For those considering a NAA Ranger, watch this

[TruthTellers]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8ifuCTIWrA

I don't know why, but I never thought that with how small these revolvers are that it would be possible to accidentally break open the revolver when cocking the hammer. After seeing this, just at the range during some practice shooting, imagine how likely this would be if you needed to use it for self defense.

I'll be staying away from the Ranger II and I advise others to as well. I like NAA, I have the Minimaster, it's wonderful, but the top break mini revolvers seem to be cursed.

[ThomasT]

At the 510 mark it looked like he opened it on purpose. I don't know how much I trust this review. Neat little gun though. Not on my radar.

If it turns out its a legitimate problem the latch could be redesigned as suggested by one of the commenters. Just lowering the top of the latch would work wonders.

[TruthTellers]

^ He did open it on purpose at that moment to demonstrate how it's possible. The guy writes reviews for thetruthaboutguns, so Jeremy is not one to criticize or not recommend something lightly.

We'll see what NAA does, but I was having trouble justifying these for $500 even without issues, now... I can't justify them at all.

[Carmady]

At 2:08 he says, "Shootin' CCI Maxi-Pads..."

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by TruthTellers

^ He did open it on purpose at that moment to demonstrate how it's possible. The guy writes reviews for thetruthaboutguns, so Jeremy is not one to criticize or not recommend something lightly.

With as much as he said it occurred, why did all other footage show the gun operating fine? He made it out like it happens a lot. How did he get through those other segments without it occurring? For such a concern, why not back it up with it occurring other than it working into his “review?”

Fatal flaw? If the gun blew up in your face, that is a fatal flaw. Opening the gun up because you grab the latch with the hammer, I’m calling it more user error. The gun doesn’t allow the latch to open with the hammer home, so the gun is locked during firing. Even when he opened the latch, the hammer pushed down on it... so if the cylinder couldn’t be closed at that point, the hammer couldn’t contact the rim. Enough said for that.

This design is similar to the Schofield latch... the original Ranger, was the original Model 3 latch. The one in question is viewed to be superior. If you are going to nit-pick that latch... I’m going to say to remember the size of the revolver.

I personally wouldn’t buy one as a defensive revolver, but if I did, I’d train on it. He managed to shoot multiple cylinders without it occurring, so if someone practiced (conversion model would be smart; one I’ll probably buy), that likely would be not a problem.

Could NAA make it so the latch is locked unless you hit a catch from the bottom, before pulling back the latch? I’m sure they could... would be more expensive of a design. Then, people would bitch it costs too much, and that it is complicated to break open.

Buy it or not... whatever you decide, the title of that video is not fair or accurate.

[TruthTellers]

Originally Posted by Screwball

With as much as he said it occurred, why did all other footage show the gun operating fine? He made it out like it happens a lot. How did he get through those other segments without it occurring? For such a concern, why not back it up with it occurring other than it working into his “review?”

Fatal flaw? If the gun blew up in your face, that is a fatal flaw. Opening the gun up because you grab the latch with the hammer, I’m calling it more user error. The gun doesn’t allow the latch to open with the hammer home, so the gun is locked during firing. Even when he opened the latch, the hammer pushed down on it... so if the cylinder couldn’t be closed at that point, the hammer couldn’t contact the rim. Enough said for that.

This design is similar to the Schofield latch... the original Ranger, was the original Model 3 latch. The one in question is viewed to be superior. If you are going to nit-pick that latch... I’m going to say to remember the size of the revolver.

I personally wouldn’t buy one as a defensive revolver, but if I did, I’d train on it. He managed to shoot multiple cylinders without it occurring, so if someone practiced (conversion model would be smart; one I’ll probably buy), that likely would be not a problem.

Could NAA make it so the latch is locked unless you hit a catch from the bottom, before pulling back the latch? I’m sure they could... would be more expensive of a design. Then, people would bitch it costs too much, and that it is complicated to break open.

