Browning Buck mark Feed issues

gnowlan01 · November 14, 2020, 09:40 PM

While shooting my 22cal Browning Buck Mark, I started getting stove piping feeds. Case extractor looked worn/beat up. I replaced the extractor with a quality replacement from a popular and reputable online source. Stove piping just about disappeared and now I have a new symptom. At random, after inserting a mag with 5 rounds in it and closing the slide, the 1st round always fires, then randomly, with one of the following rounds, The trigger appears to release the hammer with a noticeably light clicking sound. I then manually cycle the slide back and notice that the slide is now attempting to pick up a new round while a live (unstruck) round is still in the barrel. I have cleaned the gun as if it was New, with the same results. It appears the hammer is not always resetting. I am looking for any advise or fellow shooters who have dealt with this issue.

NoSecondBest · November 15, 2020, 12:25 AM

Did you buy this gun new? Have you attempted to do any trigger work on the gun?

mikejonestkd · November 15, 2020, 09:40 AM

Following this topic too, as my 20 year old camper model has recently started to have a similar issue. The hammer follows the slide down on occasion.

Browning sent me a whole new top end for the gun probably 5 years ago, which was about 30K rounds or so ago.

Gun has been cleaned thoroughly several times, including ultrasonically recently. It still has the same problem- probably 1 in 30 rounds or so fails to reset the hammer.

LeverGunFan · November 15, 2020, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnowlan01

....the slide is now attempting to pick up a new round while a live (unstruck) round is still in the barrel....

I think that this new issue of yours is still an extractor problem. I have a Buck Mark that I purchased earlier this year that had chronic failure to feed and failure to fire symptoms, like yours it would chamber a round but the extractor was not engaged on the rim and the round would not fire. I surmise that the extractor by not being engaged on the rim was holding the bolt back enough to prevent the firing pin from striking the cartridge rim. Replacing the factory extractor with a Volquartsen extractor has essentially eliminated the issue. Volquartsen has discontinued the Buck Mark extractor, but some vendors still have them in stock. Now if your replacement extractor is a Volquartsen, then maybe I'm off base here.

I've read somewhere that the Buck Mark acts as a controlled feed system, when it strips a cartridge from the magazine the rim is captured under the extractor and the cartridge is held in place as the slide closes. If the extractor doesn't engage the cartridge right away, then we have all sorts of feeding issues.

Ruger45LC · November 15, 2020, 05:53 PM

The only time my late '90's Buckmark Camper has failed was when I put an aftermarket barrel on and the feed ramp began to come loose from the barrel, they replaced it and it's been fine but just make sure it's really clean and nothing is coming loose.

Prof Young · November 16, 2020, 12:31 AM

Well, it would be hard to believe . . . but maybe you are the first person ever to wear one out.

Life is good.
Prof Young

NoSecondBest · November 16, 2020, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Well, it would be hard to believe . . . but maybe you are the first person ever to wear one out.

I put over 300,000 rounds through two of them back in the 1990’s through though 2004 and didn’t wear either of them out. I had three of them and used two of them extensively and kept the third for parts which I never needed. I doubt the OP wore his out. I’m still waiting for the answer to the trigger question.

Nathan · November 16, 2020, 08:27 AM

Sounds like the trigger was pulled when gun was out of battery.

Sounds like it was out of battery because extractor not over the rim. New extractor could be sticking or the mag spring might be too light. I would try a different mag or replace the spring after inspecting the new extractor. The new extractor is highly suspect as it is the changed part. That said, it was replaced due to wear pointing at old mag spring too. Hmm

gnowlan01 · November 16, 2020, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoSecondBest

Did you buy this gun new? Have you attempted to do any trigger work on the gun?

