Smith & Wesson WWII Victory

mjob · May 18, 2017, 12:51 AM

Hello, I ran across an auction with a S & W that was owned by the sellers grandfather with the serial # V173769. what would be a fair value for this and approximate date. Thank You

lamarw · May 18, 2017, 04:28 AM

It is missing the lanyard loop for one thing. A lot depends upon the buyer's premium and the sales tax. Do you have to pay for the FFL or is it free at the point of purchase? Are you having it shipped to your FFL?

A lot of unknowns. It is hard to tell with very small pictures. I would say, in total, no more than three to four hundred dollars if all checks out with revolver and it is in very good to excellent appearance condition and perfect operating condition.

As an example: You could pay $200.00 hammer price, add 18% buyers premium, $35.00 shipping cost, and another $35.00 FFL fee. You have then paid $306.00 for the revolver. I suspect an original lanyard loop will cost you $35 to $50.

BigJimP · May 18, 2017, 04:22 PM

In my area, there are a lot of them around...and if it had the landyard ring and is in excellent condition its worth at most $100....more commonly they are sold with a lot of holster wear - with a lot of the parkerized finish worn off...and a few nicks and scratches for $ 50...

I had one ...that was a family gun...an uncle bought it new after the war.../ it was his duty weapon as a deputy sheriff for many years.../ I've given it to a friend that uses it to train young shooters.

Just because its 70 yrs old or so ...doesn't mean there is a big price tag or a lot of demand for the Victory models.

lamarw · May 18, 2017, 07:58 PM

BigJimP got me doubting myself. I went and pulled out my copy of the "Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson" by Jim Supica and Richard Nahas. It is the 4th Edition published this past year.

The book has me planning a trip to go visit BigJimP along with a few hundred dollar bills in my wallet. Please forgive me Big Jim, I am not doubting your knowledge of firearms or their value in your neck of the woods. A nice Victory in very good or better condition is on my bucket list and there is no valid reason for it to remain there.

In the latest book the authors value a fair condition Victory at $250.00, a good condition at $350.00 and on up from there.

natman · May 19, 2017, 11:16 AM

Is it in 38 S&W or 38 Special?

James K · May 19, 2017, 11:09 PM

The caliber doesn't seem to affect price much today, though it did in the 1950's when a lot of .38 S&W revolvers were reamed for .38 Special. In fact, those guns are now in the collectible category and a gun in the original caliber will bring more in most places, regardless of what that caliber is.

FWIW, the cries of alarm about reaming chambers for .38 Special are/were much exaggerated. The .38 S&W chamber is not usually enough larger to cause split cases, the most common concern about rechambering. As to the "super powerful" 38 Special "blowing up" guns made for the .38 S&W, that is nonsense; the M&P model was made from day one for the .38 Special; the .38 S&W chambering was the war-time aberration.

Of course, caution should be used with any WWII-era or earlier revolvers and some of the modern "super hot" ammo avoided.

Jim

PzGren · May 19, 2017, 11:24 PM

I have to agree with lamarw that the value is closer to $350. The "flaming bomb" ordinance mark is clearly visible on it and if the grips are painted inside the panels with oil paint, it is a former Navy gun and there is a collector's market for them.

I sold one in better condition to a collector about 20 years ago and added $40 to buy a very nice used S&W M19-2.

BigJimP · May 20, 2017, 12:04 AM

No problem guys...I have the 4th edition of the s&w catalog...and i respect their research....

Maybe I was a little too critical on value of one in truly excellent condition.... most of them i see are probably in fair - good condition, with some finish wear....and gunshow sellers certainly ask more for them, but i haven't heard of any selling near the prices in the catalog...or for what some of you are seeing...

I'll keep my eyes open at next gunshow ....and try and get some price input from some of the guys that seem to always have a couple of them..... and get back to you...

I have a buddy that owns a local gun store...and he takes in a lot of used guns / sells a lot of new and used guns. Prices I mentioned reflected his view on them last year ....next time i see him, i'll ask his opinion & see if he has any in inventory.....but i know his used revolver sales in .38 spl have been pretty soft compared to a lot of the low price poly semi autos for the last year or so. But since he takes so many guns in trade...he knows what he can get for them.

I'll come back with an update..../ ... I have looked at photo's again and i can't see any ordinance mark with my bad eyes....--- but if its there, it will increase value a lot.

https://thefiringline.com/forums/att...6&d=1339792974

The Victory model i gave to my buddy...and an old holster made for it.../ you can see all those years carrying it as a duty gun, wore 90% of the parkerized finish off ....but i kind of like it worn vs that flat parkerized look....

James K · May 20, 2017, 11:11 PM

U.S. Army acceptance (inspector) marks should be present on all the M&P's that were bought by the U.S., which means all guns of either caliber made after about mid-1941. That was when the Lend-Lease program (signed into law in March 1941) reached the factory level. So those later guns were technically being made for the U.S., where prior to that they were made for the British or other countries under direct contracts with the purchasing country.

The term "Victory Model" came about when serial numbers of the M&P reached 999,999. S&W's numbering machines only went to six digits, so they decided to use an initial letter which could be put on all the frames before the actual numbering was done. At first, they were going to use "A", but some one suggested "V for Victory", a common slogan at the time, and the later guns became "Victory Models."

Jim

Recoil spring · May 21, 2017, 08:26 AM

Being a gun collector, interest in history, and collector of military hats, medals and uniforms I had always wanted one. Was a regular at the gun shows for decades and for some reason most of these S/W Victory models were just beat up, scratched, etc.

Seems like the commercial blued models seemed to be in better shape, and many of those were used by cops.

