Case Questions for a Beginner

[AAshooter]

My goal is to start reloading someday. I currently reload shotgun but have never done metallic cartridges. I am in the process of collecting brass. I have a signicant amount of .38, .357 Mag, .40 S&W and .45 ACP. As well as 30-06.

So is it necessary to divide the brass up by manufacturer? Are there certain manufacturers I should specifically keep for reloading and specific manufacturers that I should dump??

Also, how's the best way to decode a manufacturer's markings? For example, some of my brass is marked with R*P. Not sure how to tie that to a manufacturer.

[tINY]

RP is Remington.

I'd keep it all. You get more consistent results using the same brass, but unless you are loading for ultimate accuracy or pushing the pressures near max, you can interchange pistol brass. You do need to inspect them carefully.

For the '06, don't keep any berdan primed ones and separate them by MFG.



-tINY

[amamnn]

If the time before you begin to reload it is going to be measured in years or even months, you want to be sure to keep your brass in sealed containers, protected from extremes of temperature humidity, etc. Believe it or not, the brass can become brittle on the surface if this is not done, and over a really long period even if it is done. That's the very beginning of that great patina that antique dealers look for on brass.

[Don H]

To expand on tINY's answer slightly, R*P stands for Remington-Peters.

[BillCA]

To further expound on the topic...

For rifle brass, it's a good idea to segregate the brass by manufacturer. In some cases, like surplus military brass, I use that for lighter loads and lump it all together.

You can do the same for revolver & pistol brass too, if you will be loading for match accuracy. Typically, unless you're trying for match accuracy or loading near-maximum loads it's not necessary.

The reason is there are variations from manufacturer to manufacturer for the same cartridge case. For example, due to the thickness of the brass used or the way the case-head is formed, Brand-X may hold a little less powder than Brand-Z. Not a big deal until you load near-max pressure loads where that teeny bit of extra room becomes important.

[AAshooter]

Thanks for the comments. In general, I am looking for plinking accuracy on my handgun ammo. I do more tactical shooting so much smaller than an 8" group means I am moving too slowly. Of course, headshots are a little different but I am not looking for the ultimate in accuracy. On another front, I understand trimming cases for pistol ammo (.38, .357 and .45) is not really necessary . . . is that right?

I carry factory loaded ammo on the street.

The 30-06 is a different matter. I would like to get to the point that I have an accurate load for the one gun. I understand there to be significant advantages to using the same brass again and again in the same firearm.

Thanks for the comments. More comments and suggestions are welcome.

[tINY]

Trimming you brass is more critical for straight walled pistol cases than the bottle necked '06. This is especially true if you are crimping your magnum revolver cartridges.




-tINY

[amamnn]

ALL brass needs to be kept in trim all the time. Handgun brass does not need to be trimmed as often as rfile brass, but you still need to check it. If you want to trim and check in ther most cost effective manner, the Lee trimmers are a very good idea.

[tINY]

Alright, Seattle Ammamnn, educate me

I was under the impression that rimless pistol brass headspaced on the case mouth and common practice for rimmed cases included crimping the case into a cannelure. Both of these situations require fairly uniform and controlled case length.

For bottlenecked rifle cases, the headspacing is from the shoulder and there is .010-.020 extra room for the neck to grow. Bullets are held in place by neck tension. The cases need to be trimmed if they are too long, but the actuall length isn't as critical unless you are shooting for groups from a bench or need hyper accuracy for 450yard sod poodles.

What am I missing here?




-tINY

[M1911]

I've reloaded about 105 batches of handgun ammo (more than 10,000 rounds). I reload 9mm, 38 Spcl, 10mm, and 45 ACP. I do my best NOT to approach max loads.

I've never trimmed a case yet. YMMV.

[AAshooter]

M1911, that is what I have been told be a couple reloaders that I didn't need to worry about pistol cases as far as trimming them. The posts above surprised me.

