2nd/3rd gen colts - Page 3

Hardy · March 25, 2011, 08:10 PM

Hardy · March 25, 2011, 08:12 PM

Hardy · March 25, 2011, 08:14 PM

Hardy · March 25, 2011, 08:34 PM

Ok, took some doin but here are 4. I wish you could see the 49 pocket better since its silver plating is much better than shown. I'm getting a 3rd display box for that w/ its colt accesories soon. I'll keep that one.

Fingers McGee · March 25, 2011, 10:48 PM

Nice group of Sig Series guns Hardy.

Hardy · March 27, 2011, 07:13 PM

Thanks Fingers. Interested in the Marine dragoon??

Fingers McGee · March 27, 2011, 09:35 PM

The Marine Dragoons are interesting. Even if they are mis-identified. Colt BP Arms Co. called them third models dragoons; but they are in fact Whitneyville Hartford Dragoons (AKA Transition Walkers) with silver plated frame and barrel and gold plated cylinnder.

I don't collect Sig Series guns though.

MikeKPP · March 28, 2011, 02:35 PM

Since the 45 long colt cartridge was longer in 1873 then today. Would that make the cyclinder longer or its the same size as todays peace makers.

Hawg · March 28, 2011, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Since the 45 long colt cartridge was longer in 1873 then today. Would that make the cyclinder longer or its the same size as todays peace makers.

Who said it was longer?

Hardy · March 28, 2011, 07:15 PM

Fingers,
I understand why you don't collect the series. I just thought you'd find that dragoon pretty

I have 2nd gens but can't sell them in store due to price. I have had some good luck with BP enthusiasts over the 3rds since they are collectible and out of production and are not as expensive as the 2nds. Actually I only want 3rds if the liner in box is not cracked and has manual and white shipping box. I can still get some but they are getting harder to find. I think the Pattersons w/display might be a good investment now if you can get one at a good price. A company is coming out w/them that might have the 3rd gen frames and barrel, but they are going to be HIGH.the article about them is in the newest "Guns of the old west" Have you heard?
WBH

Hardy · April 4, 2011, 07:04 PM

Hey cowboys

You don't like dem guns?

And Thanks Fingers for your nice comment

You know Sam Colt signed them LOL

WBH

Fingers McGee · April 4, 2011, 10:41 PM

I've seen the article on the limited edition Paterson. Being made from some left over Sig Series Patersons from what the article says. If I hit the lottery between now & when they all get sold, I may have to buy one.

What 2nd Gens do you have? Always looking to fill in blanks in my collection.

Hardy · April 4, 2011, 11:00 PM

Fingers #1st. I can get some 3rd gen pattersons in display box w/ accesories I would prefer not to disclose a price but cheaper than what is coming out. Bravo to you reading that.

Um, I still have support that the 3rds are considered Colts. But we can debate that again

I have a RE Lee in box w/accessories

A 51 Navy

A Police 36

A baby dragoon.

I am trying to get from Uberti at dealer price a london steel 51 Navy.

The best repo I have is the Pietta 51 36 navy colt in pietta box with spare cylinder. I can no longer get those from my source. It is the smoothest looking and only cocking it once, felt no burrs but a perfect slide and slickness in hammer channel. Anyway--I posted it at a good price on Buy sell thread--can't go lower. As far as 2nd and 3rd gen colts--they are negotiable.

Fingers McGee · April 5, 2011, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Um, I still have support that the 3rds are considered Colts. But we can debate that again

How about a 1994 quote from a Colt Executive that says they're not?

Is the 1851 a C series or F series, and NIB? The F series one I have has a slight turn line on it. I'm looking for one that is pristine.

FM

junkman_01 · April 5, 2011, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Hardy: Um, I still have support that the 3rds are considered Colts. But we can debate that again

Quote:

Fingers: How about a 1994 quote from a Colt Executive that says they're not?

They real question we should ask Hardy should be; By whom?

Hawg · April 5, 2011, 02:36 PM

Somebody who knows somebody who has a cousin who knew somebody who's grandfather worked for Colt 50 years ago.

Bishop Creek · April 5, 2011, 10:02 PM

Here is one way to find out if the Signature Series will letter to Colt. I think they will. $75 gets you a Colt letter (look under revolvers for "reproduction black powder models"):

http://www.coltcollectors.com/conten...ve-99500.shtml

Hardy · April 6, 2011, 08:15 PM

Ok...Do you think Colt (a legendary company of superb firearms and internationally known) would let a company stamp their BRAND on them and not have some say so on all this? Come on. Ok, the restaurant you are eating in has an A rating. Are you sure a health inspector was really there? or was a palm greased. As far as I know the guns were inspected by Colt. A retired 80 year old man worked there and retired in 2000 said they were. I would be stupid to post his name and address but why would he lie? Why would a big Co like Colt let some back alley gunmaker stamp their name on them without some kind of quality control or inspections. For instance, if you look up the Marine dragoon there is reference info that it was a Whitney etc-colt and that Colt reisued them in the 90's. If You go to Barnes & Noble and buy the Colt book--the thirds are in them. I really thought that uberti made them and a rep came to London to inspect. But that is not true either. If the guns are stamed Colt then they are colts-who ever made them. Or Colt would sue for counterfeiting. Yu think?

