DAO for CCW

chemcal · October 26, 2018, 04:00 PM

I've tried, purchased, and traded off many autos for cc; but I keep going back to my sig p250. For me, too many things to like about a DAO, however, I realize I'm in a small group. For those familiar with this platform, why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

TunnelRat · October 26, 2018, 04:23 PM

Kahr is sort of in a different size category than the P250. At times I wonder if Kahr had the popularity it did because of the fact that it was DAO or because they offered small single stack pistols in 9mm before many major manufacturers saw value in doing the same. My impression was more the latter. I wonder if Kahr has seen a decrease in sales now that almost every major manufacturer offers a small single stack polymer pistol. I'd also add the P250 had a mixed reputation at one time, whereas I think Kahr has generally been well regarded (I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong).

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

HighValleyRanch · October 26, 2018, 04:49 PM

Kahr also has one of the smoothest DAO triggers around. It's what everyone else has to compare to.
I like the simplicity and effectiveness of Kahr's DAO. But maybe it's because I am well versed on double action revolvers as well.
I can transition from my LCR's to the Kahr seamlessly.

kozak6 · October 27, 2018, 06:16 AM

Is Kahr actually doing that well? They haven't made anything new in years other than new colors and adding rails to one model. Seems like every manufacturer these days makes at least a few sub/compact .380's and 9mm's. The Kahr trigger isn't a true DAO either (no restrike), but more of a DA-style pretensioned striker sort of thing.

The P250 had some teething difficulties, and it came out as PPQ-style "single action" striker pistols were catching on. I think part of it is that outside of law enforcement, there is no demand at all for DAO full size semiautomatics.

PSP · October 27, 2018, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chemcal

For me, too many things to like about a DAO, however, I realize I'm in a small group. For those familiar with this platform, why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

I agree that the DAO trigger is an excellent choice for a CCW and was the preferred trigger on my last two carry guns, a Seecamp and a Beretta Pico.

I agree with kozak6 that Kahr is not DAO

MandolinMan · October 27, 2018, 08:34 AM

Quote:

why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

Compared to other pistols and brands, are Kahr pistols hot sellers? I rarely see them on the ranges I frequent. The popularity of DAO and DA/SA as a whole seems to be declining, though both certainly do have a following.

chemcal · October 27, 2018, 09:10 AM

Don't see much of a place for full size, but my p250SC with 12 + 1 seems to deserve appreciation from those who actually shoot and have knowledge of carry firearms-MHO.

JERRYS. · October 27, 2018, 10:48 AM

I use to carry a S&W 3953 and only stopped because S&W decided to no longer service these guns should they need repair.

TunnelRat · October 27, 2018, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Don't see much of a place for full size, but my p250SC with 12 + 1 seems to deserve appreciation from those who actually shoot and have knowledge of carry firearms-MHO.

If the firearm you use has shown itself to be reliable and good shooting for you, then what does it actually matter if other shooters "appreciate it"? The pistol has no feelings one way or the other. There are a number of people that actually shoot and have knowledge of carry firearms, but people still have preferences. One person's preferences don't negate another's.

Carl the Floor Walker · October 27, 2018, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HighValleyRanch

Kahr also has one of the smoothest DAO triggers around. It's what everyone else has to compare to.
I like the simplicity and effectiveness of Kahr's DAO. But maybe it's because I am well versed on double action revolvers as well.

I can transition from my LCR's to the Kahr seamlessly.

I have the Kahr, and I have two LCR's. Yes both are great triggers. However, I prefer the Double action on the Beretta Nano to be my overall favorite. The Kahr has more free play at the beginning stage, where the Nano is deliberate and smooth all the way.
I just ordered a Smith 642. I know the action will not be as smooth as the Rugers, but have already visited my Smith to get ready and set a date for a trigger job.
It will be interesting to compare after that is completed.

Black Wolf · October 27, 2018, 05:15 PM

Here's a funny -

Between reading the title and reading the first post (and seeing what you had), my first thought was "my P250 is one of the best carry guns I've ever had"

I have the compact 9mm. I love that gun. It is not what I currently carry, but doubt I will ever part with it.

To me, the trigger is SOOOOOO much better than (pretty much) any striker fired pistol I have shot. Doesn't stack, same smooth weight all the way through the pull. No wall, just right.