[Unclenick]

You don't need to worry about trimming most pistol brass, but especially not the lower pressure cases like the .45 ACP because they actually shorten with each reloading cycle. The mechanisms for stretching a rifle case are that after the firing pin slams the case forward into the headspace determinate (shoulder, rim, belt, mouth) the pressure expands the case and sticks its sides to the chamber wall. The neck pulls forward a bit before the bullet is released, stretching it, and the casehead is pushed back against the boltface without the sides letting go, so it has stretched at the casehead/caseweb junction to fill any extra room between the casehead and breechface. Case trimming for rifles to prevent the neck from reaching too far into the chamber should, ideally, be done by making the trim with respect to the headspace determinate (usually the mid case shoulder for a bottleneck rifle case) as the Gracey trimmer does, and not off the case head, as most other trimmers do.

Most pistol rounds do not develop enough pressure to stick the case to the sides of the chamber. Without a bottleneck there is no pressure pushing oppositely on the shoulder and head of the case. As a result, the straight wall pistol case widens and shortens and just slams back into the breechface rather than stretching back at the casehead/caseweb junction as most rifle cases do. This is why head separations are uncommon in pistol loads. When you resize it, most of the wide brass is squirted back up to length by the constricting of the sizing die, but a little of it is permanently flowed rearward by the down-stroking direction of the sizing die. I once had a batch of 1000 .45 ACP cases I'd bought new and used only for softball in bullseye matches. The light loads allowed the cases to be used about 50 times. They shortened an average of 0.025" over those 50 loadings, or about half a thousandth per reload.

If you shoot a lot of heavily crimped full magnum pressure loads, keep an eye on the length of the cases to be sure they don't grow instead of shrink. Some do in the higher pressure ranges. As for casemouth headspacing in ACP style pistol cartridges, my recommendation is not to. These same rounds will also headspace on a bullet when it rests against the throat. Headspacing on the bullet gives best cast bullet accuracy in my 1911’s. To do this in a 1911, just seat the bullet out further until the casehead face is flush with barrel extension (hood) when you drop it into the barrel. If you change to this method, you should re-work up any maximum loads headspaced this way because the bullet will be touching the lands, which will raise pressure a bit.

Nick

[tINY]

This makes sense. I have noticed that pistol brass doesn't tend to change much - but I have always scrutinized it.

With rifle brass, I tend to check COL on a sample basis and trim when they get a bit too long. Sounds like I need a different trimmer for my precision loading......



-tINY

[MADISON]

According to a several year old test made by "AMERICAN HANDGUNNER" SORTING HANDGUN BRASS DOES NOT EFFECT ACCURACY.
Mixed brass does effect rifle accuracy.

[ledavatar]

I actually have a followup question - I shot a box of Winchester NT Clean in .45acp a while back and kept the brass and noticed that while it's really clean inside the case, it looks really really dirty on the outside to the point where I think the case might have suffered some extensive heat damage. Does anyone know why that is and if it is safe to load in that brass?

BTW, I'm just getting set up on reloading and haven't actually started to reload yet (waiting for the stuff to come from Midway!).

[skeeter1]

If in doubt, get yourself some cheap calipers,

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/GNS200-46637-1743.html

and follow the dimensions according to your reloading manual.

I've never had to do any case trimming on .38Spl or .357Mag brass, but I'm sure you'd have to be more careful with .30-06 cases.

Heck, the calipers are 20 bucks, surprisingly accurate (better than my micrometer), and you'll find other uses for them too.

They also have plenty of digital calipers, but the dial calipers work just fine for me, and I didn't want something else that needed batteries.

[AAshooter]

Per Amamnn's post, is there something special I should do with this stuff if I am going to hang on to it for a while before reloading. I plan to store it in ziplock bags as I gather it.

[amamnn]

WOW Nick--nice post--pix and all!!!!!

AA--the ziplocks will be good, but not in an unheated garage or basement. Store 'em in your sock drawer.