May 19, 2017, 11:16 AM	#5
natman Senior Member Join Date: June 24, 2008 Posts: 2,607	Is it in 38 S&W or 38 Special? __________________ Time Travelers' Wisdom: Never Do Yesterday What Should Be Done Tomorrow. If At Last You Do Succeed, Never Try Again.

May 20, 2017, 12:04 AM	#8
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	No problem guys...I have the 4th edition of the s&w catalog...and i respect their research.... Maybe I was a little too critical on value of one in truly excellent condition.... most of them i see are probably in fair - good condition, with some finish wear....and gunshow sellers certainly ask more for them, but i haven't heard of any selling near the prices in the catalog...or for what some of you are seeing... I'll keep my eyes open at next gunshow ....and try and get some price input from some of the guys that seem to always have a couple of them..... and get back to you... I have a buddy that owns a local gun store...and he takes in a lot of used guns / sells a lot of new and used guns. Prices I mentioned reflected his view on them last year ....next time i see him, i'll ask his opinion & see if he has any in inventory.....but i know his used revolver sales in .38 spl have been pretty soft compared to a lot of the low price poly semi autos for the last year or so. But since he takes so many guns in trade...he knows what he can get for them. I'll come back with an update..../ ... I have looked at photo's again and i can't see any ordinance mark with my bad eyes....--- but if its there, it will increase value a lot. https://thefiringline.com/forums/att...6&d=1339792974 The Victory model i gave to my buddy...and an old holster made for it.../ you can see all those years carrying it as a duty gun, wore 90% of the parkerized finish off ....but i kind of like it worn vs that flat parkerized look.... Last edited by BigJimP; May 20, 2017 at 12:59 AM.

May 21, 2017, 08:26 AM	#10
Recoil spring Member Join Date: March 29, 2017 Posts: 80	I had wanted one myself. Being a gun collector, interest in history, and collector of military hats, medals and uniforms I had always wanted one. Was a regular at the gun shows for decades and for some reason most of these S/W Victory models were just beat up, scratched, etc. Seems like the commercial blued models seemed to be in better shape, and many of those were used by cops.

May 18, 2017, 04:28 AM	#2
lamarw Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2010 Location: Lake Martin, AL Posts: 3,311	It is missing the lanyard loop for one thing. A lot depends upon the buyer's premium and the sales tax. Do you have to pay for the FFL or is it free at the point of purchase? Are you having it shipped to your FFL? A lot of unknowns. It is hard to tell with very small pictures. I would say, in total, no more than three to four hundred dollars if all checks out with revolver and it is in very good to excellent appearance condition and perfect operating condition. As an example: You could pay $200.00 hammer price, add 18% buyers premium, $35.00 shipping cost, and another $35.00 FFL fee. You have then paid $306.00 for the revolver. I suspect an original lanyard loop will cost you $35 to $50.

May 18, 2017, 04:22 PM	#3
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	In my area, there are a lot of them around...and if it had the landyard ring and is in excellent condition its worth at most $100....more commonly they are sold with a lot of holster wear - with a lot of the parkerized finish worn off...and a few nicks and scratches for $ 50... I had one ...that was a family gun...an uncle bought it new after the war.../ it was his duty weapon as a deputy sheriff for many years.../ I've given it to a friend that uses it to train young shooters. Just because its 70 yrs old or so ...doesn't mean there is a big price tag or a lot of demand for the Victory models.

May 18, 2017, 07:58 PM	#4
lamarw Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2010 Location: Lake Martin, AL Posts: 3,311	BigJimP got me doubting myself. I went and pulled out my copy of the "Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson" by Jim Supica and Richard Nahas. It is the 4th Edition published this past year. The book has me planning a trip to go visit BigJimP along with a few hundred dollar bills in my wallet. Please forgive me Big Jim, I am not doubting your knowledge of firearms or their value in your neck of the woods. A nice Victory in very good or better condition is on my bucket list and there is no valid reason for it to remain there. In the latest book the authors value a fair condition Victory at $250.00, a good condition at $350.00 and on up from there.

May 19, 2017, 11:09 PM	#6
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	The caliber doesn't seem to affect price much today, though it did in the 1950's when a lot of .38 S&W revolvers were reamed for .38 Special. In fact, those guns are now in the collectible category and a gun in the original caliber will bring more in most places, regardless of what that caliber is. FWIW, the cries of alarm about reaming chambers for .38 Special are/were much exaggerated. The .38 S&W chamber is not usually enough larger to cause split cases, the most common concern about rechambering. As to the "super powerful" 38 Special "blowing up" guns made for the .38 S&W, that is nonsense; the M&P model was made from day one for the .38 Special; the .38 S&W chambering was the war-time aberration. Of course, caution should be used with any WWII-era or earlier revolvers and some of the modern "super hot" ammo avoided. Jim

May 19, 2017, 11:24 PM	#7
PzGren Senior Member Join Date: August 14, 2001 Posts: 1,260	I have to agree with lamarw that the value is closer to $350. The "flaming bomb" ordinance mark is clearly visible on it and if the grips are painted inside the panels with oil paint, it is a former Navy gun and there is a collector's market for them. I sold one in better condition to a collector about 20 years ago and added $40 to buy a very nice used S&W M19-2.

May 20, 2017, 11:11 PM	#9
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	U.S. Army acceptance (inspector) marks should be present on all the M&P's that were bought by the U.S., which means all guns of either caliber made after about mid-1941. That was when the Lend-Lease program (signed into law in March 1941) reached the factory level. So those later guns were technically being made for the U.S., where prior to that they were made for the British or other countries under direct contracts with the purchasing country. The term "Victory Model" came about when serial numbers of the M&P reached 999,999. S&W's numbering machines only went to six digits, so they decided to use an initial letter which could be put on all the frames before the actual numbering was done. At first, they were going to use "A", but some one suggested "V for Victory", a common slogan at the time, and the later guns became "Victory Models." Jim