The downside to mine is - might be a little too light, I actually get light strikes with Tula. I don't remember if I have had any with other ammo. If so, they are very rare (like can't remember if it ever happened rare). Never worried too much about it because, with a true DAO, second strike is always an option.

I was really accurate with that pistol. I am just now getting to the point where I can shoot my carry piece as accurately as I could that gun.

It is crazy that it fizzled out. (To me) It was one of those pistols that stands out.

chemcal · October 27, 2018, 06:49 PM

TunnelRat

Thank you for your comment which showed my poor choice of words and structure of my post. I was trying to express my surprise at the p250's demise and not at all wanted to put anyone down. My apologies to anyone I offended.

Fishbed77 · October 29, 2018, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Kahr is sort of in a different size category than the P250. At times I wonder if Kahr had the popularity it did because of the fact that it was DAO or because they offered small single stack pistols in 9mm before many major manufacturers saw value in doing the same. My impression was more the latter.

Agreed.

However, now that I have shot or owned pistols like the Glock 43, M&P Shield, Ruger LC9, and other small single-stack 9mm pistols, I've found that none of them truly perform any better than the CM9 I've owned for a good many years.

The Kahr DAO trigger is truly "good enough" for the role, and my CM9 has been flawless in operation as long as I've owned it.

Quote:

Compared to other pistols and brands, are Kahr pistols hot sellers?

I'm not sure about today, but manufacturing stats from 2013 show that Kahr (SAEILO, INC) manufactured more pistols than a number of other well-known brands in the US, including Colt and Remington, and almost as many as Kel Tec.

https://www.atf.gov/file/3341/download

That of course was before the introduction of many of its closest competitors.

Quote:

For those familiar with this platform, why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

I don't see the P250 as having truly "died." As I see it, it just "evolved" into the P320, which better meets market trends.

pete2 · October 29, 2018, 09:53 AM

I carry a 642 revolver most of the time, LC9 (old style) occasionally, both double action only. Actually the LC is partially cocked, not true D/A.

mete · October 29, 2018, 10:14 AM

Kahr ? He's spent much time and effort moving from NY to PA which is now his headquarters !! He's very near me now and has all his stuff in the new store .
he's obviously a smart guy . A real entriprenuer starting a gun business in NY state .
His DAO was the first thing that attracted me .Long and smooth it would be fine for defensive carry.

ManyMag · October 29, 2018, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chemcal

I've tried, purchased, and traded off many autos for cc; but I keep going back to my sig p250. For me, too many things to like about a DAO, however, I realize I'm in a small group. For those familiar with this platform, why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

I can understand why you like it.
I picked up a P250c 22 to train with as my carry is a P320c.
The trigger on the 250 just amazes me as to how smooth it is.

T. O'Heir · October 29, 2018, 11:47 AM

"...whereas the p250..." People tend to equate quality with the price. Kahr's cost more.
However, which model matters too. The only thing that matters is how well the thing fits your hand and how well you can shoot it. Everything else is a 'Ford vs Chevy' thing.

D-Ric902 · October 29, 2018, 02:53 PM

I have a P250 that I like a lot. My only problem is my long fingers around the grip, tried the sleeves and it helps.
I don’t have a Khar, but an LDA from Para and a P220 with a DAK that shoots great

.

chemcal · October 29, 2018, 03:49 PM

Shooting/dry firing my 250sc has improved my trigger ability with other platforms. My PPQ almost shoots as well as my HS .22

, but, I would not cc either gun; way too scary for me

.

cc-hangfire · October 31, 2018, 12:02 PM

Those who love the SIG P250 are in a small club, and I’m with you there. I have several P250’s and the variety of frame/grip sizes and barrel/slide calibers for home defense, vehicle gun, and general range fun. I have Kahr 9mms for carry. The DA trigger suits me for a defensive handgun.

As far as I’d guess, the reason that the P250 didn’t last is the striker fired P320. Most shooters want a shorter trigger stroke and a shorter reset, and SIG went with the market.

