Remington 870 Police Variant

[Miles2014]

Thinking of picking one up (new) for ~$400. Would you and does anybody have any experience with this shotgun?

Thanks

[DPI7800]

Yup, tons. What is your question?

[Miles2014]

Thanks, DP

How do you like it? Do you find it better than other shotguns in its class?

[Model12Win]

Good luck getting a new one for $400.

Better off getting a used police trade in 870P. They are built better than the current ones, and are far smoother.

The 870 Police is a great shotgun, at least it once was. The current production ones probably aren't fit to use the name and are in general hugely inferior to older production, with the quality control problems at Remington lately, don't waste your money on a new shotgun when a used police trade in half the price and twice the dang quality.

[T. O'Heir]

The 870 Police is an 870 with a phosphated or blued finish. Same as any other 870. $400 really isn't that great of a price for an 870. MSRP on a Synthetic Express 'Tactical' is $420.

[GeauxTide]

I got a new one a few years ago for 400. Added mag extension and Magpul stock. Mahvelous.

[Virginian]

The current 870 Police guns sold through the law enforcement dealers are as good as they ever were. They have all the same upgrades and a lifetime warranty.

[Dfariswheel]

About 95% of all law enforcement, local, state, and federal use the 870P Police gun.
This isn't because they can buy them cheaper then they could buy a different brand.
To get the absolute reliability of the 870P law enforcement pay extra to get it.

It's the finest pump shotgun design made since 1950.

[jfruser]

The Rem 870P is always a good answer to "What home/defense shotgun should I buy?" May not be the ideal answer for a particular set of circumstances, but never a bad answer.

I can't imagine buying a NEW 870P. So many used ex-LEO guns on the market. Sure, it will be ugly on the outside, but buttery-smooth on the inside after you clean it. Then doll it up with whatever accessories you deem appropriate. I like cheap Choate +2 mag extenders and Picatinny rail segments to screw on to the corncob so I can slap on a Streamlight. If it is a truck gun, also a folding stock.

Heck, I just re-configured my 870P into a fowling piece for my son. A used 28" bbl and a choate adjustable-LOP stock and its it ready to knock down birds. Ugly? Yes. Also effective and he can drag it through the brush and not care if it gets dirty or a scratch. All the reliability and none of the worry.

[Virginian]

Also, beware that everything with an 870P configuration is not an 870P. A lot of Expresses are configured to look just like them. You can change some parts and do some smoothing and end up with almost the same gun except for the outside finish.

[Model12Win]

Originally Posted by T. O'Heir

The 870 Police is an 870 with a phosphated or blued finish. Same as any other 870. $400 really isn't that great of a price for an 870. MSRP on a Synthetic Express 'Tactical' is $420.

That ain't tha only thing, Mista T.

[Screwball]

One big thing between the Police and Express is the lack of magazine dimples on certain. Express guns, without an extension from the factory, have two dimples towards the end of the tube. You want to extend it... need to have them removed one way or another.

A lot of people were annoyed that the TAC-14 was based off the Express for that reason. You have a four shot tube, where as the Shockwave comes with a five round tube. Not hard to remove them (I recommend the XS swage), but something to consider.

In regards to the other differences, they really aren’t that big. Same follower that I swap out of all of my 870s, due to it getting stuck at the opening of the tube when cold on my 11-87 (I go stainless). Metal trigger guard? I’ve yet to hear someone say a polymer guard failed. But when I sent my 870 Police to Robar, they couldn’t plate the trigger guard because they said it was “pot-metal.” So, let’s keep it fair and call it what it is.

While I went with a Police for my original defensive shotgun, I mainly went with it due to the cost ($500, new... setup pretty much how I wanted; 20” with sidesaddle and extension). But go with what is most economical for you. I still have the swage, so that makes an Express without extension a little better value for me if the price of an extension doesn’t push it over a gun with one. I have one more 870 to get for a gun I want to setup with a factory folding stock... so I’m looking for cheap, with an 18” barrel and extension. Whether it is a used Police or a new Express, pretty much will be the same shotgun, in the end.

