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Old December 23, 2004, 09:45 AM   #51
K80Geoff
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I guess it depends where you live. When I lived in Blue state suburbia, bumps at night were as common a sound as the jets in the holding pattern for JFK over my house. And I rarely worried about them. Unless I heard human voices. Once I found an inebriated young woman relieving herself on my front lawn at three AM...... Now you know why I moved

Here in the country I usually investigate bumps, unless the dog is standing in the middle of the living room with her tail between her legs and shaking..that usually means a visit from local four legged Black thieves looking for a bird feeder or bag of trash to pilfer. Last one left a big pile of doo doo in a conspicuous place.....but they all are hibernating now

Funny how everybody up here has dogs, and nobody gets upset when they hear gunshots.
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Old December 23, 2004, 12:57 PM   #52
riverkeeper
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LAK --Excellent question!

Applies primarily to perp sounds (not night sounds) inside the house.
Since it is a real situation and the police are the pros...I'd do what they say and update the situation for them over the cell.

Critical to advise them of OUR location and the location-activities of the perp if possible.

Our location in the house layout and our security situation would've been provided in the initial call and reconfirmed at their arrival.

I understand officers would/might be reluctant to approach with armed citizens on board.

Any advice would be welcome.

OOPS -- didn't read your note well at all. Above is what we expect to do.
If we heard the perp leave .. carefully comply with the request. If we continue to hear activity advise them of that. If silent...after 10 min or more check it out using the techniqes learned from Ayoob.
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Old December 23, 2004, 06:57 PM   #53
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My situation.

I live in the wilds of North Long Beach, PDSR California. Neighbors to the right of me, neighbors to the left, Forest Lawn Cemetary (branch office) behind me.

The house has security bars on all windows, external security screen doors and deadbolts on both external and internal entry doors. I changed the locks when I bought the house and we keep close track of who has keys. Anyone breaking in will make a serious and noticeable 'bump'.

We also have a possum living in the attic, part time. The 'skittering' sound makes the doggy nuts. M'lady wife and I sleep in one room, my 17 year old son (who is taller than I) sleeps across the hall. He has a good flashlight and pepper spray. The dog usually has the run of the place at night and the cat sleeps either in our room or the office. The dog is a big, scary looking critter who is a [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] cat. The cat will come and get me.

No, I don't investigate every little odd noise I hear. There are rats and squirrels living in the back (they commute from the cemetary) and the attic. Motorcycles run up and down the street and about every six weeks, the neighbors to the north have a party. Party is defined as "...every living relative and friend in the North American continent showing up and drinking themselves into a dead stupor while screaming at the top of their lungs."

Aside from that, I will check out any 'odd noise' I cannot identify. I know my house well and I see in the dark well. My favorite 'house gun' is a Rossi '92 in .44-40; the barrel has been chopped a bit. I keep my cell phone in the bedroom, too.

I think I'm in pretty good shape (tactically, physically I'm a couch potatoe). When I retire and hopefully build my retirement home in the next four to ten years, I'm going to design the place with some of these ideas in mind. M'lady wife thinks I'm just a bit 'over' on this, but she sleeps very well. And so do I.
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Old December 24, 2004, 02:43 AM   #54
LAK
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riverkeeper,

The most likely problem I see is an entry through, say a window for example. This means your front door is still likely locked, and any peace officer with half a brain is not going to walk around someone's breeched premises with a flashlight peering through windows etc. In the case where the mark is still inside, someone is going to have to make a move at some point, and it's most likely going to have to be you.
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Old December 28, 2004, 09:08 AM   #55
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Interesting Thread.

My plan is much like RKs, but has some more parts to it

My house was purchased with a home break-in scenario as a consideration. All sleeping areas are on second floor. Master bedroom has clear sight line of to stairway. One child still in the house, has bedroom next to master, 3 feet away from master br door.

Bump in the night drill is as follows. Upon alert, (dog, alarm, etc) wife and I make sure each is awake. I secure Glock and mag light, move to daughter's room and move her to master bedroom (she is instructed to remain in room until either of us get her). While doing so, wife makes 911 call and secures Scattergun Tech 870 from closet. I return with daughter, shut door, turn on bedroom light and all move both to master bath, which has clear sight line to bedroom door. (Contact maintained with LE dispatch throughout situation).

At this point wait. If intruder(s) is in house, he/she/they can have anything in it outside the master bedroom (that's what insurance is for!) If BG(s) comes thru bedroom door, I'm ready and prepared to engage. Upon arrival of LE, front door key on big hunter orange boat float key chain out the bathroom window to front lawn for LE folks. Further action depends on how LE folks want to proceed.


Too paranoid, Too cautious? Perhaps, but some key things to consider.


