March 10, 2013, 07:13 AM | #101 |
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Carry loaded. You can not assume you will have time to chamber a round.
Buy a well made leather holster that was designed specifically for your gun. I would suggest you look for a thumb break holster. Finally, a dedicated gun belt will hold your gun in the proper position and secure it against your body.
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March 10, 2013, 07:18 AM | #102 | |
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Last edited by manta49; March 10, 2013 at 07:24 AM. |
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March 10, 2013, 08:15 AM | #103 |
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do you carry chambered?
One of the reasons I carry a DAO. Pistol more than the SA/DA. Is don't even want to worry about taking the safety off. If carrying SigP238 or 1911 its chambered with hammer cocked. You MAY have time to rack the slide... You MAY have time and Remember to take safety off ,BUT you may not. I like chambered, point, shoot simplicity. What has been a fear of mine from day one is having your firearm taken away & used on you.Almost Happened to a coworker in the 70's after being hit from behind with 2x4 in head.
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March 10, 2013, 08:51 AM | #104 | |
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Do you also assume that all those cops open carrying are doing it with unloaded guns, or that they unload their guns when they're sitting down? |
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March 10, 2013, 09:40 AM | #105 |
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"One of the reasons I carry a DAO. Pistol more than the SA/DA. Is don't even want to worry about taking the safety off. If carrying SigP238 or 1911 its chambered with hammer cocked. You MAY have time to rack the slide... You MAY have time and Remember to take safety off ,BUT you may not. I like chambered, point, shoot simplicity. What has been a fear of mine from day one is having your firearm taken away & used on you.Almost Happened to a coworker in the 70's after being hit from behind with 2x4 in head."
================================================== I live in Illinois and am looking forward to a good carry law later this year. So I am learning as much as I can now, and trainng, which if there is an underlying theme from just about everyone is that it's all about training. What I don't understand are comments about pistols with a manual safety because it may take too long to turn off the safety, or because you may not remember to turn the safety off. This makes no sense to me if training is truly taking place. I have a Ruger SR40 with a manual safety, and a trigger safety, and it is so easy and fast to turn the safety off. It is second nature to do it. And if I can't remember to do that, then I haven't trained enough. The thought of having one chambered, with a manual safety on, and trained well so I can quickly turn the safety off, seems to be a perfect solution. It solves most of the safety concern, and it solves the potential problem of not having the weapon ready to fire. Maybe I'm missing something.... |
March 10, 2013, 10:59 AM | #106 |
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Why do you need the safety on a carry gun if you don't pull the trigger incorrectly?
That is the core of the argument. If you carried a revolver as many did for years, there would be no safety. Is it the weight of the trigger pull?
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March 10, 2013, 11:25 AM | #107 | |
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The fact is- these people in the videos you have seen are violating one or more of the safety rules. Period- no argument. Guns are designed and intended to be loaded. They are not designed or intended for extra manipulation to make them ready, when loss of a split second could mean the end of a life. When you take a police force the size of NYPD, with many officers who have little to no firearms experience prior to joining the force, and then have them carry a gun full-time day in and day out, there is a chance that problems will occur. With training and experience hopefully comes improvement. |
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March 10, 2013, 11:29 AM | #108 | |
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I don't want to have to train for it. I'm comfortable with my choice of weapons that don't have a manual safety, so why should I bother worrying about one? |
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March 10, 2013, 11:55 AM | #109 | |
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My biggest problem with this is the idea that "you can't shoot yourself with an unloaded gun", yet that is exactly what happens in a large number of unintentional shootings. "BOOM!" followed by "But I didn't think it was loaded!?" All guns are ALWAYS loaded. Even when they're "not", they're loaded. If you treat them like they're loaded, it makes NO difference if they "really are" or not. You won't have your finger on the trigger or inside the trigger guard. You won't point it at anything you're not willing to destroy. You'll keep it pointed in a safe direction. "Unloaded" carry, IMO, encourages just the opposite. "Don't worry, it's not loaded" Carry guns are not for show and tell. They're not to take out and admire in the restroom. They remain holstered from morning to night unless dire circumstances call for their use. Carrying them loaded is perfectly safe and carrying them unloaded can put the person in unnecessary added danger should a SD situation ever arise. |
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March 10, 2013, 12:01 PM | #110 |
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"Carry guns are not for show and tell. They're not to take out and admire in the restroom. They remain holstered from morning to night unless dire circumstances call for their use. Carrying them loaded is perfectly safe and carrying them unloaded can put the person in unnecessary added danger should a SD situation ever arise"
Absolutely. And those that need to be convinced of this, or who disagree with this, have self-selected themselves into the group that ought to not carry. Willie . |
March 10, 2013, 01:44 PM | #111 |
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I really don't have a problem with someone deciding not to carry with a round in the chamber. There are some people who decide not to carry at all. Not my decision.