1MoreFord · November 1, 2018, 09:52 PM

Count me in for the DAO carry club. I have a Seecamp, a Smith 640, a Sig P290RS, and a couple of P250's. I like DAO's a lot more than strikers.

subhuman · November 2, 2018, 08:14 AM

I am a DA/SA adherent these days having left behind all the striker pistols but my Shield, the Sig P250 that I shot wasn't bad but it's not for me for some reason, another DAO I have put a lot of rounds through is the SCCY CPX like the P250 it also has a very good DA trigger but also like the P250 it demands that you concentrate and cover all your pistol basics all the way through every shot which is probably why most people don't like them, I like that heavy first shot where i'm preparing and deciding to shoot but after that I prefer the short, crisp and light SA shots with minimal reset movement.

Laz · November 2, 2018, 08:56 AM

cc-hangfire said:

Quote:

As far as I’d guess, the reason that the P250 didn’t last is the striker fired P320. Most shooters want a shorter trigger stroke and a shorter reset, and SIG went with the market.

I agree with that and the same market trend doomed the P290rs and produced the P365. Like the 250, the 290 deserved a better fate, IMO.

JJNA · November 2, 2018, 06:19 PM

I love my P250s, but hate my P290RS. The trigger on the latter is nowhere as good as those on my P250s, and it has an odd boxy grip shape that irritates the web of my hand.

P250s are the best “high capacity” revolvers ever made!

Nathan · November 3, 2018, 06:52 AM

The P250 is a strange story. Cool concept, but never checked enough boxes for me to buy...

Kahr’s popularity has everything to do with being thin, full size sights and a relatively low bore axis. Then when you buy them, they shoot well. Only negative I saw was 40 recoil made fast shooting slow!

I do carry the CW380 and love it.

October 26, 2018, 04:00 PM	#1
chemcal Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2014 Posts: 281	DAO for CCW I've tried, purchased, and traded off many autos for cc; but I keep going back to my sig p250. For me, too many things to like about a DAO, however, I realize I'm in a small group. For those familiar with this platform, why is Kahr becoming so popular and doing so well, whereas the p250 died?

October 26, 2018, 04:49 PM	#3
HighValleyRanch Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2005 Posts: 4,066	Kahr also has one of the smoothest DAO triggers around. It's what everyone else has to compare to. I like the simplicity and effectiveness of Kahr's DAO. But maybe it's because I am well versed on double action revolvers as well. I can transition from my LCR's to the Kahr seamlessly. __________________ From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail"

October 29, 2018, 10:14 AM	#15
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	Kahr ? He's spent much time and effort moving from NY to PA which is now his headquarters !! He's very near me now and has all his stuff in the new store . he's obviously a smart guy . A real entriprenuer starting a gun business in NY state . His DAO was the first thing that attracted me .Long and smooth it would be fine for defensive carry. __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

October 29, 2018, 11:47 AM	#17
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...whereas the p250..." People tend to equate quality with the price. Kahr's cost more. However, which model matters too. The only thing that matters is how well the thing fits your hand and how well you can shoot it. Everything else is a 'Ford vs Chevy' thing. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

October 29, 2018, 02:53 PM	#18
D-Ric902 Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2004 Location: Northeastern Indiana Posts: 402	I have a P250 that I like a lot. My only problem is my long fingers around the grip, tried the sleeves and it helps. I don’t have a Khar, but an LDA from Para and a P220 with a DAK that shoots great . __________________ mercysdad.com

October 26, 2018, 04:23 PM	#2
TunnelRat Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 12,212	Kahr is sort of in a different size category than the P250. At times I wonder if Kahr had the popularity it did because of the fact that it was DAO or because they offered small single stack pistols in 9mm before many major manufacturers saw value in doing the same. My impression was more the latter. I wonder if Kahr has seen a decrease in sales now that almost every major manufacturer offers a small single stack polymer pistol. I'd also add the P250 had a mixed reputation at one time, whereas I think Kahr has generally been well regarded (I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong). Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

October 27, 2018, 06:16 AM	#4
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	Is Kahr actually doing that well? They haven't made anything new in years other than new colors and adding rails to one model. Seems like every manufacturer these days makes at least a few sub/compact .380's and 9mm's. The Kahr trigger isn't a true DAO either (no restrike), but more of a DA-style pretensioned striker sort of thing. The P250 had some teething difficulties, and it came out as PPQ-style "single action" striker pistols were catching on. I think part of it is that outside of law enforcement, there is no demand at all for DAO full size semiautomatics.