Buy it or not... whatever you decide, the title of that video is not fair or accurate.

Do you believe under stress/panicked that it would be more likely for one to unlock the latch during cocking than if one was plinking at the range?

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by TruthTellers

Do you believe under stress/panicked that it would be more likely for one to unlock the latch during cocking than if one was plinking at the range?

Sorry, but I don’t do hypotheticals like that, especially when I never handled the gun. How am I supposed to know what a random person, with unknown amount of training on a gun, will react? This person have large or small hands?

Ideally, it should come down to muscle memory. That is why people train with their firearms, so when stress comes up in a defensive situation, they fall back to that training.

If you are going to tell me you know that this is going to happen under stress, I’ll call you out on it. How much range time you have on one? That video is the first account of it I’ve seen... so do I automatically say it must be right? Right or wrong, I take offense with the fact that a user error is being portrayed as a “fatal” flaw. Are Glocks faulty for users putting a round in their leg, or is it the shooter putting their finger on the trigger when they shouldn’t? Are Serpas faulty for a similar reason? Nope... training issues.

Either event, I’ve stated that I wouldn’t be planning on using it for defense. I stand by my position that it isn’t a fatal flaw... as the gun does what it is supposed to do; not fire when the cylinder is unlocked.

[Dred]

I'm personally still considering it. He showed us an important training issue and when I stumble across one @ my $300 mark, my training will begin.

My original style NAA was downright frightening to me and I spent quality time with it before developing confidence. My hands are xxl and manipulating anything this tiny requires deliberate effort.

[TruthTellers]

Originally Posted by Screwball

Sorry, but I don’t do hypotheticals like that, especially when I never handled the gun. How am I supposed to know what a random person, with unknown amount of training on a gun, will react? This person have large or small hands?

Ideally, it should come down to muscle memory. That is why people train with their firearms, so when stress comes up in a defensive situation, they fall back to that training.

If you are going to tell me you know that this is going to happen under stress, I’ll call you out on it. How much range time you have on one? That video is the first account of it I’ve seen... so do I automatically say it must be right? Right or wrong, I take offense with the fact that a user error is being portrayed as a “fatal” flaw. Are Glocks faulty for users putting a round in their leg, or is it the shooter putting their finger on the trigger when they shouldn’t? Are Serpas faulty for a similar reason? Nope... training issues.

Either event, I’ve stated that I wouldn’t be planning on using it for defense. I stand by my position that it isn’t a fatal flaw... as the gun does what it is supposed to do; not fire when the cylinder is unlocked.

Well I think we can both agree it shouldn't be used for defense, but I'll say that with the standard NAA's, nothing of this sort will ever be possible.

[heyjoe]

i have the Ranger 2, have fired it as quickly as i can a number of times, wear size xl gloves and have never released the latch when cocking the hammer. no one on the NAA forum has ever mentioned releasing the latch when cocking the hammer.

[ThomasT]

^^^ My vote for best answer of all. At $500 I have several other guns I would rather own. I got one of the flyers from NAA because I was considering buying one of their mini revolvers. They had full size pictures of the different models. I laid myBeretta 950 on top of the gun I was considering and for all intents they were the same size. The Beretta only has to be cocked once and fires 9 times with a fast reload. That was the end of the NAA for me.

But if they scaled that gun up to a 32 long I would give it some serious thought.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by TruthTellers

Well I think we can both agree it shouldn't be used for defense, but I'll say that with the standard NAA's, nothing of this sort will ever be possible.

Poster right below you gave info I’d trust... and even if it is common, a forum dedicated to NAA firearms would have discussed it by now. Unsure if you get NAA emails, but the Ranger II was shipping to some people prior to the official release. The ones that jump on the early bird program likely are active in the NAA forum.

heyjoe, is it possible to do that? If so, is it a sort of thing you have to consciously attempt to do? Not asking because I know the answers, but because you actually are the expert on the Ranger II in here.

