A few ?s about Auto-Chargers vs. Case-Activated Droppers

[Rangerrich99]

Here's the deal: I found a Hornady LNL Auto-Charge Powder Scale and Dispenser for about $140 brand-new at my LGS today. I want to know if it is better for my purposes than using a standard powder measure with a case-activated powder drop.

Link to the Auto-Charge: https://www.midwayusa.com/product/81...r-110-220-volt

Link to standard powder measure + case-activated powder drop: https://www.midwayusa.com/product/59...ed-powder-drop

I would be using either set-up for loading large quantities of practice-grade pistol (500 or more, straight-wall) ammunition. I wouldn't use it for bottle-neck rifle loading at all. I'd be using powders ranging from Titegroup, IMR4227, Power Pistol, 2400, CFEPistol, Bullseye, and maybe a couple others.

My questions are to those that have experience with both or either system, in reference to the already mentioned parameters (straight-wall pistol, 500+ lots, specified powders).

Which system would be more consistent? Faster? Less fussy about specific powders?

There are probably other questions I should ask, but these will do for a start. Thanks in advance for your replies.

P.S. The sale ends in two days, so any answers before would be greatly appreciated.

[jmorris]

I have powder dispensing devices that can drop with +/- a single kernel of powder and some that can keep up with dropping powder into more than 1000 cases an hour.

The auto-charge, depending on powder may or may not be more consistent but it will absolutely be slower at dropping charges.

It’s accurate to .1 grains, lots of pistol powders will drop that consistent from a measure.

That said, even if your charges varied by .2 of a grain , I bet you couldn’t tell in “practice-grade pistol ammunition”, hard enough in quality rifle ammunition if developed properly.

A case activated powder drop will drop powder as fast as you can stroke the ram all the way up then down, let’s call that 2 seconds. The auto-charge would be lucky to take only 10 seconds to go from charge to charge and you have to dump each one manually. If you feel like adding that kind of time to lots of 500+, better you than me.

[Unclenick]

Rangerrich99,

Watch Hornady's demonstration video. It will take around 10-15 seconds for the auto charger to dispense each charge, verses one second for the the automatically activated volumetric measure. The slow speed is fine if you are using a single-stage press and seating your next bullet and putting the finished round in the box and getting the next case primed while it dispenses. If you are using a progressive press or even a turret press, you will find this impossibly slow.

Even with precision rifle cartridges, any reduction in velocity variation you may get from super precisely dispensed powder charge weights won't be easy to detect on target until you are getting out to 300 yards, and may not make themselves seriously apparent until 600 yards. Keep in mind that a pretty accurate target rifle (not benchrest) shoots 1 moa at 600 yards to make scratch X-ring scores of the SR-1 target, and a pretty accurate target pistol shoots 4 moa at 50 yards to make the scratch X's on a B6 target. From that large difference in precision requirement, you can readily see why powder dispensing precision makes less difference for the pistol.

[reddog81]

What kind of press are you using.

I use the case activated powder drop on my Hornady LNL. It works perfectly for what you are have mentioned.

Using the auto charge dispenser wouldn't really work well with a progressive setup. The case activated dispenser wouldn't be of much benefit on a single stage.

[F. Guffey]

And when one will not run fast enough the reloader purchases two, this allows for seating a bullet while the other dispenser is filling another case.

F. Guffey

[jmorris]

I agree and I have more than two dispensers but I still wouldn’t use them to load batches of 500, plinker pistol rounds.

[hounddawg]

for bulk pistol and plinker .223 I use a Hornady auto drop and it works fine. For precision rifle I either drop and trickle or use a automated dispenser

[Rangerrich99]

Thanks guys. I have a couple presses, but for the above-stated purpose, I'd be using my Redding T7 turret press.

I didn't know that the Auto-Charge took 10-15 seconds to drop a charge; that's good to know.

I'm going to look into the case-activated powder dropper.

Does anyone know if I have to use a Hornady powder measure with the case-activated powder dropper? Or can I use the RCBS powder measure that I already have?

