CAS Shotguns - Page 2

Noz · March 19, 2010, 04:56 PM

I just went thru this for a club member. I did not know but IAC is the importer only. Norinco is the builder. Some of the later Norincos imported by IAC do not have Norinco on the guns.
From what I could gather, the later models are good cowboy guns.

SG29736 · March 19, 2010, 10:28 PM

Lately, there have been some of the better shooters switching to doubles from their 97's. Some of them have found that when everything goes right, they will be faster with the 97, but they have had the occasional train wreck with their 97 at a major match and have decided they can be more consistent with the double. Most of them have more than a few 97's to insure that they have one that is running good at all times. Smokin Gator

Delmar · March 20, 2010, 07:34 AM

Tell me about the "occasional train wreck". Could this be avoided with regular maintenance? I wouldn't want to count on it as a defensive weapon, it it isn't going to fire when I need it to.

Andy Griffith · March 20, 2010, 12:54 PM

The occasional "train wreck" that he speaks of is likely user inflicted when running it in fast "cowboy action" fashioned.

Likely, it's someone that is loading one round at a time over the top, and starts to close the bolt before the shell is all the way in the receiver...
Or someone that has "smoothed" the action to make it "slicker" in an incorrect fashioned.

This crap only happens at cowboy shoots, and would never happen if it was being used the way it supposed to be- with five full rounds being fed from the magazine tube.

Two completely different uses.

I've always thought that CAS shotgun is very, very bad form if you intend on being a defensive shooter. People resort to what their training is if they are in a bad situation- not saying that throwing one shell at a time into the top of a pump shotgun won't work, but it is terrible defensive form if you resort to that and have a mag full of ammo and you wind up jamming it by throwing two shell in it at the same time.

Delmar · March 20, 2010, 03:23 PM

Thanks Andy
That clears things up for me.

Quote:

I've always thought that CAS shotgun is very, very bad form if you intend on being a defensive shooter. People resort to what their training is if they are in a bad situation- not saying that throwing one shell at a time into the top of a pump shotgun won't work, but it is terrible defensive form if you resort to that and have a mag full of ammo and you wind up jamming it by throwing two shell in it at the same time.

So if I would use the same gun for CAS and for home defense, I would need to train for both situations. If I go that route I will store it, with only 5 rounds at the ready so that jamming in another shell is not a possibility. So the drill would be, 5 shots, then grab another weapon. Truth is, if 5 rounds from a 12 GA won't solve a home defense issue, I am most likely slap out of luck anyway!

Hawg · March 20, 2010, 04:40 PM

Quote:

5 rounds from a 12 GA

My Norinco 97 and original Win. 87 both hold 7.

Delmar · March 21, 2010, 03:39 AM

All the better! I have never fired a 97. I inferred that it was a five round gun from what Andy said.

Quote:

This crap only happens at cowboy shoots, and would never happen if it was being used the way it supposed to be- with five full rounds being fed from the magazine tube.

I stand corrected.

Hawg · March 21, 2010, 07:06 AM

That's 7 with one chambered.

Andy Griffith · March 21, 2010, 11:13 PM

Sorry guys...
I can't remember what my guns hold...unless I'm loading it at the time.

I did know it was more than two shots in the magazine though.

I might be going out on a limb here...as I may be mistaken, but I seem to remember that the earliest solid frame 1897's sometimes do have a bit longer tube and hold one more round than their later solid and take down counterparts- if my memory serves me.

Delmar · March 22, 2010, 07:15 AM

Actually a lot of the adds for 1897s say 4 +1
Perhaps they are not all the same?

tater134 · March 22, 2010, 07:39 PM

My 97 is 5+1 but you can almost get a 6th shell in the tube.

Hawg · March 22, 2010, 10:50 PM

Clip three coils off the mag spring and you can. 97's were originally chambered for 2 1/2 inch shells.

tater134 · March 23, 2010, 01:24 PM

Thanks for the tip.I had thought about cutting the spring down but never got around to it.