[Virginian]

Beware that a hard metal magazine follower on 870s, 1100s, and 11-87s may beat out the retaining lip at the receiver. Had that happen with my original '63 model 1100 and the carrier started hanging on the original steel follower. I like the aluminum ones from Brownells.
The original trigger guards are cast aluminum, not pot metal. I actually like the synthetic - space age engineered polymer on an Italian gun, plastic here - ones better except for the molded in loco because the edges don't get silver. I have yet to see one with a problem.
The 870 P gets extra vibrahoning of the internals, the sear spring is stronger, the carrier dog spring is stronger, and the magazine spring is stronger. Everything else is the same.

[Model12Win]

I thought the triggerguard on 870Ps is sintered aluminum?

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by Virginian

Beware that a hard metal magazine follower on 870s, 1100s, and 11-87s may beat out the retaining lip at the receiver. Had that happen with my original '63 model 1100 and the carrier started hanging on the original steel follower. I like the aluminum ones from Brownells.

The original trigger guards are cast aluminum, not pot metal. I actually like the synthetic - space age engineered polymer on an Italian gun, plastic here - ones better except for the molded in loco because the edges don't get silver. I have yet to see one with a problem.

The 870 P gets extra vibrahoning of the internals, the sear spring is stronger, the carrier dog spring is stronger, and the magazine spring is stronger. Everything else is the same.

Thanks for the warning, but have enough rounds through them that I’m not worrying about the spring pressure of a steel follower effecting a lip on a steel receiver. If that was the case, I’d expect to see A LOT more shell deformation with those who leave the tubes loaded. When the follower gets to that end, it is under the least amount of tension with the assembly closed up (only way to reduce it more is to yank the cap/extension).

In regards to the trigger guard, sorry... but if you want to argue it, talk to Robar. That was the reason I was told they did not plate that part on my 870 Police. Your definition of early may be before my shotgun (2004ish production, but I can look it up and get an exact year). Current guns, depends on if you get used, and the department’s trade in regiment on their firearms. Some hold onto them for generations, others a few years. Bottom line, people like to say how it is an improvement... but it is more of a personal preference more than anything. Definitely not worth $100+ in my eyes.

Differences... I read a differences post on AR15.com back from 2004 going over that same discussion. Way before Freedom Group, not to mention parts consolidation that occurs over 10+ years of building a shotgun design. If they are buying two different sear springs, at a certain point, someone is going to say we can save $X by just stocking one that works in both (usually ends up with the cheaper one). Your main question is if those being the differences is still valid. I posted a thread about refinishing my TAC-14, which Remington said is finished in black oxide. Can rub the finish off if you really try hard (comes off someone with regular handling)... which another member mentioned isn’t right for black oxide. I can’t see Remington cutting QC in civilian production to where it is now... yet keeping it up in L/E production. Hope I’m wrong, but holding out for those upgraded springs, I wouldn’t pay that much more to get them.

[Virginian]

The peening of the retaining lip is why Remington went from steel followers to plastic ones. Got to be a fairly common problem on early target guns. My 1100 started showing the issue about 90,000 rounds.
The metal trigger plates have been cast aluminum since 1950. I do not know why they say they cannot plate anything, since auto manufacturers manage to chrome plate pot metal and plastic.
I forgot, all forged parts, no MIM extractor or ejector on the 870P Models.
I am quite happy with my 1976 Wingmaster, but considering how much money some people spend on add ons I don't think the upcharge for an 870P is outrageous. All the different parts are clearly listed in the parts list. I have upgraded several Expresses for people who wanted it and it ran about $100.

[jfruser]

Virginian wrote:
"My 1100 started showing the issue about 90,000 rounds."

Butbutbut...the Rem 1100 is not a high round count shotgun like the [shotgun_of_newer_design].