[hounddawg]

to be on the safe side I would just get a auto drop linkage made for the RCBS

https://www.brownells.com/reloading/...nt=749-015-644

[Rangerrich99]

Originally Posted by hounddawg

to be on the safe side I would just get a auto drop linkage made for the RCBS

https://www.brownells.com/reloading/...nt=749-015-644

Ah, thanks. That solves that.

[hounddawg]

Ah, thanks. That solves that.

I have the Hornady and just judging from the pics etc the powder throws look to be identical except for the color of the paint but there could be some minor differences and you're welcome

[RC20]

I don't have either setup though I do have a Lyman auto dispenser.

I find I can do a variety of things while waiting for the powder to hit its stop point in the pan.

I have to label the box as to powder, what split of powder if multiple steps as well as bullet.

I do use a single stage presss, I can get 2 bullets in 308 and 3 in 30-06 seated in between.

Faster than a beam, faster than an undercharge and trickle up.

I won't go back, but I don't do fast reloading and I always have a lot to fuss with in between charges.

[jmorris]

I find I can do a variety of things while waiting for the powder to hit its stop point in the pan....

I do use a single stage presss, I can get 2 bullets in 308 and 3 in 30-06 seated in between

That’s kind of the issue, you drop one charge but could be seating several bullets waiting on a single dispenser or diverting your attention to other activities.

[Baldwin]

I'm using the Hornady case activated powder drop on a Redding T7. Really works good.

[BBarn]

Are you guys using auto powder drops doing so with powder thru expanders (such as a Hornady PTX) also? Otherwise I'm not seeing much advantage when using a single or simple turret press.

[jmorris]

Most often I use Lyman’s “powder pal” pan with built in funnel. Not many powder through expander dies for rifle rounds, bridging is already enough of a problem without further reducing the ID. Not to mention the expanders are already on the decapping pin, so it would be redundant.

[JeepHammer]

I have to agree with Mr. Morris.
I've had one or more of about every dispenser made, and each has it's strengths & weaknesses.
Some won't drop flake powder accurately when cranking out volume, while some don't like to break extruded grains, still others have issues throwing CONSISTENT charges as the powder in the bin reduces as you work...

With a progressive, I recommend a case activated dropper, so you don't dump a load in the press.
I also HIGHLY recommend a powder checker right after the powder dropper!
I can recommend the Dillon type checker, since it will detect over/under volume in the cases fairly precisely, even when using just a few grains (like TiteGroup in .45 cases). Mine have found stainless steel cleaning pins in rifle cases, which is VERY little volume difference.

Dillon style sliding charge bar droppers sometimes don't like long extruded powder, they don't like to break the grains. Short grain extruded runs pretty well, very few issues.

The one dropper I won't use is Lee Disk (sliding charge bar), the metal base units are bad enough, but the all plastic units are total junk. When I get them in a box of pieces & parts I just throw them away.
I got a couple working about half OK, but it took a LOT of work, just easier (and more accurate) to buy something NOT made of warped plastic in the first place.

Hornady makes a fair to good dropper, can't complain, can't brag on it.

For precision rounds I still use the micrometer adjustable RCBS or Redding, and a trickler to finish out the charge.
If it doesn't want to drop consistent charges (light flake powders mostly) I simply drop a weight on top the powder column, a couple washers wrapped in duct tape, with a string tied to them for easy removal. The added weight really evens out the charges.

You pays your money, you takes your chances!

[RC20]

That’s kind of the issue, you drop one charge but could be seating several bullets waiting on a single dispenser or diverting your attention to other activities.

I don't find it a problem and I am far from a multi tasking millennial.

No disagreement with if it does not work for you don't do it.

Pistol you should always scan the load block to make sure all are the same.

Rifle tends to be self eliminating with overflow or obvious.

[Rangerrich99]

Originally Posted by JeepHammer

If it doesn't want to drop consistent charges (light flake powders mostly) I simply drop a weight on top the powder column, a couple washers wrapped in duct tape, with a string tied to them for easy removal. The added weight really evens out the charges.

You pays your money, you takes your chances!

Thanks for the hack. Definitely going to try that out during my next loading session.

[Rangerrich99]

Originally Posted by RC20

I don't have either setup though I do have a Lyman auto dispenser.