WBH

Bishop Creek · April 6, 2011, 09:12 PM

Quote:

If the guns are stamped Colt then they are colts-who ever made them. Or Colt would sue for counterfeiting. Yu think?

I agree. Cap and ball expert Dennis Adler in his Black Powder Revolvers-Reproductions and Replicas calls them Colts. The only modern replica cap and ball revolvers actually made under the Colt Hartford dome were the "C" series 1851 Navy's in the early 1970s (including the Lee & Grant cased sets), the later "F" series were only inspected and shipped by Colt after being made by Iver Johnson in New Jersey. The F series are considered real Colts and the Signature Series revolvers were also made by the same gunmakers under license from Colt. As Adler says: "...a Colt pistol bearing the Colt name and patent, regardless of where the individual components are cast, is a Colt."

Hardy · April 6, 2011, 10:14 PM

Thank you Bishop Creek. In over 2 years selling B/P guns have I ever had a customer discredit the 3rd gen colts. In fact, they want them. yes, they're not as valuable as the 2nd's but they are COLTS and re enactors that are true to the bone C/B enthusiasts want used 3rds (which are hard to find) because they bear the cold stamping and do not say BLACK POWDER Only) They even respect the unfired 3rds in the boxes not torn up and they are torn whether they want to shoot them or collect them!

junkman_01 · April 6, 2011, 10:18 PM

Hey Hardy,

Ever see the TV commercials for all that Chinese electronic stuff with the Bell and Howell brand on them? Same idea. A well known company SOLD their name to make a dime!

Bishop Creek · April 6, 2011, 10:31 PM

Hardy,
I wish I could afford to buy your 1851 Navy. I had a Signature Series 1851 Navy years ago but, like a fool sold it. But I am about ready to send $75 to Colt to see if they will letter my Signature Series 1860 Army to settle this question once and for all.

Fingers McGee · April 6, 2011, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fingers McGee

Is the 1851 a C series or F series, and NIB? The F series one I have has a slight turn line on it. I'm looking for one that is pristine.

Hardy, you haven't answered the question yet.

FM

Hardy · April 6, 2011, 11:00 PM

Come on Junkman--we can nic pic all we want. Bell &Howard? You read it all. There is no more to say to this debate unless more info gets on. If you don't think the 3rds are colts then you don't think so. That's OK. I guess a lot of yu don't. I guess Fords aren't really Fords anymore. How far can we take this. Ima sayin--it has Colt stamped on it. And in my collection they are colts.

Hardy · April 6, 2011, 11:03 PM

No fingers, the 1851 has been fired 6 rounds-and a true collector will notice some minor tiks. I do have original box, papers, wrapping. Will sell to you for reasonabl price if you desire.

March 25, 2011, 10:48 PM	#55
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	Nice group of Sig Series guns Hardy. __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

March 27, 2011, 09:35 PM	#57
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	The Marine Dragoons are interesting. Even if they are mis-identified. Colt BP Arms Co. called them third models dragoons; but they are in fact Whitneyville Hartford Dragoons (AKA Transition Walkers) with silver plated frame and barrel and gold plated cylinnder. I don't collect Sig Series guns though. __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

March 28, 2011, 02:35 PM	#58
MikeKPP Junior Member Join Date: March 23, 2011 Posts: 8	45 long colt round Since the 45 long colt cartridge was longer in 1873 then today. Would that make the cyclinder longer or its the same size as todays peace makers.

April 4, 2011, 10:41 PM	#62
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	I've seen the article on the limited edition Paterson. Being made from some left over Sig Series Patersons from what the article says. If I hit the lottery between now & when they all get sold, I may have to buy one. What 2nd Gens do you have? Always looking to fill in blanks in my collection. __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

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March 25, 2011, 08:10 PM	#51
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709

March 25, 2011, 08:12 PM	#52
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709

March 25, 2011, 08:14 PM	#53
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709

March 25, 2011, 08:34 PM	#54
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Ok, took some doin but here are 4. I wish you could see the 49 pocket better since its silver plating is much better than shown. I'm getting a 3rd display box for that w/ its colt accesories soon. I'll keep that one.

March 27, 2011, 07:13 PM	#56
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Thanks Fingers. Interested in the Marine dragoon??