I have not modified or changed the trigger. Thank You for the reply.

gnowlan01 · November 16, 2020, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeverGunFan

I think that this new issue of yours is still an extractor problem. I have a Buck Mark that I purchased earlier this year that had chronic failure to feed and failure to fire symptoms, like yours it would chamber a round but the extractor was not engaged on the rim and the round would not fire. I surmise that the extractor by not being engaged on the rim was holding the bolt back enough to prevent the firing pin from striking the cartridge rim. Replacing the factory extractor with a Volquartsen extractor has essentially eliminated the issue. Volquartsen has discontinued the Buck Mark extractor, but some vendors still have them in stock. Now if your replacement extractor is a Volquartsen, then maybe I'm off base here.

I've read somewhere that the Buck Mark acts as a controlled feed system, when it strips a cartridge from the magazine the rim is captured under the extractor and the cartridge is held in place as the slide closes. If the extractor doesn't engage the cartridge right away, then we have all sorts of feeding issues.

From the action I see, the round has a pretty steep climb up the ramp and into the barrel chamber. The extractor does not appear to engage the case until just before the slide is closed. Thank You for your reply.

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan

Sounds like the trigger was pulled when gun was out of battery.

Sounds like it was out of battery because extractor not over the rim. New extractor could be sticking or the mag spring might be too light. I would try a different mag or replace the spring after inspecting the new extractor. The new extractor is highly suspect as it is the changed part. That said, it was replaced due to wear pointing at old mag spring too. Hmm

I did order an OEM extractor just to eliminate my new extractor as a variable as you have mentioned. I am however having the same issue with the 5 mags that I use every week during gallery matches. The gun is relatively new. Gun might have seen Maybe 1000 rounds! Thank You for your reply. OEM extractor expected in two days. I will post if anything changes with the OEM part

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan

Sounds like the trigger was pulled when gun was out of battery.

Sounds like it was out of battery because extractor not over the rim. New extractor could be sticking or the mag spring might be too light. I would try a different mag or replace the spring after inspecting the new extractor. The new extractor is highly suspect as it is the changed part. That said, it was replaced due to wear pointing at old mag spring too. Hmm

I am baffled also. I am having the same issue with 5 different mags that I use every week during gallery matches. The gun is relatively new. Gun might have seen Maybe 1000 rounds! Thank You for your reply. OEM extractor expected in two days. I will post if anything changes with the OEM part

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prof Young

Well, it would be hard to believe . . . but maybe you are the first person ever to wear one out.

Life is good.
Prof Young

Probably not. Maybe 1000 rounds since purchased new.

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 12:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikejonestkd

Following this topic too, as my 20 year old camper model has recently started to have a similar issue. The hammer follows the slide down on occasion.

Browning sent me a whole new top end for the gun probably 5 years ago, which was about 30K rounds or so ago.

Gun has been cleaned thoroughly several times, including ultrasonically recently. It still has the same problem- probably 1 in 30 rounds or so fails to reset the hammer.

You raise a good point. The only thing I have not disassembled is the hammer and its spring ! I should remove, clean, and inspect the hammer and spring. Thank You for your reply. BUT --- I'll wait to see if there's any change after putting an OEM extractor in the slide to verify one variable at a time.

Nathan · November 17, 2020, 06:17 AM

I would shoot it now and see if the extractor is not over the rim when the slide goes forward. You should be able to see why.

rc · November 17, 2020, 12:07 PM

Is the chamber clean? Sounds like your gun isn't seating the rounds all the way and the hammer strike moves the slide and doesn't have the force to set off the primer in that case. I had to chamfer my chamber to not shave lead and to make it smoother feeding and more reliable.

ammo.crafter · November 17, 2020, 01:32 PM

What ammo are you using? I trust it's not subsonic, as most .22 autos do not cycle well with them.

T. O'Heir · November 17, 2020, 02:36 PM

"...round is still in the barrel..." That's an extractor issue. Especially when it happens when you manually cycle the action. There's an extractor spring too.
Buckmarks seems to have an extractor/ejector issue. Lotta posts on a lot of forums about 'em.
Stove piping can be the extractor or ejector. It can also be the ammo with a .22.
"...same issue with the 5 mags..." That eliminates a mag related issue.
When was the last time you gave it a really good bath?
Always start with the cheap and easy stuff and work towards the complex expensive.

