Please compare Concentricity Gage - Sinclair to Forster

[flashhole]

Does anyone own both such that they can compare them feature to feature? I'm leaning toward the Sinclair unit because of the ball bearing rollers and it looks dirt simple to use but also read good write-ups about Forster unit. Not sure I like the idea of having to get a separate collet for each caliber with the Forster unit.

[wncchester]

Haven't used a Forster but have the Sinclair.

The steel balls are not rollers, they are firmly fixed. They only serve as hard contacts to support and roll the case over. Runout on necks/bullets can be watched on the dial indicator as the case is turned by finger power. It works good too.

[flashhole]

That's great input, what is the advantage to using fixed balls in lieu of a V-block? Smaller contact point" Less friction?

[deepcore]

What about the Hornady one?

[flashhole]

Mixed reviews on the Midway site and I don't buy into the idea that you can correct runout with their tool. If you have off-center axial alignment the Hornady tool is not going to correct it. The only way to correct the problem is earlier in the loading process. IMO the benefit of the concentricity gage is the ability to determine where the problem lies via component and interim product inspection. Not sure why Hornady is asserting what they do but I'm not in their camp on this issue.

[10 Spot Terminator]

The design concept for the new Hornady isnt that new. I believe they bought the rights for this tool from C H Tool and Die Co. who built this tool as a custom order for years. The principal of adjusting the run out is simple in that the runout due to what ever may have not been perfect to start with ends up as a leaning of the bullet to one side or another and is corrected by adding pressure to the high side toward the low side much as if straightening bent aluminum arrows. Test results have shown this to improve accuracy to some degree but remember,,, this tool still measures cocentricity but you dont have to try straightening the bullets if you dont want to. You can invest in a new press and premium bench rest dies for each of your rifles you shoot instead. Its only money after all ...

[flashhole]

10 Spot - Do you own a Hornady tool?

[wncchester]

"...what is the advantage to using fixed balls in lieu of a V-block? "

Less costly I suppose, they just serve the purpose of V blocks. Glass marbles hot glued in holes would work just as well as the steel balls!

Purely personal ref. the Hornady tool; I like being able to identify where the run-out occurs in my loading process and eliminate it there. The idea of taking a "bent" round and bending it straight leaves me cold. But, it may work fine.

[10 Spot Terminator]

Flashole ,,,

I have the C H tool and their cannelure cutting tool I bought some 9+ years ago. The Hornady Is prettier being all Hornady Red and all with only what I can see from web photos to be minor changes in the base and C H no longer offers up their tool . Not being a benchrest shooter but more of an anal hunter on a lower budget I opted for the cheaper concept rather than having a lot of money in precision dies . It does work having taken some loads with with as much as .005 runout down to .001 or less ( with work ) . Dont get me wrong,,, it requires some patience but the end result is good. These days I have neck turning equipment and such that tooks years to accumulate that keeps me from using this tool as much. It has however been very helpful in tweaking ammo for some of my mil-surps and for sure some of their bulk ammo. Different srokes for different folks based on what you are looking for in the way of end results .

[Unclenick]

Agree. I'm afraid of changing neck tension, but there's another tool on the market that does the same thing. Costs more. I've forgotten who the maker is, but I saw it or at least broshures for it on Commercial Row at Camp Perry a number of years ago.

I own the Forster tool. It's the first one I owned and it works fine. No collets are involved. The Forster tool has a V cast into the frame for the case head to turn in and a second V on the adjustable depth rod for the bullet nose or case neck to ride in. Or you can get pilots for the case necks if find the bullet nose V awkward. Maybe that's what you meant instead of collets? You would have one for each actual caliber, but the same one services all cartridges that shoot that same bullet diameter. I find I use my NECO gauge more these days, though.

[Shoney]

Forster, Sinclair International, NECO, and RCBS are the only names I know of in the concentricity tool market.

[Unclenick]

You missed the Hornady gauge.

[flashhole]

I can see your side of the discussion if the bullet is canted in the neck. You straighten it and it's better than when you started. What effect does the Hornady system have on correcting run out on a round with an off-center neck or a neck that is thicker on one side than the other?

[10 Spot Terminator]

Have to figure if the necks are out of round there is only one true fix but we can ride this issue to death. Custom fitted chambers, precision trimmed brass , fire formed only, Lapua and Norma match brass all of the same lot, sorted by case volume , etc. etc. etc. ,,, . In this hobby you truly get what you pay for . Not everyone can afford a Rolls,,, some of us have to drive Chevys but we still get where we want to go ...

[flashhole]

I ordered the Forster. I will report my findings when I put it in service over Christmas. Thanks for all the inputs.

[LDBennett]

I was hot to get the Hornady one until I saw one. It appears to me that the case revolves on the rim and not the body of the case. With all the damage I see done to rims of some of my guns empties, I think the rim is not a good reference for turning the case to determine concentricity.

Anyone disagree?

LDBennett

[Unclenick]

I agree it should be further forward as the Forster does it; rolling on the outside of the head. As to bending them back, you can just drill some neck OD holes in a board or in your bench top and stick the cases in and bend them back by guestimation. NECO sells a pre-drilled plate for this. I originally assume the Hornady would be better, but people report enough spring-back that it apparently isn't really that much easier to do, once you get a feel for using the holes.

Distinguishing between a tilted neck or one with uneven thickness takes measuring at two points. If you place the gauge on the neck near the case mouth and mark the high spot, then again put it on the the bullet near case mouth, if they don't read about the same and if the high spots aren't on the same side, you have uneven neck thickness. If they are the same in both regards, all runout is due to neck runout.