Scavenging 12 ga shotshells for reloading

TheGuyOfSouthamerica · September 11, 2016, 08:30 AM

hi to all,

I want to present myself:
I am from Southamerica but am as well canadian citizen.

I recently started relaoding and a few weeks ago started casting also.
Locally we can not get gun powder and so we have to get creative. I started scavenging 12 ga shotshells for powder and lead for reloading and am very successfull with that.
All reloading Equipment is legal here but you can not get gun powder of any Kind since shipping lines refuse to Transport it.

I had the luck that a few weeks ago some of my ordered bullet molds arrived and since then I can cast my own bullets as well. I have the Lee 124 grain Truncated Cone tumble lube .356" 9mm Luger mold and the 7/8 oz Lee drive key slug mold. Both are awesome. I reload 9mm Luger for my S&W SD9VE pistol and for my Heritage (Pietta) Rough Rider 1873 SAA 357 magnum 5.5" Revolver I reload with same bullets my "reinvented" 9mm Federal Rimmed (trimmed down 357 mag/38spl cases to 19mm).
I reload those bullets with both caliber with 3.0 grains of bullseye type scavenged shotgun powder since they seat at about 1.044". From the Revolver I get about 1.4" Groups at 20 meters and I experience no leading. I lube those bullets with Texaco NLGI 2 (MP2) Marfak Lithium grease since it is the only lead cast bullet lube availlable here. The 9mm Federal Rimmed have good Penetration and kick since they penetrate at least 1.5" hardwood from 20 meters distance.

The reloading saves me about 50% of the factory ammo cost and if I cast my own bullets I save about 80% of the factory ammo cost. Reloading and casting are huge savings here.

g.willikers · September 11, 2016, 09:30 AM

Welcome.
Your reloading adventures sound like something from a post apocalyptic novel.
How have you determined safe loads using the shotgun powder?
What are you doing with the shotgun pellets to make them useful for making bullets?
What are you using for primers?

TheGuyOfSouthamerica · September 11, 2016, 10:00 AM

Dear g willikers,

I use WSP (winchester small pistol) primers exclusively. I recently ordered 10000 WSP from the US and hope they arrive this year. LOcal gun shop said within 2 months they will haven 'em as well so I probably buy there 10000 WSP as well. Here in Southamerica we have to stockpile since relaoding supplyes are not availlable all the time (if they are at all).

Scavenging shotshells for powder and lead is not that bad at all once you get used to it. one 12 ga shothell has about 25 grains of powder (Orbea brand from Argentina) and the spanish brand (Saga) has about 28 grains of powder. So you see the argentinian brand (Bullseye, Titegroup type powder) has a quicker burn powder as the spanish brand (Universal type powder).
The 124 grain lead cast TC TL Lee bullet cycles well with 3.0 grain argentinian type shotshell powder and as well 3.1 grains of the spanish shotshell powder.

Safe loads I ONLY DETERM BY SEMI AUTO PISTOL CYCLING RELIABLE. Once the pistol cycles relaibly that is my loading data. I NEVER PASS THAT POINT. It is the Minimum powder Charge with which the pistol is cycling reliable. I make sure the powder never is compressed since the 124 grain cast bullet seats fairly deeply at 1.044" (FMJ seats at 1.142") so powder Charge has to be reduced to have the same amount of empty airspace in the case since powder Charge and empty airspace determine the pressure of the round.

The shotgun lead I melt in for my Lee 124 grain Truncated Cone tumble lube lead cast bullets and for 7/8 oz Lee drive key slugs. I use as well wheel weights as lead source (heavy Zinc Content) since that is fairly availlable (18 Cents a Pound it costs me at the gas Station).

g.willikers · September 11, 2016, 10:29 AM

It sounds like you have it figured out.
We call that approach "Winging It."
How did you determine the burn rate of the shotgun powder and the comparison to known powders like Bullseye, Unique, Titegroup and such?
Do you have access to a chronograph to measure the velocity of the loads?

TheGuyOfSouthamerica · September 11, 2016, 10:43 AM

I do not yet have an chronograph. I have coming in more Lee molds and save the Money for it. Once they arrive I will order one of These Caldwell chronographs on Amazon.

As I started I wanted to make my own Black Powder but that never got the sufficient burn Speed and energy Levels to have enough kick. So I left that Approach.
I watched Youtube Videos of burning powder and then burned the shotshell powder and compared the Speeds. Over all shotgun powder is smokeless and if stated velocities of shotshells are somewhat similar you can guess the powder is in the same ballpark.
I worked my way up at the beginning. First I loaded 3 grains then 3.5 grains then 4 grains then 4.4 grains with 115 grain FMJ Winchester bullets. Manuals said 4 to 4.8 grains of Unique. So I took 1 grain lower powder Charge as stated in Manuals in order to "be on the safe side". Somewere by 4.0 grains the gun cycled almost reliable (some stovepipes I had) so I bumped the Charge up to 4.4 then settled to 4.2 grains for 115 grain FMJ as then it cycled reliable. I worked my powder Charge up starting from way below the stated Minimum powder Charge for a powder somewhat in the ballpark.