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 10:07 PM

CCI Standard is what I use. The Buck Mark typically worked flawlessly with CCI Standard.
Thanks for your reply.

gnowlan01 · November 17, 2020, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan

I would shoot it now and see if the extractor is not over the rim when the slide goes forward. You should be able to see why.

With the normal force of the slide spring,(IE - Releasing the slide forward by depressing the slide takedown release), it appears to always seat completely. If I slowly/manually release the slide forward it does NOT seat completely without a gently push Forward. That push gets the extractor tip beyond the case rim.

gnowlan01 · November 30, 2020, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rc

Is the chamber clean? Sounds like your gun isn't seating the rounds all the way and the hammer strike moves the slide and doesn't have the force to set off the primer in that case. I had to chamfer my chamber to not shave lead and to make it smoother feeding and more reliable.

I carefully looked at the live rounds left in the chamber the next 6 or 7 times this malfunction happened since my last post. The live round appeared well seated. There were no marks in the head of the case. Not even a scratch. I bought & replaced a replacement OEM extractor and cleaned every moving part to the gun. I will go to the range and try it with the OEM extractor and see how it works by eliminating this one variable. Thank You for your reply.

gnowlan01 · December 17, 2020, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnowlan01

I carefully looked at the live rounds left in the chamber the next 6 or 7 times this malfunction happened since my last post. The live round appeared well seated. There were no marks in the head of the case. Not even a scratch. I bought & replaced a replacement OEM extractor and cleaned every moving part to the gun. I will go to the range and try it with the OEM extractor and see how it works by eliminating this one variable. Thank You for your reply.

I fired 40 rounds through the Buck Mark after installing the new OEM extractor & giving the gun a thorough cleaning. Other than 1 CCI Standard dud, all rounds fired flawlessly.
At this point I can only conclude it was a combination of the extractor and a much needed complete take down & cleaning.

gnowlan01 · December 17, 2020, 09:24 PM

Thank You all for your suggestions. Saves a lot of frustration when people share their experiences. Shoot Safely !

LeverGunFan · December 17, 2020, 10:18 PM

Thanks for letting us know that your Buckmark is fixed and now running properly!

FrankenMauser · December 18, 2020, 12:48 PM

Have you dry-fired the pistol much?
It sounds like chamber peening may be causing cases to hang up.
A less likely possibility is the rim relief in the slide face being too small - either because it is just too small, or because the ammo is out of spec and the rims are too large.

I have two Buckmarks with an estimated 210,000+ rounds through them.
The problems you're describing would usually be a filthy gun that needs a proper cleaning.
If there's an additional mechanical problem, it would typically come back to extractor, tight chamber, and/or ejector.

Edit:
That's strange. The last three (new) posts were not visible until I posted my reply. Gonna leave my post anyway.

November 14, 2020, 09:40 PM	#1
gnowlan01 Junior Member Join Date: November 14, 2020 Posts: 12	Browning Buck mark Feed issues While shooting my 22cal Browning Buck Mark, I started getting stove piping feeds. Case extractor looked worn/beat up. I replaced the extractor with a quality replacement from a popular and reputable online source. Stove piping just about disappeared and now I have a new symptom. At random, after inserting a mag with 5 rounds in it and closing the slide, the 1st round always fires, then randomly, with one of the following rounds, The trigger appears to release the hammer with a noticeably light clicking sound. I then manually cycle the slide back and notice that the slide is now attempting to pick up a new round while a live (unstruck) round is still in the barrel. I have cleaned the gun as if it was New, with the same results. It appears the hammer is not always resetting. I am looking for any advise or fellow shooters who have dealt with this issue.

November 15, 2020, 09:40 AM	#3
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,716	Following this topic too, as my 20 year old camper model has recently started to have a similar issue. The hammer follows the slide down on occasion. Browning sent me a whole new top end for the gun probably 5 years ago, which was about 30K rounds or so ago. Gun has been cleaned thoroughly several times, including ultrasonically recently. It still has the same problem- probably 1 in 30 rounds or so fails to reset the hammer. __________________ You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.