I've known people who are better shooters than me who decide not to. I do think some people have an unrealistic expectation that a self defense situation will be like on TV. John Wayne pulling a gun and firing across the street at the bad guys. Sometimes it is. But quite often your free hand will be pinned or be budy defending you from a knife attack or someone beating you with a piece of pipe. |
March 10, 2013, 01:54 PM | #112 | ||
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No doubt carrying with a round in the chamber could save a few seconds if the firearm is needed. So its up to the individual to look at the options and decide what they want to do. I am not telling anyone what way they should carry their firearm like some are, just giving my opinion. Last edited by manta49; March 10, 2013 at 02:25 PM. |
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March 10, 2013, 02:08 PM | #113 | |
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do you carry chambered?
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Sent from iPhone Last edited by Garycw; March 10, 2013 at 03:43 PM. |
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March 10, 2013, 02:19 PM | #114 | |
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Regardless of where you store the ammo, if a round is not chambered, the gun is effectively unloaded and must be loaded before it will fire. When it comes to self defense when speed is of the essence, a brick can be more effective than an unloaded gun, because you won't have to waste any time trying to load the brick.
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March 10, 2013, 02:32 PM | #115 | |||
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As mentioned, the first rule of safe gun handling is: All guns are always loaded. A while ago I received the following (quoted in part) in an email from another Gunsite alumnus (emphasis added): At Gunsite, training is on a hot range. For those who carry a gun in public, everyday life is a "hot range." It's a good idea to get used to that and learn to consistently conduct oneself accordingly. As I've mentioned before, your being safe with your gun is completely within your control. The circumstances of a violent incident in which you may need to use your gun are not; they will be chosen largely by your assailant.
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March 10, 2013, 02:45 PM | #116 | |||
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My earlier post. Quote:
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March 10, 2013, 02:48 PM | #117 |
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Yeah, but if I knew I was going to a gunfight, I'd take a rifle . . . and friends . . . with rifles.
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March 10, 2013, 02:49 PM | #118 |
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Manta, in the U.S. military, the further removed from actual combat you are, the more skiddish those above you in the chain of command get concerning loaded weapons.
For instance, every time we came back inside our FOB, we had to go through the ritual of clearing our weapons and decharging our magazines. It was procedure and that procedure was enforced. Remind me to tell you the story about the fat USAF Major who yelled at me for wearing gray socks and a para-cord bracelet one day. Note: Decharging the mags everyday gave you the chance to inspect and clean them though. So that was good.
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March 10, 2013, 03:00 PM | #119 | |
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March 10, 2013, 03:36 PM | #120 |
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Manta49,
I have no idea why they'd make the police or anyone else unload their guns at the end of a shift but I'd be willing to guess that the answer has a lot more to do with politics than safety. My carry gun is unloaded when I shoot it. Otherwise, there's a round in the chamber, 24/7/365. The same is true for virtually everyone who carries. |
March 10, 2013, 03:39 PM | #121 | |
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March 10, 2013, 03:47 PM | #122 |
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do you carry chambered?
Carrying unchambered may also be that persons lack of confidence in there abilities or there gun to handle it properly.
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March 10, 2013, 04:16 PM | #123 |
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Let's keep it civil. If this descends any further into bickering, it's done.
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March 10, 2013, 04:22 PM | #124 |
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I carried chambered because if I ever have to pull my Glock, it will because I need it right the hell now, not two seconds from now.
Also, I carry a Glock because I generally don't need a gun in my daily activities. If I know I'm going to need a gun, I usually take my M-4A1, and atleast a squad worth of guys behind me.
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March 10, 2013, 04:25 PM | #125 |
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I have seen a great many loaded pistols being holstered without ever seeing a negligent discharge. I have done so myself perhaps thousands of times.
Yes, negligent discharges occur. When they do, it's because someone has been negligent -- imagine that. It is, however, within one's control to not be negligent.
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