Delmar · April 1, 2010, 09:08 PM

I have a chance to buy a stevens SxS for $150. The gun is in good shape. What do you think?

Hawg · April 2, 2010, 05:13 AM

If it's in good shape jump on it.

March 20, 2010, 12:54 PM	#29
Andy Griffith Senior Member Join Date: May 14, 2009 Location: Macon Co. NC Posts: 591	The occasional "train wreck" that he speaks of is likely user inflicted when running it in fast "cowboy action" fashioned. Likely, it's someone that is loading one round at a time over the top, and starts to close the bolt before the shell is all the way in the receiver... Or someone that has "smoothed" the action to make it "slicker" in an incorrect fashioned. This crap only happens at cowboy shoots, and would never happen if it was being used the way it supposed to be- with five full rounds being fed from the magazine tube. Two completely different uses. I've always thought that CAS shotgun is very, very bad form if you intend on being a defensive shooter. People resort to what their training is if they are in a bad situation- not saying that throwing one shell at a time into the top of a pump shotgun won't work, but it is terrible defensive form if you resort to that and have a mag full of ammo and you wind up jamming it by throwing two shell in it at the same time. __________________ Barney Fife: "Nip it, nip it, nip it!" Andy Griffith:"Oh now Barn'...."

March 21, 2010, 11:13 PM	#34
Andy Griffith Senior Member Join Date: May 14, 2009 Location: Macon Co. NC Posts: 591	Sorry guys... I can't remember what my guns hold...unless I'm loading it at the time. I did know it was more than two shots in the magazine though. I might be going out on a limb here...as I may be mistaken, but I seem to remember that the earliest solid frame 1897's sometimes do have a bit longer tube and hold one more round than their later solid and take down counterparts- if my memory serves me. __________________ Barney Fife: "Nip it, nip it, nip it!" Andy Griffith:"Oh now Barn'...."

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March 19, 2010, 04:56 PM	#26
Noz Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2009 Posts: 643	I just went thru this for a club member. I did not know but IAC is the importer only. Norinco is the builder. Some of the later Norincos imported by IAC do not have Norinco on the guns. From what I could gather, the later models are good cowboy guns.

March 19, 2010, 10:28 PM	#27
SG29736 Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2007 Location: Northern Ca. Posts: 107	Lately, there have been some of the better shooters switching to doubles from their 97's. Some of them have found that when everything goes right, they will be faster with the 97, but they have had the occasional train wreck with their 97 at a major match and have decided they can be more consistent with the double. Most of them have more than a few 97's to insure that they have one that is running good at all times. Smokin Gator

March 20, 2010, 07:34 AM	#28
Delmar Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2009 Location: Norhthern Indiana Posts: 307	Tell me about the "occasional train wreck". Could this be avoided with regular maintenance? I wouldn't want to count on it as a defensive weapon, it it isn't going to fire when I need it to.

March 21, 2010, 07:06 AM	#33
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 14,670	That's 7 with one chambered.

March 22, 2010, 07:15 AM	#35
Delmar Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2009 Location: Norhthern Indiana Posts: 307	Actually a lot of the adds for 1897s say 4 +1 Perhaps they are not all the same?

March 22, 2010, 07:39 PM	#36
tater134 Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2009 Location: NE,PA Posts: 390	My 97 is 5+1 but you can almost get a 6th shell in the tube.

March 22, 2010, 10:50 PM	#37
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 14,670	Clip three coils off the mag spring and you can. 97's were originally chambered for 2 1/2 inch shells.

March 23, 2010, 01:24 PM	#38
tater134 Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2009 Location: NE,PA Posts: 390	Thanks for the tip.I had thought about cutting the spring down but never got around to it.

April 1, 2010, 09:08 PM	#39
Delmar Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2009 Location: Norhthern Indiana Posts: 307	I have a chance to buy a stevens SxS for $150. The gun is in good shape. What do you think?

April 2, 2010, 05:13 AM	#40
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 14,670	If it's in good shape jump on it.