November 16, 2020, 12:31 AM	#6
Prof Young Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 2007 Location: Illinois - down state Posts: 2,403	Hard to believe but . . . Well, it would be hard to believe . . . but maybe you are the first person ever to wear one out. Life is good. Prof Young

November 17, 2020, 01:32 PM	#17
ammo.crafter Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2006 Location: The Keystone State Posts: 1,970	FTF/FTE What ammo are you using? I trust it's not subsonic, as most .22 autos do not cycle well with them. __________________ "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading". --Thomas Jefferson

November 17, 2020, 02:36 PM	#18
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...round is still in the barrel..." That's an extractor issue. Especially when it happens when you manually cycle the action. There's an extractor spring too. Buckmarks seems to have an extractor/ejector issue. Lotta posts on a lot of forums about 'em. Stove piping can be the extractor or ejector. It can also be the ammo with a .22. "...same issue with the 5 mags..." That eliminates a mag related issue. When was the last time you gave it a really good bath? Always start with the cheap and easy stuff and work towards the complex expensive. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

November 15, 2020, 12:25 AM	#2
NoSecondBest Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2009 Location: Western New York Posts: 2,736	Did you buy this gun new? Have you attempted to do any trigger work on the gun?

November 15, 2020, 05:53 PM	#5
Ruger45LC Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2005 Location: Kentucky Posts: 768	The only time my late '90's Buckmark Camper has failed was when I put an aftermarket barrel on and the feed ramp began to come loose from the barrel, they replaced it and it's been fine but just make sure it's really clean and nothing is coming loose.

November 16, 2020, 08:27 AM	#8
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,326	Sounds like the trigger was pulled when gun was out of battery. Sounds like it was out of battery because extractor not over the rim. New extractor could be sticking or the mag spring might be too light. I would try a different mag or replace the spring after inspecting the new extractor. The new extractor is highly suspect as it is the changed part. That said, it was replaced due to wear pointing at old mag spring too. Hmm

November 17, 2020, 06:17 AM	#15
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,326	I would shoot it now and see if the extractor is not over the rim when the slide goes forward. You should be able to see why.

November 17, 2020, 12:07 PM	#16
rc Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 2001 Location: CA Posts: 1,763	Is the chamber clean? Sounds like your gun isn't seating the rounds all the way and the hammer strike moves the slide and doesn't have the force to set off the primer in that case. I had to chamfer my chamber to not shave lead and to make it smoother feeding and more reliable.

November 17, 2020, 10:07 PM	#19
gnowlan01 Junior Member Join Date: November 14, 2020 Posts: 12	Buck Mark feed response to "ammo.crafter" CCI Standard is what I use. The Buck Mark typically worked flawlessly with CCI Standard. Thanks for your reply. Last edited by gnowlan01; November 17, 2020 at 10:12 PM. Reason: I wanted to quote reply from ammo.crafter

December 17, 2020, 09:24 PM	#23
gnowlan01 Junior Member Join Date: November 14, 2020 Posts: 12	Thank You all for your suggestions. Saves a lot of frustration when people share their experiences. Shoot Safely !

December 17, 2020, 10:18 PM	#24
LeverGunFan Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2007 Location: Indiana Posts: 407	Thanks for letting us know that your Buckmark is fixed and now running properly! __________________ *Support the Second Amendment Foundation and the Firearms Policy Coalition*

December 18, 2020, 12:48 PM	#25
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,424	Have you dry-fired the pistol much? It sounds like chamber peening may be causing cases to hang up. A less likely possibility is the rim relief in the slide face being too small - either because it is just too small, or because the ammo is out of spec and the rims are too large. I have two Buckmarks with an estimated 210,000+ rounds through them. The problems you're describing would usually be a filthy gun that needs a proper cleaning. If there's an additional mechanical problem, it would typically come back to extractor, tight chamber, and/or ejector. Edit: That's strange. The last three (new) posts were not visible until I posted my reply. Gonna leave my post anyway. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.