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Old November 7, 2018, 10:38 PM   #1
Prof Young
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Getting "comfortable" with CC.

I used to carry with an empty chamber.

I have a sig p238 and just couldn't get used to cocked and locked. It "scared" me. Then I got a DAO pocket gun. With it in a pocket holster I was a touch uncomfortable with one in the chamber but carried it that way and got use to it. Then got a DA/SA Springfield and when I vest carry there is one in chamber with the safety on. Now even my Sig P238 might go in the pocket holster, cocked and locked.

All this to say that my cc experience has been one of self education and learning to trust my gear. My latest comfort frontier has been OWB carry of my sig or my springfield with my shirttail over it. Still feel a bit self conscious when i do that but am getting more and more comfortable.

Thoughts and comments welcome.

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Old November 8, 2018, 06:30 AM   #2
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DA/SA really helps my comfort level while carrying. My Sig 225 A1 is one such beast. Ok with one chambered and the hammer decocked. My summer pocket gun is a Sig 238. Not so comfortable with that one. Something about a first, long, trigger pull gives me comfort. Like you, I’ll get more comfortable with carrying a SA , locked, in condition one.
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Old November 8, 2018, 08:22 AM   #3
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With regards to carrying chambered, what helped me the most was finally investing in better quality holsters. Flimsy $10 nylon holsters may "get the job done", but they often don't securely cover the trigger guard and don't inspire much confidence. With a quality kydex holster, I've no concern whatsoever carrying SAO pistols condition one.
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Old November 8, 2018, 08:49 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by MandolinMan View Post
With regards to carrying chambered, what helped me the most was finally investing in better quality holsters. Flimsy $10 nylon holsters may "get the job done", but they often don't securely cover the trigger guard and don't inspire much confidence. With a quality kydex holster, I've no concern whatsoever carrying SAO pistols condition one.
Agree..I carry a LCP with a trigger guard which gives me confidence(only been CCW since last Feb)..Also Glock, which are pretty safe by design, as striker fired..all with 'one in the chamber'..BUT good holsters
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Old November 8, 2018, 09:34 AM   #5
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Interesting. When I switched to a .380 for carry, I had a Colt Government .380... the grandpappy to the Sig P238. I really didn't trust the thumb safety, the detent was pretty weak and anything brushing against it would knock it off. The .380 doesn't have the grip safety, but it was a Series 80 pistol, so I just carried it hammer down on a loaded chamber. Once I started practicing in earnest... drawing the pistol, trying to cock it, and then shoot it effectively... I realized how stupid that was, and that I just, really, didn't trust the pistol. I finally abandoned it for a striker-fired Kahr.

I don't have that problem with my 1911 .45's, and carry them cocked and locked without concern, but I have good holsters for them, and I trust the pistols.
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Old November 8, 2018, 10:57 AM   #6
lee n. field
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof Young View Post
I used to carry with an empty chamber.

I have a sig p238 and just couldn't get used to cocked and locked. It "scared" me. Then I got a DAO pocket gun. With it in a pocket holster I was a touch uncomfortable with one in the chamber but carried it that way and got use to it. Then got a DA/SA Springfield and when I vest carry there is one in chamber with the safety on. Now even my Sig P238 might go in the pocket holster, cocked and locked.
Which Springfield is DA/SA? (ah, yes, the XDE. Forgot about that. Never mind.)

Quote:
All this to say that my cc experience has been one of self education and learning to trust my gear.
The user is less trustworthy than the equipment.

For someone who can't get over that discomfort, a .38 snub revolver is a viable option.
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Last edited by lee n. field; November 8, 2018 at 08:06 PM.
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Old November 8, 2018, 12:26 PM   #7
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Was it your holster that made you uncomfortable about carrying cocked and locked? or the gun itself?
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Old November 8, 2018, 01:24 PM   #8
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OP, I feel the same way. I love my walther ppq for range and competition shooting. No way I’m walking around with it with one in the chamber. Yes, yes, I know it has a trigger safety. I own it.

