Clean and Powder? - Page 2

stagpanther · December 5, 2014, 01:43 PM

Yeah--I already do that--saw the pics on the blackhorn site. : )

davem · December 9, 2014, 03:01 PM

On the powerbelts. I now use shockwaves but when I first bought powerbelts I was using 100 plus grains of Pyrodex loose powder and accuracy was poor. I was told to use no more than 90 grains. The bullet with a 90 grain charge will mushroom as designed and pushing it faster has no or very little additional effect on a game animal. In any event I dropped down the charge (CVA rifle BTW) and accuracy improved. I went to Shock Waves because accuracy was really good, 1 1/2" groups at 100 yards. IAE- on the power belts some guys swear by them.

stagpanther · December 9, 2014, 05:17 PM

I tried a wide range of charge weights for the powerbelts--pretty much convinced that it didn't make that much difference (results were generally mediocre to poor)--plus I was almost out of an entire keg of blackhorn 209 chewed up in testing. I heard so much about how they shoot better than sabots--out of my Impact that is definitely not the case--plus I like the flexibility to experiment with bullets to fit into sabots. But since I'm new to BP I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that I just haven't figured out the right "touch" and may revisit them one day--I blew a couple hundred bucks on them and still have some lying around.

FrontierGander · December 9, 2014, 08:58 PM

TC's are famous for not shooting conical bullets worth a poop. Their QLA system is a mess at the end of the barrel and some shooters actually cut them off when they have to follow state rules and shoot conicals. My best advice, if you HAVE to shoot conicals, buy something that is not a TC!

Doyle · December 9, 2014, 10:00 PM

Quote:

TC's are famous for not shooting conical bullets worth a poop

I'm going to disagree on that one. I've had two T/C muzzleloaders and both loved Hornady SSTs (which are the same thing as the Shockwaves but with a red tip and a cheaper price). The Omega would almost do 3 holes touching and the Encore not quite that good. This was without any kind of up or down experiment on the load - just 100 gr of loose 777.

FrontierGander · December 9, 2014, 10:27 PM

whats there to disagree with? You shoot sabots, not conicals

Doyle · December 9, 2014, 10:34 PM

Quote:

You shoot sabots, not conicals

I thought you were referring to the bullet shape, not specifically to non-sabot conical bullets. I guess we're not thinking of the same thing when using that term.

stagpanther · December 10, 2014, 09:23 AM

The powerbelts are closer to a "full bore width" bullet--but I think they are like a sabot in that the belt itself is providing some compression at the base of the bullet. The accuracy in my Impact seems to go up with full-power powder charges--but so does the crud/residue and I'm seeing signs of exhaust leaking in the breech plug and primer cup when firing full-power charges.

FrontierGander · December 10, 2014, 12:42 PM

A powerbelt is a conical. They are a slip fit conical and the plastic skirt simply holds them in the bore tighter.

A sabot is a pistol caliber projectile with the sabot gripping the bullet all the way around.

Now this one IMO is a sabot/conical hybrid. Federal BOR Loc MZ.

davem · December 10, 2014, 01:38 PM

Yeah, the plastic skirt is sort of a modern day equivalent to the Civil War "Minnie"
BY THE WAY.....there are some legal issues in SOME States. Some States may say a 50 caliber bore is the minimum for deer while others say a 50 caliber projectile. If you load a 50 caliber SABOT using a 45 caliber bullet- you are not using a 50 caliber projectile and there are stories that some hunters have gotten into trouble. In other words, in some situations the power belt being full bore is the best answer.
I had a CVA side lock that really liked the power belts, I later got an in-line that had the shove waves touching a lot of times at 100 yards. The thing is, you will spend a lot on camping fees, gas, etc. etc. while hunting. Use the best bullet possible for your particular rifle.

stagpanther · December 10, 2014, 05:30 PM

Hey Frontier--those middle ones look like Harvester Scorpions--how do they perform for ya?

December 9, 2014, 08:58 PM	#29
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	TC's are famous for not shooting conical bullets worth a poop. Their QLA system is a mess at the end of the barrel and some shooters actually cut them off when they have to follow state rules and shoot conicals. My best advice, if you HAVE to shoot conicals, buy something that is not a TC! __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

December 9, 2014, 10:27 PM	#31
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	whats there to disagree with? You shoot sabots, not conicals __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

December 10, 2014, 12:42 PM	#34
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	A powerbelt is a conical. They are a slip fit conical and the plastic skirt simply holds them in the bore tighter. A sabot is a pistol caliber projectile with the sabot gripping the bullet all the way around. Now this one IMO is a sabot/conical hybrid. Federal BOR Loc MZ. __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

December 5, 2014, 01:43 PM	#26
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,774	Yeah--I already do that--saw the pics on the blackhorn site. : )

December 9, 2014, 03:01 PM	#27
davem Junior member Join Date: October 4, 2004 Posts: 458	On the powerbelts. I now use shockwaves but when I first bought powerbelts I was using 100 plus grains of Pyrodex loose powder and accuracy was poor. I was told to use no more than 90 grains. The bullet with a 90 grain charge will mushroom as designed and pushing it faster has no or very little additional effect on a game animal. In any event I dropped down the charge (CVA rifle BTW) and accuracy improved. I went to Shock Waves because accuracy was really good, 1 1/2" groups at 100 yards. IAE- on the power belts some guys swear by them.

December 9, 2014, 05:17 PM	#28
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,774	I tried a wide range of charge weights for the powerbelts--pretty much convinced that it didn't make that much difference (results were generally mediocre to poor)--plus I was almost out of an entire keg of blackhorn 209 chewed up in testing. I heard so much about how they shoot better than sabots--out of my Impact that is definitely not the case--plus I like the flexibility to experiment with bullets to fit into sabots. But since I'm new to BP I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that I just haven't figured out the right "touch" and may revisit them one day--I blew a couple hundred bucks on them and still have some lying around.

December 10, 2014, 09:23 AM	#33
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,774	The powerbelts are closer to a "full bore width" bullet--but I think they are like a sabot in that the belt itself is providing some compression at the base of the bullet. The accuracy in my Impact seems to go up with full-power powder charges--but so does the crud/residue and I'm seeing signs of exhaust leaking in the breech plug and primer cup when firing full-power charges.

December 10, 2014, 01:38 PM	#35
davem Junior member Join Date: October 4, 2004 Posts: 458	Yeah, the plastic skirt is sort of a modern day equivalent to the Civil War "Minnie" BY THE WAY.....there are some legal issues in SOME States. Some States may say a 50 caliber bore is the minimum for deer while others say a 50 caliber projectile. If you load a 50 caliber SABOT using a 45 caliber bullet- you are not using a 50 caliber projectile and there are stories that some hunters have gotten into trouble. In other words, in some situations the power belt being full bore is the best answer. I had a CVA side lock that really liked the power belts, I later got an in-line that had the shove waves touching a lot of times at 100 yards. The thing is, you will spend a lot on camping fees, gas, etc. etc. while hunting. Use the best bullet possible for your particular rifle.

December 10, 2014, 05:30 PM	#36
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,774	Hey Frontier--those middle ones look like Harvester Scorpions--how do they perform for ya?