that you were prepared. Did you have a light handy? You didn't say, but it seems like one would have certainly been handy.

July 30, 2006, 12:25 AM	#45
CelticMP Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2005 Location: Fruit and Nut-ville, TX Posts: 123	close encounter Glad you didnt have to shoot WA. Sticky situation... do i? or dont i?. and then in the morning it is what if ?and why didnt i? but enough about the psychology of it. glad you are ok and that he decided to retreat instead of forcing your hand ( no pun intended ). besides if you went to jail <not saying you would have> but IZinter and IZhum and bunch of other people would have to shop elsewhere for discount firearms and that would break thier hearts . oh yeah and you being in jail would suck too __________________ "Do I have to shoot another hole in the ceiling to teach you proper gun safety?"- IZInterrogator 01/17/07 Tir gan Teanga, tir gan anam- "A land without a language, is a land without hope" Celtic Proverb

July 30, 2006, 12:37 AM	#46
symr00 Member Join Date: July 13, 2006 Posts: 51	Glad you're ok but pulling a handgun on an unarmed man is a crime even if he did want to kick your ass. This is the exact reason I carry OC while carrying a handgun off-duty. Maybe you're a woman or a feeble old man and I apologize if that's the case as you would have been justified. I'm with the others that agree you should have called the cops. That guy could have called them and you would have been taken to jail most likely for assault. He also could have been looking to rob/rape or kill someone and after he left your home, looked for a better victim. Calling the cops may have stopped him from hurting another person.

July 30, 2006, 12:58 AM	#47
leadcounsel Junior member Join Date: September 8, 2005 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 2,119	Are you SURE he wasn't armed with something, like a tire iron or a stick or even a big rock.... Seriously though, I'm not sure about Alaska, but most states only require that you were in fear of your life from imminent serious bodily harm. Does Alaska require a duty to retreat?

July 30, 2006, 12:59 AM	#48
'75Scout Senior Member Join Date: August 3, 2005 Location: Central Texas Posts: 815	How long was your adrenaline pumping? If it were me I would have enough adrenaline in my system to flip over my truck til dinner time. You handled it well. You gave him a chance to stop and saved his life by drawing when you did. Any closer and you would have had to pop him. My thoughts are the same as mentioned before. No weapon and far enough away I'd hold the fire for a moment. Any weapon in sight and its the OK Coral. Even more so if family is present, because retreating is even harder. Although I would have called the cops for the reason that he might have placed a call too. And definatly wait to talk to LEOs if you have to shoot until you talk to your lawyer.

July 30, 2006, 01:16 AM	#50
PATH Senior Member Join Date: September 10, 1999 Location: Rockland, NY Posts: 1,489	WildAlaska, You exhibited good ol' common sense in your confrontation with this individual. Disparate size and age made you a target. Presenting your firearm saved that idiots life and prevented you from getting hurt. If you had to make a decision to shoot I am sure it would have been as a last resort. I guess in the end it is one of those "you had to be there" sort of things. Tough call. I'm sure glad you are okay though! __________________ For sure it is an evil spite, and breaking to the heart, For Irishmen to watch a fight and not be taking part. -Robert Service 'How MacPherson Held The Floor'