September 11, 2016, 08:30 AM	#1
TheGuyOfSouthamerica Junior member Join Date: September 10, 2016 Posts: 846	Scavenging 12 ga shotshells for reloading hi to all, I want to present myself: I am from Southamerica but am as well canadian citizen. I recently started relaoding and a few weeks ago started casting also. Locally we can not get gun powder and so we have to get creative. I started scavenging 12 ga shotshells for powder and lead for reloading and am very successfull with that. All reloading Equipment is legal here but you can not get gun powder of any Kind since shipping lines refuse to Transport it. I had the luck that a few weeks ago some of my ordered bullet molds arrived and since then I can cast my own bullets as well. I have the Lee 124 grain Truncated Cone tumble lube .356" 9mm Luger mold and the 7/8 oz Lee drive key slug mold. Both are awesome. I reload 9mm Luger for my S&W SD9VE pistol and for my Heritage (Pietta) Rough Rider 1873 SAA 357 magnum 5.5" Revolver I reload with same bullets my "reinvented" 9mm Federal Rimmed (trimmed down 357 mag/38spl cases to 19mm). I reload those bullets with both caliber with 3.0 grains of bullseye type scavenged shotgun powder since they seat at about 1.044". From the Revolver I get about 1.4" Groups at 20 meters and I experience no leading. I lube those bullets with Texaco NLGI 2 (MP2) Marfak Lithium grease since it is the only lead cast bullet lube availlable here. The 9mm Federal Rimmed have good Penetration and kick since they penetrate at least 1.5" hardwood from 20 meters distance. The reloading saves me about 50% of the factory ammo cost and if I cast my own bullets I save about 80% of the factory ammo cost. Reloading and casting are huge savings here.

September 11, 2016, 09:30 AM	#2
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Welcome. Your reloading adventures sound like something from a post apocalyptic novel. How have you determined safe loads using the shotgun powder? What are you doing with the shotgun pellets to make them useful for making bullets? What are you using for primers? __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

September 11, 2016, 10:29 AM	#4
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	It sounds like you have it figured out. We call that approach "Winging It." How did you determine the burn rate of the shotgun powder and the comparison to known powders like Bullseye, Unique, Titegroup and such? Do you have access to a chronograph to measure the velocity of the loads? __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

September 11, 2016, 10:00 AM	#3
TheGuyOfSouthamerica Junior member Join Date: September 10, 2016 Posts: 846	Dear g willikers, I use WSP (winchester small pistol) primers exclusively. I recently ordered 10000 WSP from the US and hope they arrive this year. LOcal gun shop said within 2 months they will haven 'em as well so I probably buy there 10000 WSP as well. Here in Southamerica we have to stockpile since relaoding supplyes are not availlable all the time (if they are at all). Scavenging shotshells for powder and lead is not that bad at all once you get used to it. one 12 ga shothell has about 25 grains of powder (Orbea brand from Argentina) and the spanish brand (Saga) has about 28 grains of powder. So you see the argentinian brand (Bullseye, Titegroup type powder) has a quicker burn powder as the spanish brand (Universal type powder). The 124 grain lead cast TC TL Lee bullet cycles well with 3.0 grain argentinian type shotshell powder and as well 3.1 grains of the spanish shotshell powder. Safe loads I ONLY DETERM BY SEMI AUTO PISTOL CYCLING RELIABLE. Once the pistol cycles relaibly that is my loading data. I NEVER PASS THAT POINT. It is the Minimum powder Charge with which the pistol is cycling reliable. I make sure the powder never is compressed since the 124 grain cast bullet seats fairly deeply at 1.044" (FMJ seats at 1.142") so powder Charge has to be reduced to have the same amount of empty airspace in the case since powder Charge and empty airspace determine the pressure of the round. The shotgun lead I melt in for my Lee 124 grain Truncated Cone tumble lube lead cast bullets and for 7/8 oz Lee drive key slugs. I use as well wheel weights as lead source (heavy Zinc Content) since that is fairly availlable (18 Cents a Pound it costs me at the gas Station).

September 11, 2016, 10:43 AM	#5
TheGuyOfSouthamerica Junior member Join Date: September 10, 2016 Posts: 846	I do not yet have an chronograph. I have coming in more Lee molds and save the Money for it. Once they arrive I will order one of These Caldwell chronographs on Amazon. As I started I wanted to make my own Black Powder but that never got the sufficient burn Speed and energy Levels to have enough kick. So I left that Approach. I watched Youtube Videos of burning powder and then burned the shotshell powder and compared the Speeds. Over all shotgun powder is smokeless and if stated velocities of shotshells are somewhat similar you can guess the powder is in the same ballpark. I worked my way up at the beginning. First I loaded 3 grains then 3.5 grains then 4 grains then 4.4 grains with 115 grain FMJ Winchester bullets. Manuals said 4 to 4.8 grains of Unique. So I took 1 grain lower powder Charge as stated in Manuals in order to "be on the safe side". Somewere by 4.0 grains the gun cycled almost reliable (some stovepipes I had) so I bumped the Charge up to 4.4 then settled to 4.2 grains for 115 grain FMJ as then it cycled reliable. I worked my powder Charge up starting from way below the stated Minimum powder Charge for a powder somewhat in the ballpark.