I find I can do a variety of things while waiting for the powder to hit its stop point in the pan.

I have to label the box as to powder, what split of powder if multiple steps as well as bullet.

I do use a single stage presss, I can get 2 bullets in 308 and 3 in 30-06 seated in between.

Faster than a beam, faster than an undercharge and trickle up.

I won't go back, but I don't do fast reloading and I always have a lot to fuss with in between charges.

Essentially I do the same thing you described when loading rifle cartridges for hunting. But for loading large numbers of pistol rounds it's pretty slow, which is why I created this thread. I don't need absolutely precise powder charges for practice pistol ammo, just something that's fairly consistent. And significantly faster than dropping charges and waiting for my beam to settle out every time.

[kmw1954]

20 posts and I am shocked no one has suggested a Lee powder measure. Say what you want about Lee products, cheap, whatever, but these powder measures work and work well. Especially for pistol charges.

For the price of that RCBS linkage I can buy almost 3 Lee measures. Wait I do have 3 of them. 2 Auto disks and 1 Auto Drum. All of them with hold with-in .1gr with most pistol powders that I've used.

[jmorris]

I wasn’t being brand specific more of a dispenser vs measure but yeah I would use an auto disk over a dispenser for 500 plinker pistol rounds. I would pick a disk as close to my target as I could though, as I don’t like the adjustable powder charge bar, the disks work better.

There are better choices but as you noted, they cost more too.

[BBarn]

I guess I'm slow. I don't see an advantage to a case activated powder drop has when using a non-progressive press. I guess you could use it in conjunction with case expanding with straight wall cartridges, but it would need to be adjusted for each caliber (at least with the Hornady one).

I would just mount the RCBS Uniflow on a stand or use the bracket it comes with and clamp it to a bench/table. I wouldn't hassle with using a powder drop and mounting it to a single stage or non-progressive press.

Edit: I guess some individuals like to index the turret and sequentially do all steps to finish each round. With that method I can see why one might want a case activated powder drop. When using a turret, I do each operation on the set of cases before indexing which reduces the advantage of a case activated powder drop.

[RC20]

I do have and used the Lyman 1200 for a while. Nice scale, great big touch screen.

It also has the built on trickler. Not a very smooth one but works ok. (I did try to wear it in more hooking it up to a drill but that did not help)

My method for that was to use the old RCBS rock and roll drum and undershoot by 3/10 or so (or more if it overshot)

I then put the pan t on the 1200 and trickled it up to what I wanted.

It worked well, but I do prefer the auto dispenser.

Again I am no whiz bang multi tasker, but I don't see where you can get lost with doing something else.

At worst the powder sits in the pan for 5 minutes.

I have missed powder in a line of 5. Good practice rounds, didn't hurt anything, bullets don't move into bore (they will in hand guns)

I do double fill a case from time to time, merely annoying not a safety issue.

But again, if it does not feel right and work for you, then by all means avoid them, or wait.

Each person is different. My stuff works for me and probably works for others in any given task, but I doubt everyi9ng I do or how I do it works for that same person across the range of reloading.

Some don't care about clean cases. I like clean cases, so I do the steps to get them cleaned up .

My loads are not hunting loads, for better or worse I am trying to shoot the smallest groups I can so I go to more efforts. I may not succeed but I eliminate factors I have under my control as best I think helps.

[Rangerrich99]

Originally Posted by BBarn

I don't see an advantage to a case activated powder drop has when using a non-progressive press. I guess you could use it in conjunction with case expanding with straight wall cartridges, but it would need to be adjusted for each caliber (at least with the Hornady one).

The short answer: by using a case-activated dropper and flow-thru expander die in place of my current system, that should reduce the time it takes to do two steps down to the time it takes to do one. That should reduce the overall time it takes to load 500 rounds by about an hour. That would translate into saving several hours per caliber. At least for 9mm (4,000 rds), .40 S&W (3,000 rds), and .45 auto (3,000). That's more time to load .38 spl, .357 magnum, .44 spl, and .44 magnum, as well as all the rifle rounds I have to load in a fairly short window of time.

Of course, I could be wrong about my calculations, but if it works I won't be scrambling to finish loading next January.