1. I have made the determination at this point in my life not to do any house clearing if I don't have to, and if allowed the option, will wait the situation out from a defensive position of my choosing. My thinking is also greatly influenced by a home invasion situation when I was 17. (Worked out OK, but upon much review as I've gotten older (I'm 50), was based on luck since my mom and I didn't have a clue!)

2. There is a plan, and we practice it, including communication between ourselves during the drill, redundent comms (cordless/cell phones), switching roles, and one parent options. (Ayoob's thoughts and recommendations had a great influence on the decision/planning process). Is the plan perfect? Nope, no plan survives first contact with BG/enemy. There are always variations/contingencies to consider/execute as the situation develops.

3. Having done actual, hostiles involved house clearing ops (military, not LE situations) I don't really want to ever do another, especially since I don't have access to the personnel/gear/weapons mix available in those ops. (teammates, NVGs & frag grenades are wonderful things!)

4. I know my limitations and would much rather leverage tactical and personal advantages, rather then mitigate weaknesses. (The older you get, the better you was!)


My considerations and decisions in this regard may not be yours, but this works for me.

Pretty verbose I know, but just my opinion. All comments encouraged and welcome!
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Last edited by Striker; December 28, 2004 at 03:03 PM.
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Old December 28, 2004, 12:17 PM   #56
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Depends on the tone of the dogs bark, nuff said.

(Note to Psychosword...You better get your furnace checked out by a pro to be safe. Most carbon monoxide detectors alarm two different ways; low level exposure for a long period of time, and high level exposure for a short period of time. Also, what brand is the detector? "NightHawk" is the best brand going and I've never had a false alarm from one of them. Most other brands have cheap sensors and give false alarms about half the time. But consider also that if its wrong half the time, its right half the time too! Most utility companies will come do a C.O. check for free. C.O. is not to be toyed with or taken lightly. Wouldn't want to read about you in the newspaper.)
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Old December 28, 2004, 02:40 PM   #57
InToItTRX
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I am going with other people on this one, I listen for my dog to bark, I live alone and have a German Shepherd, he lets me know of the Fed Ex guy coming before he even rings the door bell.
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Old December 28, 2004, 02:57 PM   #58
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I say I would, but I guess it would depend.

My house is kind of old and way off the beaten path, we share a common drive with the neighbors, who bought my grand parents house a few years back.

They have 925 dogs, each evening when they feed it sounds like a jailbreak at the LA County Dog Pound. They normally don’t bark unless it’s feeding time and they tend to stay on their own property, so I would go investigate a barking dog close to my house.

If it’s just a general bump in the night or day for that matter I’d grab the SIG P226ST 9mm with M3 and go check it out, if it’s a loud unidentifiable noise, possible home invasion, aliens are coming the AK will get called on and anything that comes thru my door gets blasted multiple times.

House clearing, I’m gonna stick with my SIG or whatever handgun I’ve got on me because I’m trained to clear using a handgun and most of the time when I clear a building as a LEO I’m carrying only a pistol anyway.

I’ve got a Benelli and a nice duded out Remmy 870 but I tend to go for my Jihad gun when I feel the need for something heavier, besides the oh [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] factor looking down the barrel of an AK with 30 round mag has to do wonders for the condition of your shorts.


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Old December 28, 2004, 04:48 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indigo
Special Weapons And Tactics.

Regards,

Indigo
When I did a report on Darryl Gates, back in 6th grade admittedly, I read that the orginal name for what later became SWAT was Special Weapons Attack Team. It's been a long time and I'm curious if this was actually the first name for SWAT.

As far as what I'd do if I heard a bump in the night, I'd probably lie and wait for another, one the second I'd be at the door listening. What I did after that would depend on what I heard.

I'm glad my dad doesn't investigate every bump in the night with weapon in hand, I'd probably have been scared poopless several times by now as I have a habit of wandering the house at odd hours of the night/morning in search of something to drink.
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Old December 29, 2004, 07:19 PM   #60
Doug242ti
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Intresting thread. I've thought about it personally quite a bit and have always come back to the same conclusion. I always looked at it this way:

1. My house is pretty small
2. Anyone coming into the house is probably indeed heading the bedroom first (I would if I was a criminal)

This would give a very limited amount of time to be prepaired so to me, the best action always seems to be call the cops and stay isolated to the bedroom. I've always felt I had a much better chance defensively in my bedroom (which is fairly large) than on the move.
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Old January 6, 2005, 08:29 AM   #61
abelew
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I have investigated bumps, my house is small, and my dog helps me out (they are locked in bedroom at night). Shes a pretty good sized one, but shes a scardy dog. Shes helpful because I can tell when she gets spooked, and shes another pair of eyes. If I know there is someone in my house, Im lockin myself into the bedroom, calling cops, and laying a bead on the door, and anything that comes through the door without any ID and confirmation by the 911 operator is getting shot.

That said, I dont have any kids, and my wife sleeps with me, so I know if she is next to me, there is something wrong if I hear something outside the bedroom.
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