My Rem 1100 is no where near 90,000, but with the grace of God and a family that has caught fire for wingshooting & upland hunting, I can work mine toward that number in the coming years.

=================

Both my 870 and 1100 have Wilson Combat plastic followers. And two sets of WC springs: OEM capacity and one for +2 mag extenders for wingshooting and social setups, respectively. I like the WC follower as it is easier to see (hi-viz yellow-green) than the stock follower my dad still has in his 1100.

=================

Unless I get the bug for a fancy-schmacy or special Rem 870 (where looks or some special function is paramount), I plan on my future 870s to start off as well-used 870P Wingmasters. And then assemble according to needs/specs. I am blessed in that a local shop keeps almost an entire warehouse of old/used parts for who knows how many guns. To include a whole shelves of used 870 & 1100 barrels. Like a danged candy store where everything is 50% to 75% off.

[Virginian]

My oldest 1100 has a round count somewhere above 115,000. It has done target duty, and a ton of waterfowl duty, a lot of that with a 3" barrel. I have 'retired' it to clay targets when I want to shoot a 12 gauge, which is almost never now. It broke an extractor in September 1982. Everything else, including the Viton O ring I installed in 1967 so i wouldn't lose the original steel 'V' ring, and all the springs, are original. Still runs like a watch.

[Romulus]

I bought a NIB police magnum circa 2000 AD. Ejector popped off after about 50 rounds. It's been fixed, but I thought what if one of the boys in blue had to inaugurate this piece in a firefight? My early '90s express seems more solid (I guess in part due to less finish machining/polishing) then again I hear horror stories about the later Expresses. With Remington there's no sleep for the wicked, but then again I can't bring myself to move on to another make...

[Virginian]

I have seen new out of the box shotguns with no firing pin and numerous other maladies. And all of those cost more than any two 870s.
A brand new Corvette, they could barely get off the truck - engine had NO piston rings.
Anything that is mass produced by man will have a few bad examples.

[Model12Win]

Originally Posted by Romulus

I bought a NIB police magnum circa 2000 AD. Ejector popped off after about 50 rounds. It's been fixed, but I thought what if one of the boys in blue had to inaugurate this piece in a firefight? My early '90s express seems more solid (I guess in part due to less finish machining/polishing) then again I hear horror stories about the later Expresses. With Remington there's no sleep for the wicked, but then again I can't bring myself to move on to another make...

+1

Quite frankly, the new 870 Police guns are trash.

Rough chambers, MIM everything, poorly fitted stocks, receivers so roughly machined on the inside they can draw blood just by looking at them, the list goes on.

It is no secret Remington quality control has plummeted in the past decade, and is currently at an all time low.

Thankfully, as more and more departments are ditching shotguns in favor of the more effective 5.56 tac carbines, the surplus market for police trade in 870Ps is flourishing. These guns are tremendously superior to the current models, the differences are night and day. I wouldn't mind picking up another one.

[Virginian]

Originally Posted by Model12Win

+1

Quite frankly, the new 870 Police guns are trash.

Rough chambers, MIM everything, poorly fitted stocks, receivers so roughly machined on the inside they can draw blood just by looking at them, the list goes on.

It is no secret Remington quality control has plummeted in the past decade, and is currently at an all time low.

Thankfully, as more and more departments are ditching shotguns in favor of the more effective 5.56 tac carbines, the surplus market for police trade in 870Ps is flourishing. These guns are tremendously superior to the current models, the differences are night and day. I wouldn't mind picking up another one.

Model12Win, I think you are full of it. The rough chambers on Expresses issue is years old. I have not seen any systemic issues with 1100s, 11-87s, Wingmasters, or 870P shotguns. The inside rails have always been knife edge sharp - by design. I cut my finger on my first 1100 in 1963 and learned my lesson. I have seen a few isolated issues, all taken care of by Remington.
You are correct about the easy availability of good used police guns.