2nd Outing with Patriot 375 Ruger

stagpanther · January 28, 2017, 06:33 PM

Since my first outing was just a few shots of "very mild" 235 gr hot cors I decided to man up a bit and step up to full-power 270 gr SP driven by RL15 for my next attempt.

I worked my way up gradually, but topped out at just below the redline with a load yielding 60,000 psi. Playing around with the numbers on QL I quickly got a picture that there is a diminishing point of returns where large increases in powder (depending on the powder type) net little gain in velocity (but lots of boom/recoil). That said, RL 15 seems to burn extremely efficiently and cleanly in this cartridge

I'm still new to this class of power in a rifle--so I'm still learning how best to adjust by my own trial and error. I'm still learning how to deal with the recoil in this particular rifle--it wouldn't surprise me if a Ruger Hawkeye in the same caliber feels and handles the same cartridge in a different way--but I don't know.

I shot 20 cartridges from the bench using a front bag rest. On my first outing I fet the recoil was akin to a "progressive pulse"--but after today's 20 shots I'd describe the recoil as a "solid shove." It is not a "kick like a mule" slam to the shoulder (in fact I feel no residual pain at all to my shoulder) but a very forceful shove to the entire upper torso, which if I wasn't doing things "just right" resulted in my head snapping back--much more like being rear-ended by a car than anything else in felt recoil transmission--if that makes any sense.

Today's conditions were pretty bad, strong winds of 20 to 25 mph with the occassional rogue gust of up to 40. Unfortunately one such gust blew over not only my target stand--but also blew the rifle off my table--falling down into the rocks and mud, so I scored my first nicks and scrapes in a beautiful rifle (and also knocked the scope out of zero).

Groups were only a little better than my first outing--usually around 2 to 2.5" at 100. I've read multiple reports of the rifle being capable of shooting well under MOA--but I have a ways to go before I get there. This is about as good as I could get today.

Part of the problem is I'm having trouble steadying the rifle for the shot--it seems to demand a good grip pulling slightly back to keep the recoil in the right spot on the shoulder while being able to absorb just enough "push."

Any advice on improving technique (other than shooting more often)--especially by someone with experience with this particular rifle--would be welcome.

CarJunkieLS1 · January 28, 2017, 07:01 PM

I can't help you with that particular cartridge or rifle but I can tell you that in windy conditions the wind not affects the bullet, it effects the shooter as much if not more. If you are shooting at 100 yards I'd say that a 20mph wind had more effect on you than it did on the big heavy bullet.

stagpanther · February 1, 2017, 05:44 PM

Went out again today--this time with 5 4-shot groups of 250 gamekings driven by win 760. MOst groups were still pretty wide and I was getting discouraged--until this load came along:

The temperature was in the mid teens and snow was falling--the first shot (which I'll call a flier : ) ) was low on a cool bore--the next three were warm-barrel shots taken about 30 seconds apart. Maybe the powder performs better when warm??

SHR970 · February 1, 2017, 07:04 PM

Once again... your caliber is not a bench rest gun. Cold bore shot is important. Now take the same load and cold bore fire it when the weather is warmer. See what it does.

Was shot #1 your fault or was it the nature of the gun and the cold barrel?

The powder in the other rounds didn't warm up... your barrel did.

Edit to add. #1 was low but not so much that I would care at 150 yards or less.

stagpanther · February 1, 2017, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Was shot #1 your fault or was it the nature of the gun and the cold barrel?

Obviously was my fault--but the first shot in each group (which was at the end of a 200yd trudge through the snow to the target and back) seemed to be consistently low and the following shots tended to be higher--and it may just pure coincidence--but subsequent shots seemed to tighten when I didn't wait as long between shots. (or maybe I just found "the sweet harmonic" charge?)

SHR970 · February 1, 2017, 10:52 PM

Cold Bore

Subsequent shots went through a bore that warmed up. It is not ammo; it is barrel and harmonics.

If you repeat the shot with the same components and load data in a "warm" environment I'll bet your first round flyer is closer to the group. So much so that it is part of the group @ normal temp.

stagpanther · February 2, 2017, 09:11 AM

Also, shooting a rifle of this level of power is something I've never done before--so finding a good hold to prevent getting pounded hard while at the same time concentrating on a smooth trigger manipulation is a bit of a balancing act that I have not dealt with before. But I think I'll get the hang of it. : )

taylorce1 · February 2, 2017, 02:12 PM

Yep, just shoot more and your groups will improve. If you feel tired from shooting it stop! The .375 Ruger isn't something you can put 20+ rounds down range when you first start shooting it, unless you've been shooting something similar for awhile.

stagpanther · February 2, 2017, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Yep, just shoot more and your groups will improve. If you feel tired from shooting it stop! The .375 Ruger isn't something you can put 20+ rounds down range when you first start shooting it, unless you've been shooting something similar for awhile.