I carry a SA xde 45. Chambered, hammer down/decocked, safety on. I can draw it, drop the safety and pull the double action trigger with either hand. Yes, it takes a fraction longer than a striker. But I’m not going to ever have a negligent discharge, and I have piece of mind while carrying.

If the threat level increases I can drop the safety in the holster and go to da on the draw. I could draw and click the hammer back at the next step.

I’m not a cop doing traffic stops and domestics all day. It’s a personal choice with my own risk assessment to have an additional click before the boom!
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Old November 8, 2018, 04:19 PM   #9
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Pretty much the same way here. I’m just a regular Joe and I don’t keep one in a semi-auto’s chamber until I’m ready to fire.

I know it will take me an extra second or two if i ever had to fire defensively. But I also know I’ve greatly reduced the chance of an accidental discharge.

Maintaining good situational awareness to anticipate a potential threat arising will compensate for the added time to first shot. Weighing risk vs benefit, empty semi-auto chamber works for me.
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Old November 8, 2018, 04:32 PM   #10
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I carry a 1911 in condition one or cocked and locked and one in the chamber as you all stated. Many believe that carrying in condition one is very safe because you know it and there fore will be extra cautious because you know there is one in the chamber. I tend to agree. Many accidental discharges occur throughout the country because many thought their gun was empty. If you know that you have one in the chamber you will not squeeze that trigger . But I do understand why you do not feel comfortable carrying condition one, maybe in time you will develop the confidence needed. A good way to start is by carrying a revolver as well.
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Old November 8, 2018, 05:42 PM   #11
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Like you, I have never been comfortable with one in the chamber when I am carrying. However, I "solved" my problem differently and my 3 CC semi-autos sit in my safe. I bought a hammerless snub nose 357 Magnum/38 Special revolver that I am comfortable with because I don't worry about an accidental discharge no matter what stupid thing I might do. It took me a few trips to get reasonably accurate shooting 38 Special +P but I have come around. Oddly enough, I shot 3 of my semi-autos today and apparently, shooting my DAO revolver has made me more accurate shooting them.

I have also discovered that shooting full power 357 Magnum in a 20 ounce snub nose gets your attention and a few rounds per outing is enough.
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Old November 8, 2018, 05:53 PM   #12
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Professor I think for most of us there is an adjustment period when we begin to carry a handgun. When I first started carrying, a cocked and locked 1911 or a striker fired pistol without a thumb safety, e.g., a Glock, was not an option for me. After a few years of every day carry either one of those options is perfectly acceptable. Of course that has only happened after hundreds of hours and thousands of rounds fired.

Things change with time. I used to love driving a vehicle with a manual transmission; now I would not consider buying one.

Enjoy the journey!
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Old November 8, 2018, 06:37 PM   #13
Prof Young
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Reply to Lee and Space man . .

Lee - I have a Springfield XDE. It's the Springfield with a hammer. Has a safety and decocker. You may carry cocked and locked if you want to or just get used to that first shot as a DA. Seriously thin gun and I carry it when I'm wearing anything that allows me to wear a vest or jacket with a cc pocket.

Spaceman - It was the gun itself. Just didn't like the idea of a cocked hammer over a bullet even with the safety on. But I'm okay with that now. It's important to have quality gear for cocked and locked and my Sig p238 meets that requirement.

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Old November 8, 2018, 08:07 PM   #14
lee n. field
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof Young View Post
Lee - I have a Springfield XDE. It's the Springfield with a hammer. Has a safety and decocker.
Prof Young
Yep, figured that out. The Springfield that's easy to forget.
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Old November 9, 2018, 09:01 PM   #15
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Scanning the replies, I am amazed at the number of 'carry' folks who struggle with 'safety' issues. Simple: get a Springfield, with the trigger (Glock) safety, and with the 1911 grip safety...and never carry your personal protection rig w/o one in the chamber! Look back on the times when you went to chamber a round, and something went south...want that to be the time your life depends on it?

