Tried to reload for accuracy. Not bad

[Prof Young]

Loaders:

So I've had a Henry Goldenboy in 45 colt, the one with the octagonal barrel, and have not been anywhere close to happy with the groups.

Decided to dip into reloading for accuracy. Got some XTP 200 grain bullets and loaded three different types of powder at maximum recommended load. Made ten of each. Shot them today. The Unique and the Universal were fair, about a five inch group at fifty yards with a couple flyers in each. The Titegroup was anything but.

On another note, I'd reloaded some FTP but couldn't shoot them as the plastic tip simply made them too long to work in the lever action gun. Seriously. I'd have had to seat the bullet well passed the shoulder to get them under the max recommended length. So, I cut the plastic tip off some and pulled it out of some. Amazingly I shot ten of those, some cut and some pulled and got a nice tight three inch group at fifty yard.

Hmmmmm . . . . .

Live well, be safe.
Prof Young

[arizona98tj]

It is not likely that a max load will produce the best accuracy. You might want to try starting at the suggested min load (in your reloading manual) and then increment your way up towards the max. You might find a couple of charge weights where the accuracy is pretty good. Next reloading session, focus on those with smaller increments, again looking for your accuracy.

Just a suggestion.... good luck.

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

I recently read some fellow got very good accuracy with the use of IMR-4227. Only one problem. Its hard to find these days on store shelves.

[Prof Young]

Thanks.
The info and advice is much appreciated.
Live well, be safe
Prof Young

[Brian Pfleuger]

The Unique and the Universal were fair, about a five inch group at fifty yards with a couple flyers in each.

First off, never, ever start at maximum load. Always start at listed starting loads and work up. This is for safety, not accuracy. I disagree that max loads don't produce best accuracy. Typically, I find little accuracy difference in a load work up, certainly nothing worth worrying about.

Second, is that really considered "fair" for that gun? If that's considered "fair", I'd seriously find a trash can for that gun. No offense intended, that ridiculous. A half decent, smooth-bore 12ga shotgun with rifled slugs can do better than that, off hand.

Does the thing shoot factory ammo decent? 5" at 50 yards, I'd be sending it back to Henry.

[HiBC]

45 Colt can have some challenges in loading for accuracy.

It is primarily a handgun cartridge with some history.Part of that history is a variation in cylinder throat dia.Throat dia is commonly oversize,and many 45 Colt shooters use bullets in the .454 range.

I have no idea what the groove dia of your rifle is.I bet you don't either.

Slugging the bore is a good start.Suppose your bore is .453..You won't get best accuracy using 451 bullets.

I suggest a moderately hard cast lead alloy bullet.Lasercast,cast performance bullet,etc.Get them the same size to .001 oversize for your bore.

About a 250 gr round nose flat point traditional bullet ought to work,but don't buy more than 100 till you determine they will load to a length that will feed.

You say this is a "Golden Boy",does that imply a brass receiver?Sorry,I have not followed the Henry line.

If it is not steel,I would seriously consider that in my loads.

Another question,is this a toggle link locking action,or does it have locking bars like a 92 Win?If it is a toggle link action,hot rodding it(max loads) are ill advised.They just are not that strong.

Another challenge to accuracy:The 45 Colt was made for black powder.Its a big case.At the appropriate pressures for an old school gun,it equals the performance of the much shorter 45 ACP.Which means you have way more case volume than you can fill with most modern handgun powders.

1)Do a little research on what Henry recommends for a pressure level for your rifle.They may suggest moderation.Factory loads are in the 850 fps range or so.

2) Perhaps with your gunsmith's help,upset a soft lead slug or ball in your bore then push it out and measure it to find out groove dia.Get some good cast,lubed bullets to match bore size.

3)forget max loads.Try a bulky powder,and ,though I have not used it myself,Trailboss comes to mind.Look to duplicate the power/approx. pressure of the old 45 Colt loads.Think nostalgia.

4)Don't forget a good crimp.I suggest,while figuring things out,back the seater die body out to just remove the bell,no crimp.Lock down the die body,Adjust the stem to seat the bullet just to the upper edge of the crimp groove.Seat them all.Then back off the stem,so you wont seat the bullets deeper,and screw the die body in a little at a time till you get a good crimp.Crimp them.

I expect you might do better than 5 in at 50.

[arizona98tj]

Originally Posted by Brian Pfleuger

I disagree that max loads don't produce best accuracy. Typically, I find little accuracy difference in a load work up, certainly nothing worth worrying about.

I just checked one of the reloading manuals sitting on the shelf. It had 18 different bullet weights for one of the cartridges I reload. It notes the powder and charge weight for each powder that gave the best accuracy for each bullet weight. 7 of the 18 were max charges.

Perhaps you and I have different thresholds as to what is and isn't accurate. Certainly possible. Regardless, I guess we can simply agree to disagree.

[603Country]

I agree with others, in that you don't safely start at max. On the other hand, I rarely start at minimum. I'll usually start at or below about mid-range, and it seems that I often find that the best load is about a grain short of max. One or two of my favorite loads are quite close to max.

When I say "max", I mean the listed max in the Lyman 49th. From being on this forum for a while, I know that several of the guys consider the listed max as being somewhat like a stopsign in a third world country, in that it's just a mild suggestion. I'm more cautious than that.

[Magnum Wheel Man]

a bulky powder & a good crimp, as well as a proper bullet diameter will go a long ways towards accuracy on the 45 Colt...

when shooting for load development, I recommend a good rest, sand bags, or similar... if your 5" groups at 50 yards were shot free standing, that's probably not too bad... if that was bench rested, it's pretty poor... if you were not shooting off the bench ( when developing loads ) you add too many shooter variables to effectively judge the accuracy of your loads

my CAS loads shoot about 2-3" 50 yard groups, out of my rifle, ( not a Henry ) but are also tuned to shoot through my revolvers, so it's a compromise... those loads are 5.5 grains of Trailboss, & a 250 grain lead RNFP bullet at .452" with a Lee Factory crimp on the cartridge

[Brian Pfleuger]

Originally Posted by arizona98tj

I just checked one of the reloading manuals sitting on the shelf. It had 18 different bullet weights for one of the cartridges I reload. It notes the powder and charge weight for each powder that gave the best accuracy for each bullet weight. 7 of the 18 were max charges.



Perhaps you and I have different thresholds as to what is and isn't accurate. Certainly possible. Regardless, I guess we can simply agree to disagree.

I don't think it's a matter of defining accuracy, I think it's a matter of defining "not likely", as in "not likely that a max load will produce best accuracy."

Your own data shows a 7/18th chance. That's a 38% chance. More than 1 out of 3 seems pretty likely to me.

Nosler load data for .308 show 20 of 68 best accuracy at max. They only show 3 increments for each, so max load has almost exactly the same odds as the other 2 of being most accurate. (At most 6% difference)

For .243, they show best accuracy at max load 28 out of 56 times. That exactly 50%.

So, it looks like max load produces best accuracy between 25 and 50% of the time. That's not "most" or "majority" but I certainly wouldn't call it unlikely.

[NoSecondBest]

Listen to Brian. He's right on with all his comments. The title is misleading. It should be "I'm new to reloading and this is where I'm at....."