Porn on the forum

Paul B. · July 31, 1999, 06:34 PM

While reading stuff on another forum, not the Firing Line, a question came up on a wildcat cartridge. 708 Akley Imp. if I remember right. Anyway when I went to read it, porno came up rather than a shooting thread. They tried to get rid of it, but like a bad penny, it keeps coming back.
My thoughts are whoever did this, may discover TFL and try their skullduggery here too. Skullduggery. Now there's a word with class.

Paul B.

**Rich Lucibella** · August 1, 1999, 12:26 AM

Paul-
We could simply turn on the ISP logging feature and trace the individual. Legal sanctions seem to be increasing in frequency for such cases.
Rich

Hal · August 3, 1999, 05:37 AM

Ahhh "The Avengers" a "bit of jiggery-pokery" was alway a favorite of mine.

Rich: Ip logging is a good thing to do. IP addresses need not be displayed, but it is a wise idea to have an indication of the origin of posts.

------------------
Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

longhair · August 3, 1999, 06:39 AM

Hal, you sound like BIG BROTHER!
I agree that if someone is disrupting the forum that it may be necessary to turn the isp logging on, but why do it otherwise?

------------------
what me worry?

[This message has been edited by longhair (edited August 03, 1999).]

Hal · August 4, 1999, 05:06 AM

longhair,
Big Brother? Naw, we are guests in Rich's back yard, and as such he has every right to know who we are. Logging IP addresses is really no big deal, no more so than cookies. I view the logging of IP addresses in much the same fasion as a retailer asking for a zip code at the check out. Now OTOH, if the DOJ, FBI or Whitehouse.gov were to log IP addresses, I would have a major problem with that. Although TFL is a public forum, it is still a private site, and as a private site, Rich is responsible to his ISP and his ISP is in turn responsible to the trunk line provider for the content. Usually ISP's use a firewall to restrict access to their servers from the outside. For example, your ISP, arkansas.net has a class C address of 208.133.27.XXX. 208.133.27.XXX is also the registered address of acmebank.com. If someone in the same domain as you were to come into the forum, hit it and run, the only recourse left open to the ISP is to block all access from 208.133.27.XXX. You would be denied access because of some scumbag. Logging would help determine the last octet of the address, the .XXX, which would go a long way to help figure out who owned that octet at what time. (These are dynamic addresses and handed out or leased to users on a first come, first served basis, but their assignments are kept track of by Your isp, not TFL or TFL's provider.) Now, logging will do nothing to prevent a determined individual from doing anything, but it will keep the minor annoyers at bay, a lot like a burgler alarm system does. It just raises the price of mayhem vs the return on the investment.TFL is a lot like the neighborhood watering hole. People know you by your "face" and "nickname", and you can say you are "Lars from Mars" for all anyone (patrons) care, but the bartender has every right to "card" you. Most public forums are pretty open, a few use IP logging to determine demographics for marketing reasons, and a few more use IP logging as a means of deterent to hit and run tactics. I use a handle and a hotmail address, but have no qualms about giving my name and main e-mail address to any moderator or adminstrator of TFL, but that is where it stops, name and e-mail address, so far no one has asked. Big Brother wants the names and address of people that gather in a public park, the local barkeep just wants to cover his behind. Big difference. TFL is not public property, but is more like a sidewalk. Anyone can use it, you as the homeowner are responsible for what happens to the users of the sidewalk even though you don't own it.

------------------
Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

DC · August 4, 1999, 09:53 AM

Longhair..

Following up on Hal, Rich's provider automatically keeps logs as does yours and mine...the difference is that UBB can do it as well and would allow Rich access to track down a malefactor a lot quicker.
Say someone posted a kiddie porn pic here...without IP logging Rich would have to notify his provider of the incident, time, date and wait for them to track the BG down. With IP logging Rich can provide the info to his provider (and if he or Zach has a trace program, provide even more detailed info) and complain to the BG's provider.
As Hal said, IPs don't need to be displayed to all, just available to Rich. Also, realize that the IP# doesn't say who you are, it still requires someone from the originating IP to dig around their logs to determine a specific user.

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"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"

jwg · August 6, 1999, 12:23 PM

IP tracking probable will not work with these "people" because there smart enough to hide and spook there IP. I know it because I had a similair affair on my homepage, took me (and provider)weeks to trace the fellow.

p.s. Hello, i'm new here. and have to say you got a nice place, hope i'm welcome.

Hal · August 6, 1999, 04:31 PM

jwg,
Of course you are welcome. Sorry to hear of someone's hit on you page. All I can say is it does happen. Bouncing and spoofing of IP address are but 2 of the many ways a determined person can breech a network. These people usually have larger targets in mind and are hesitant to risk the wrath of the authorities for such a small target. It is the trolls, the hit and runners and the others tha exist only to stir the pot then leave that ip logging will deter.

------------------
Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

**Rich Lucibella** · August 6, 1999, 08:09 PM

Well said, Hal.
Welcome jwg.
Rich

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July 31, 1999, 06:34 PM	#1
Paul B. Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 1999 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 3,800	While reading stuff on another forum, not the Firing Line, a question came up on a wildcat cartridge. 708 Akley Imp. if I remember right. Anyway when I went to read it, porno came up rather than a shooting thread. They tried to get rid of it, but like a bad penny, it keeps coming back. My thoughts are whoever did this, may discover TFL and try their skullduggery here too. Skullduggery. Now there's a word with class. Paul B.