March 28, 2011, 07:15 PM	#60
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Fingers, I understand why you don't collect the series. I just thought you'd find that dragoon pretty I have 2nd gens but can't sell them in store due to price. I have had some good luck with BP enthusiasts over the 3rds since they are collectible and out of production and are not as expensive as the 2nds. Actually I only want 3rds if the liner in box is not cracked and has manual and white shipping box. I can still get some but they are getting harder to find. I think the Pattersons w/display might be a good investment now if you can get one at a good price. A company is coming out w/them that might have the 3rd gen frames and barrel, but they are going to be HIGH.the article about them is in the newest "Guns of the old west" Have you heard? WBH

April 4, 2011, 07:04 PM	#61
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Hey cowboys You don't like dem guns? And Thanks Fingers for your nice comment You know Sam Colt signed them LOL WBH

April 4, 2011, 11:00 PM	#63
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Fingers #1st. I can get some 3rd gen pattersons in display box w/ accesories I would prefer not to disclose a price but cheaper than what is coming out. Bravo to you reading that. Um, I still have support that the 3rds are considered Colts. But we can debate that again I have a RE Lee in box w/accessories A 51 Navy A Police 36 A baby dragoon. I am trying to get from Uberti at dealer price a london steel 51 Navy. The best repo I have is the Pietta 51 36 navy colt in pietta box with spare cylinder. I can no longer get those from my source. It is the smoothest looking and only cocking it once, felt no burrs but a perfect slide and slickness in hammer channel. Anyway--I posted it at a good price on Buy sell thread--can't go lower. As far as 2nd and 3rd gen colts--they are negotiable.

April 5, 2011, 02:36 PM	#66
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Somebody who knows somebody who has a cousin who knew somebody who's grandfather worked for Colt 50 years ago.

April 5, 2011, 10:02 PM	#67
Bishop Creek Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Posts: 566	Here is one way to find out if the Signature Series will letter to Colt. I think they will. $75 gets you a Colt letter (look under revolvers for "reproduction black powder models"): http://www.coltcollectors.com/conten...ve-99500.shtml

April 6, 2011, 08:15 PM	#68
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Ok...Do you think Colt (a legendary company of superb firearms and internationally known) would let a company stamp their BRAND on them and not have some say so on all this? Come on. Ok, the restaurant you are eating in has an A rating. Are you sure a health inspector was really there? or was a palm greased. As far as I know the guns were inspected by Colt. A retired 80 year old man worked there and retired in 2000 said they were. I would be stupid to post his name and address but why would he lie? Why would a big Co like Colt let some back alley gunmaker stamp their name on them without some kind of quality control or inspections. For instance, if you look up the Marine dragoon there is reference info that it was a Whitney etc-colt and that Colt reisued them in the 90's. If You go to Barnes & Noble and buy the Colt book--the thirds are in them. I really thought that uberti made them and a rep came to London to inspect. But that is not true either. If the guns are stamed Colt then they are colts-who ever made them. Or Colt would sue for counterfeiting. Yu think? WBH

April 6, 2011, 10:14 PM	#70
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Thank you Bishop Creek. In over 2 years selling B/P guns have I ever had a customer discredit the 3rd gen colts. In fact, they want them. yes, they're not as valuable as the 2nd's but they are COLTS and re enactors that are true to the bone C/B enthusiasts want used 3rds (which are hard to find) because they bear the cold stamping and do not say BLACK POWDER Only) They even respect the unfired 3rds in the boxes not torn up and they are torn whether they want to shoot them or collect them!

April 6, 2011, 10:18 PM	#71
junkman_01 Junior member Join Date: November 9, 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 260	Hey Hardy, Ever see the TV commercials for all that Chinese electronic stuff with the Bell and Howell brand on them? Same idea. A well known company SOLD their name to make a dime!

April 6, 2011, 10:31 PM	#72
Bishop Creek Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Posts: 566	Hardy, I wish I could afford to buy your 1851 Navy. I had a Signature Series 1851 Navy years ago but, like a fool sold it. But I am about ready to send $75 to Colt to see if they will letter my Signature Series 1860 Army to settle this question once and for all.

April 6, 2011, 11:00 PM	#74
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	Come on Junkman--we can nic pic all we want. Bell &Howard? You read it all. There is no more to say to this debate unless more info gets on. If you don't think the 3rds are colts then you don't think so. That's OK. I guess a lot of yu don't. I guess Fords aren't really Fords anymore. How far can we take this. Ima sayin--it has Colt stamped on it. And in my collection they are colts.

April 6, 2011, 11:03 PM	#75
Hardy Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 709	No fingers, the 1851 has been fired 6 rounds-and a true collector will notice some minor tiks. I do have original box, papers, wrapping. Will sell to you for reasonabl price if you desire.