Safeties, de-cockers...perfect examples of how you will be killed, while you diddle with those worthless 'safety' designs. The bad guy is ready, so why aren't you?
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Old November 9, 2018, 10:19 PM   #16
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Training is the answer to overcoming the "uncomfortable feeling".
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Old November 10, 2018, 07:31 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof Young View Post
I used to carry with an empty chamber.

I have a sig p238 and just couldn't get used to cocked and locked. It "scared" me. Then I got a DAO pocket gun. With it in a pocket holster I was a touch uncomfortable with one in the chamber but carried it that way and got use to it. Then got a DA/SA Springfield and when I vest carry there is one in chamber with the safety on. Now even my Sig P238 might go in the pocket holster, cocked and locked.

All this to say that my cc experience has been one of self education and learning to trust my gear. My latest comfort frontier has been OWB carry of my sig or my springfield with my shirttail over it. Still feel a bit self conscious when i do that but am getting more and more comfortable.

Thoughts and comments welcome.

Life is good.
Prof Young
When I first started carrying, I carried a 1911 with an empty chamber. I did that for a few months, then started carrying it in Condition 1. I really kind of skipped over the cheap nylon holsters, starting with a Theis clone of a CBST, and then moving to a DeSantis Speed Scabbard for OWB carry. For me, it was as much about learning to trust myself with CC as it was about learning to trust my gear. I needed a little time to reassure myself about things like "what if the safety clicks off while I'm driving?" and "what will I do if the gun falls out of my holster when I'm getting in or out of the car?" I've been carrying for around ten years now, and I can safely say that I don't think about those things nearly as much.
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Old November 10, 2018, 07:36 AM   #18
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Training could be the answer but I have been training 6 years and I still don't feel comfortable with one in. Old age is sitting in I guess.
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Old November 13, 2018, 01:57 AM   #19
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38 snubbie revolver is my go-to ccw. due to some excellent training years ago i feel much more comfortable with it fully loaded and no safety than carrying a semiauto with one in the chamber cocked and locked.



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Old November 13, 2018, 11:45 AM   #20
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im kind of in the same boat as the op, I have a problem carrying the sig 938 in condition one. I really wish the gun was either sa/da or had the grip safety like a 1911. I tried moving up to a kimber pro carry, little heavier gun but the main problem is the 4" barrel just seems a little uncomfortable. Now im mulling over either the sa xde or a 3" 1911 like the colt defender. I still carry the 938 occasionally but its usually with the hammer down, not ideal but i train drawing and cocking it right now so its doable.
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Old November 13, 2018, 06:10 PM   #21
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I think getting comfortable with your CC weapon is just a question of routine, more than anything. Yes, training enters into it at some level, but unless you're an instructor, training only comprises a very small amount of your total time with your gun.

About thirty years ago was when I first started carrying concealed. My gun was a 1911, which I carried one in the chamber, hammer down. This was due to my relative inexperience, and my irrational fear that somehow a cocked hammer could defeat both the safety and the grip safety and unintentionally fire a round. A couple years after that, I actually did the math on that probability and knew that was a near impossibility. I don't remember the exact number, but it's about as likely as being hit by lightning. According to the math, one could carry a 1911 cocked and unlocked, so long as it was in a proper holster it would be just as safe as cocked and locked.

Once I did the math I started carrying cocked and locked, or Condition One. And ritualistically, daily practiced my draw to thumb down the safety fifty times before heading off to work (no, no mag in the gun). It became second nature. To the point that I try to thumb off the safety on every semi I carry when I draw. It's just a habit.

Then I took that gun to the range at least once a week for almost a year and I learned everything about that gun; how it functioned, how it malfunctioned, why it malfunctioned, how to fix malfunctions, how long it took to fix malfunctions, etc.

It was a long time ago, but I'd guess that it took me about a month or two to get completely used to carrying my 1911 cocked and locked.