October 27, 2018, 09:10 AM	#7
chemcal Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2014 Posts: 281	Don't see much of a place for full size, but my p250SC with 12 + 1 seems to deserve appreciation from those who actually shoot and have knowledge of carry firearms-MHO.

October 27, 2018, 10:48 AM	#8
JERRYS. Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,969	I use to carry a S&W 3953 and only stopped because S&W decided to no longer service these guns should they need repair.

October 27, 2018, 05:15 PM	#11
Black Wolf Member Join Date: March 18, 2018 Location: Kansas Posts: 66	Here's a funny - Between reading the title and reading the first post (and seeing what you had), my first thought was "my P250 is one of the best carry guns I've ever had" I have the compact 9mm. I love that gun. It is not what I currently carry, but doubt I will ever part with it. To me, the trigger is SOOOOOO much better than (pretty much) any striker fired pistol I have shot. Doesn't stack, same smooth weight all the way through the pull. No wall, just right. The downside to mine is - might be a little too light, I actually get light strikes with Tula. I don't remember if I have had any with other ammo. If so, they are very rare (like can't remember if it ever happened rare). Never worried too much about it because, with a true DAO, second strike is always an option. I was really accurate with that pistol. I am just now getting to the point where I can shoot my carry piece as accurately as I could that gun. It is crazy that it fizzled out. (To me) It was one of those pistols that stands out.

October 27, 2018, 06:49 PM	#12
chemcal Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2014 Posts: 281	TunnelRat Thank you for your comment which showed my poor choice of words and structure of my post. I was trying to express my surprise at the p250's demise and not at all wanted to put anyone down. My apologies to anyone I offended.

October 29, 2018, 09:53 AM	#14
pete2 Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2012 Location: Texas Posts: 2,566	I carry a 642 revolver most of the time, LC9 (old style) occasionally, both double action only. Actually the LC is partially cocked, not true D/A.

October 29, 2018, 03:49 PM	#19
chemcal Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2014 Posts: 281	Shooting/dry firing my 250sc has improved my trigger ability with other platforms. My PPQ almost shoots as well as my HS .22, but, I would not cc either gun; way too scary for me.

October 31, 2018, 12:02 PM	#20
cc-hangfire Senior Member Join Date: August 14, 2014 Posts: 304	Those who love the SIG P250 are in a small club, and I’m with you there. I have several P250’s and the variety of frame/grip sizes and barrel/slide calibers for home defense, vehicle gun, and general range fun. I have Kahr 9mms for carry. The DA trigger suits me for a defensive handgun. As far as I’d guess, the reason that the P250 didn’t last is the striker fired P320. Most shooters want a shorter trigger stroke and a shorter reset, and SIG went with the market.

November 1, 2018, 09:52 PM	#21
1MoreFord Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2014 Location: Arkansas Posts: 244	Count me in for the DAO carry club. I have a Seecamp, a Smith 640, a Sig P290RS, and a couple of P250's. I like DAO's a lot more than strikers.

November 2, 2018, 08:14 AM	#22
subhuman Senior Member Join Date: April 21, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 383	I am a DA/SA adherent these days having left behind all the striker pistols but my Shield, the Sig P250 that I shot wasn't bad but it's not for me for some reason, another DAO I have put a lot of rounds through is the SCCY CPX like the P250 it also has a very good DA trigger but also like the P250 it demands that you concentrate and cover all your pistol basics all the way through every shot which is probably why most people don't like them, I like that heavy first shot where i'm preparing and deciding to shoot but after that I prefer the short, crisp and light SA shots with minimal reset movement.

November 2, 2018, 06:19 PM	#24
JJNA Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2008 Posts: 231	I love my P250s, but hate my P290RS. The trigger on the latter is nowhere as good as those on my P250s, and it has an odd boxy grip shape that irritates the web of my hand. P250s are the best “high capacity” revolvers ever made!

November 3, 2018, 06:52 AM	#25
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	The P250 is a strange story. Cool concept, but never checked enough boxes for me to buy... Kahr’s popularity has everything to do with being thin, full size sights and a relatively low bore axis. Then when you buy them, they shoot well. Only negative I saw was 40 recoil made fast shooting slow! I do carry the CW380 and love it.