August 1, 1999, 12:26 AM	#2
Rich Lucibella Staff Join Date: October 6, 1998 Location: South Florida Posts: 10,229	Paul- We could simply turn on the ISP logging feature and trace the individual. Legal sanctions seem to be increasing in frequency for such cases. Rich

August 3, 1999, 05:37 AM	#3
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	Ahhh "The Avengers" a "bit of jiggery-pokery" was alway a favorite of mine. Rich: Ip logging is a good thing to do. IP addresses need not be displayed, but it is a wise idea to have an indication of the origin of posts. ------------------ Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

August 3, 1999, 06:39 AM	#4
longhair Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 1998 Location: CSA Posts: 632	Hal, you sound like BIG BROTHER! I agree that if someone is disrupting the forum that it may be necessary to turn the isp logging on, but why do it otherwise? ------------------ what me worry? [This message has been edited by longhair (edited August 03, 1999).]

August 4, 1999, 05:06 AM	#5
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	longhair, Big Brother? Naw, we are guests in Rich's back yard, and as such he has every right to know who we are. Logging IP addresses is really no big deal, no more so than cookies. I view the logging of IP addresses in much the same fasion as a retailer asking for a zip code at the check out. Now OTOH, if the DOJ, FBI or Whitehouse.gov were to log IP addresses, I would have a major problem with that. Although TFL is a public forum, it is still a private site, and as a private site, Rich is responsible to his ISP and his ISP is in turn responsible to the trunk line provider for the content. Usually ISP's use a firewall to restrict access to their servers from the outside. For example, your ISP, arkansas.net has a class C address of 208.133.27.XXX. 208.133.27.XXX is also the registered address of acmebank.com. If someone in the same domain as you were to come into the forum, hit it and run, the only recourse left open to the ISP is to block all access from 208.133.27.XXX. You would be denied access because of some scumbag. Logging would help determine the last octet of the address, the .XXX, which would go a long way to help figure out who owned that octet at what time. (These are dynamic addresses and handed out or leased to users on a first come, first served basis, but their assignments are kept track of by Your isp, not TFL or TFL's provider.) Now, logging will do nothing to prevent a determined individual from doing anything, but it will keep the minor annoyers at bay, a lot like a burgler alarm system does. It just raises the price of mayhem vs the return on the investment.TFL is a lot like the neighborhood watering hole. People know you by your "face" and "nickname", and you can say you are "Lars from Mars" for all anyone (patrons) care, but the bartender has every right to "card" you. Most public forums are pretty open, a few use IP logging to determine demographics for marketing reasons, and a few more use IP logging as a means of deterent to hit and run tactics. I use a handle and a hotmail address, but have no qualms about giving my name and main e-mail address to any moderator or adminstrator of TFL, but that is where it stops, name and e-mail address, so far no one has asked. Big Brother wants the names and address of people that gather in a public park, the local barkeep just wants to cover his behind. Big difference. TFL is not public property, but is more like a sidewalk. Anyone can use it, you as the homeowner are responsible for what happens to the users of the sidewalk even though you don't own it. ------------------ Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

August 4, 1999, 09:53 AM	#6
DC Moderator Emeritus Join Date: September 30, 1998 Location: Calif Posts: 4,229	Longhair.. Following up on Hal, Rich's provider automatically keeps logs as does yours and mine...the difference is that UBB can do it as well and would allow Rich access to track down a malefactor a lot quicker. Say someone posted a kiddie porn pic here...without IP logging Rich would have to notify his provider of the incident, time, date and wait for them to track the BG down. With IP logging Rich can provide the info to his provider (and if he or Zach has a trace program, provide even more detailed info) and complain to the BG's provider. As Hal said, IPs don't need to be displayed to all, just available to Rich. Also, realize that the IP# doesn't say who you are, it still requires someone from the originating IP to dig around their logs to determine a specific user. ------------------ "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"

August 6, 1999, 12:23 PM	#7
jwg Junior Member Join Date: August 1, 1999 Posts: 3	IP tracking probable will not work with these "people" because there smart enough to hide and spook there IP. I know it because I had a similair affair on my homepage, took me (and provider)weeks to trace the fellow. p.s. Hello, i'm new here. and have to say you got a nice place, hope i'm welcome.

August 6, 1999, 04:31 PM	#8
Hal Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Ohio USA Posts: 8,563	jwg, Of course you are welcome. Sorry to hear of someone's hit on you page. All I can say is it does happen. Bouncing and spoofing of IP address are but 2 of the many ways a determined person can breech a network. These people usually have larger targets in mind and are hesitant to risk the wrath of the authorities for such a small target. It is the trolls, the hit and runners and the others tha exist only to stir the pot then leave that ip logging will deter. ------------------ Want to feel your age?Check it out. http://web.superb.net/boy/age1.html

August 6, 1999, 08:09 PM	#9
Rich Lucibella Staff Join Date: October 6, 1998 Location: South Florida Posts: 10,229	Well said, Hal. Welcome jwg. Rich