Conversely, when I first began carrying a striker gun, the lack of a safety weirded me out some at first. But after awhile I treated the thing as if it were a DA revolver and the weird feeling went away. Again, taking the thing to the range and getting totally familiar with the thing backwards and forwards helped a lot.

The consistent factor for me was a proper holster that covered the trigger guard. Even my pocket holsters cover the trigger guard; I wouldn't pocket carry without one. Again, it's a habit.

My point being (finally) is that it's proper equipment plus daily routine plus total familiarity with your gun solves the issue of being comfortable with your CC. Get the right holster, a proper gun belt, become perfectly at home with your gun, and carry it everyday. In a month or two you'll feel naked without it.

Last edited by Rangerrich99; November 13, 2018 at 06:22 PM. Reason: no such thing as "frix"
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Old November 14, 2018, 11:34 PM   #22
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Quote:
Spats McGee wrote:
For me, it was as much about learning to trust myself with CC as it was about learning to trust my gear.
I think that's pretty much the key.

About the only time I routinely carry is when I am at the family farm. The place is remote enough that law enforcement couldn't reach me in time to help. And the place is big enough someone could easily get between me and the house or one of the outbuildings where a gun might be stored. It took some time before I got to where I didn't think about the gun and that's when I stopped worrying about it.
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Old November 15, 2018, 10:38 AM   #23
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Quote:
Training is the answer to overcoming the "uncomfortable feeling".
Absolutely!

I too, felt uneasy keeping a round in the chamber when I first starting shooting pistols. I even went as far as having a loaded magazine next to an empty gun (aka a paperweight!) when I first bought a pistol.

Training and understanding of firearm fundamentals gradually lessened that "uncomfortable" feeling over time.

All that said, by the time I started carrying a gun, I had been regularly shooting handguns for about a year and had become somewhat of a competent shot and felt MUCH more confident with my abilities with a firearm.

Never have I ever carried a gun without one in the chamber. DA/SA pistols get carried hammer down safety off one in the chamber.

Striker fired pistols get carried chambered, manual safety on if applicable.

I don't have the fortune of owning a single action 1911 (the day is coming!) so I won't speak to that, but when that day comes, I will carry condition 1 "locked and cocked".

Follow the rules of firearm safety and a Negligent Discharge should not happen BUT if it does, it shan't harm anything or anyone in its path.
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Old November 15, 2018, 02:14 PM   #24
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OP, if you have any club(s) in your area shooting IPSC or IDPA let me suggest you go take a look at them. Shooting either one of these games will help with becoming more comfortable carrying a handgun. You won't learn much of anything about self defense but will learn gun handling and become comfortable carrying a fully loaded gun with some practice. IMO the games are fun enough to encourage most folks to do so. IPSC is where I got over my concerns about carrying condition one. It's also where I got comfortable drawing a firing a handgun.

Carrying concealed can become an extension of the skills you learn from the games.

Then you just have to learn that most all folks won't suspect you and won't give you a second look when you're carrying.
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Old November 15, 2018, 03:45 PM   #25
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I had a Sig P938....until it had problems ( a couple of years after it became my primary CC) that left me uncomfortable with using it as more than a range toy.

Initially with the P938 I, also, was uncomfortable, with SA. But it had a hammer and external safety and would go into my pocket in a holster quite well.....but heavy.

Initially I carried the P938 unloaded in my daily routine just to get accustomed to it. On the range it was an exceptional shooter and I "fell in love" with it.

If the safety had not fallen out and it had not started dropping magazines I would still be using it.

I got the problems fixed and just could not feel as if I could rely on it so I traded it with extra magazines for another gun.

I used to only want hammer fired DA/SA ambi safety (left handed) but have transitioned to carrying striker fired with no safety (the left handed came into play so I opted no safety).

You will become accustomed to it. The P938/238 are good guns, but I have to have absolute confidence to use it when my life and my families are at stake.
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