Quite so--that becomes apparently quickly

But, contaray to what some people might think--it can actually be fun

February 1, 2017, 05:44 PM	#3
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,772	Went out again today--this time with 5 4-shot groups of 250 gamekings driven by win 760. MOst groups were still pretty wide and I was getting discouraged--until this load came along: The temperature was in the mid teens and snow was falling--the first shot (which I'll call a flier : ) ) was low on a cool bore--the next three were warm-barrel shots taken about 30 seconds apart. Maybe the powder performs better when warm?? __________________ "Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill *I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!*

February 2, 2017, 09:11 AM	#7
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,772	Also, shooting a rifle of this level of power is something I've never done before--so finding a good hold to prevent getting pounded hard while at the same time concentrating on a smooth trigger manipulation is a bit of a balancing act that I have not dealt with before. But I think I'll get the hang of it. : ) __________________ "Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill *I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!*

February 2, 2017, 02:12 PM	#8
taylorce1 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2005 Location: On the Santa Fe Trail Posts: 8,242	Yep, just shoot more and your groups will improve. If you feel tired from shooting it stop! The .375 Ruger isn't something you can put 20+ rounds down range when you first start shooting it, unless you've been shooting something similar for awhile. __________________ NRA Life Member

January 28, 2017, 06:33 PM	#1
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,772	2nd Outing with Patriot 375 Ruger Since my first outing was just a few shots of "very mild" 235 gr hot cors I decided to man up a bit and step up to full-power 270 gr SP driven by RL15 for my next attempt. I worked my way up gradually, but topped out at just below the redline with a load yielding 60,000 psi. Playing around with the numbers on QL I quickly got a picture that there is a diminishing point of returns where large increases in powder (depending on the powder type) net little gain in velocity (but lots of boom/recoil). That said, RL 15 seems to burn extremely efficiently and cleanly in this cartridge I'm still new to this class of power in a rifle--so I'm still learning how best to adjust by my own trial and error. I'm still learning how to deal with the recoil in this particular rifle--it wouldn't surprise me if a Ruger Hawkeye in the same caliber feels and handles the same cartridge in a different way--but I don't know. I shot 20 cartridges from the bench using a front bag rest. On my first outing I fet the recoil was akin to a "progressive pulse"--but after today's 20 shots I'd describe the recoil as a "solid shove." It is not a "kick like a mule" slam to the shoulder (in fact I feel no residual pain at all to my shoulder) but a very forceful shove to the entire upper torso, which if I wasn't doing things "just right" resulted in my head snapping back--much more like being rear-ended by a car than anything else in felt recoil transmission--if that makes any sense. Today's conditions were pretty bad, strong winds of 20 to 25 mph with the occassional rogue gust of up to 40. Unfortunately one such gust blew over not only my target stand--but also blew the rifle off my table--falling down into the rocks and mud, so I scored my first nicks and scrapes in a beautiful rifle (and also knocked the scope out of zero). Groups were only a little better than my first outing--usually around 2 to 2.5" at 100. I've read multiple reports of the rifle being capable of shooting well under MOA--but I have a ways to go before I get there. This is about as good as I could get today. Part of the problem is I'm having trouble steadying the rifle for the shot--it seems to demand a good grip pulling slightly back to keep the recoil in the right spot on the shoulder while being able to absorb just enough "push." Any advice on improving technique (other than shooting more often)--especially by someone with experience with this particular rifle--would be welcome. __________________ "Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill *I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!*

January 28, 2017, 07:01 PM	#2
CarJunkieLS1 Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2013 Posts: 686	I can't help you with that particular cartridge or rifle but I can tell you that in windy conditions the wind not affects the bullet, it effects the shooter as much if not more. If you are shooting at 100 yards I'd say that a 20mph wind had more effect on you than it did on the big heavy bullet.

February 1, 2017, 07:04 PM	#4
SHR970 Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2011 Posts: 1,427	Once again... your caliber is not a bench rest gun. Cold bore shot is important. Now take the same load and cold bore fire it when the weather is warmer. See what it does. Was shot #1 your fault or was it the nature of the gun and the cold barrel? The powder in the other rounds didn't warm up... your barrel did. Edit to add. #1 was low but not so much that I would care at 150 yards or less.

February 1, 2017, 10:52 PM	#6
SHR970 Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2011 Posts: 1,427	Cold Bore Subsequent shots went through a bore that warmed up. It is not ammo; it is barrel and harmonics. If you repeat the shot with the same components and load data in a "warm" environment I'll bet your first round flyer is closer to the group. So much so that it is part of the group @ normal temp.