[johnwilliamson062]

I'd get one as a range gun if I found it for around that $300 mark. The design could be better. I have relatively small hands so this may not be much of a problem for me.

I wonder if they are considering something like a 327 mag.

I get the whole 'this is user error' or 'training' etc., but the simple reality is that can be said about almost every design flaw ever seen in a firearm. Just like a chainsaw, designs should take into consideration likely user errors, especially in stressful situations. This certainly could be a fatal flaw if it happens at the wrong time. I won't be surprised if there is a re-design of the latch.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by TruthTelelrs

Do you believe under stress/panicked that it would be more likely for one to unlock the latch during cocking than if one was plinking at the range?

I can't answer for Screwball, but I think it's more likely to happen under stress, absolutely.

[heyjoe]

Screwball: heyjoe, is it possible to do that? If so, is it a sort of thing you have to consciously attempt to do? Not asking because I know the answers, but because you actually are the expert on the Ranger II in here.

from watching the video it seems that the reviewer is cocking the hammer with the joint of his thumb instead of the pad of his thumb as most of us would cock a single action. my thumb doesnt come anywhere hear the latch when i cock the hammer. There may also be something wrong with the latch on his gun, since it is not that easy to open on mine and others on the forum. Even if his thumb is hitting the latch it still should not open that easily. The latch may need to be adjusted or replaced.

[FrankenMauser]

Just a caveman with a tiny revolver, not respecting what it is.

I see no flaw.

[TruthTellers]

Originally Posted by heyjoe

from watching the video it seems that the reviewer is cocking the hammer with the joint of his thumb instead of the pad of his thumb as most of us would cock a single action. my thumb doesnt come anywhere hear the latch when i cock the hammer. There may also be something wrong with the latch on his gun, since it is not that easy to open on mine and others on the forum. Even if his thumb is hitting the latch it still should not open that easily. The latch may need to be adjusted or replaced.

That is possible and I'm not sure, but that may have been a T&E gun that's been passed around a bit.

I guess it's just something to test out when at the gun store in the future. See how easy it is to unlock the latch while cocking the hammer relatively fast.

[ds-10-speed]

I have the new Ranger II and I never released the latch by accident. If you don't get familiar with your gun after you buy it then you shouldn't own a gun.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by ds-10-speed

I have the new Ranger II and I never released the latch by accident. If you don't get familiar with your gun after you buy it then you shouldn't own a gun.

Two questions...

Where did you get the speedloaders?

And is it the same one for both LR and Magnum?

[ds-10-speed]

There are 3 sizes of mini loaders:

DS-484-SLR for the really small short/LR models
DS-530-LR for larger frame mini with .22 LR
DS-530-MAG for larger frame mini with .22 MAG

NAA loaders

[Armybrat]

Even though I think the Ranger is a cool little gun, I'd rather have the Sidewinder with its solid frame.
What are the possibilities of "frame stretch" on the Ranger, as was mentioned somewhere else?

[ds-10-speed]

If the guys that made the video read the manual and did what it says, they may not have encountered the problem when shooting with live ammo.

It says: "Practice the cocking action with an empty cylinder before firing live ammunition."

I would think that you would discover it then if you are holding the grip or hammer wrong. If I ever opened it by accident I would learn the first time and never do it again, I sounds like these guys couldn't learn from their errors because they kept doing it.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by ds-10-speed

There are 3 sizes of mini loaders:



DS-484-SLR for the really small short/LR models

DS-530-LR for larger frame mini with .22 LR

DS-530-MAG for larger frame mini with .22 MAG



NAA loaders

Thanks... going to pick some up when I get my Ranger II.

[Bill DeShivs]

When somebody is beating your head in, and you are desperately trying to cock the mini revolver it would be very easy to open the gun.

[johnwilliamson062]

I also noticed he was cocking with he inside knuckle, but it looked as though it would be quite awkward for him to cock it with the pad of his thumb on such a small revolver.