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Old January 4, 2018, 05:50 PM   #1
TruthTellers
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Mossberg Shockwave Sig Brace is real

You're welcome.

https://www.sb-tactical.com/product/590-sbm4/
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Old January 4, 2018, 07:00 PM   #2
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Hmmmm.... since the Shockwave isnt a pistol, im not sure how you can but a pistol brace on it.
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Old January 4, 2018, 07:26 PM   #3
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Does an arm brace count towards OAL? If not, then the pistol grip makes the shotgun too short (under 26" OAL) and wouldn't that then require a tax stamp? MY understanding is that the 14" barrel is legal because the OAL of the bird's head makes it 26".
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Old January 4, 2018, 08:14 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharkbite View Post
Hmmmm.... since the Shockwave isnt a pistol, im not sure how you can but a pistol brace on it.
And the ATF doesn't view it as a shotgun either, so you can't call something that's not a shotgun a short barreled shotgun.

It's a firearm that's being transformed into a shoulderable firearm. I know, the horror.
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Old January 4, 2018, 08:26 PM   #5
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With its 14" barrel, if it is a shoulder mounted weapon, doesn't that fall under NFA regs?
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Old January 4, 2018, 09:25 PM   #6
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So very interesting. Very, very tricky legal ground here... I wouldn't buy it, though I'd certainly like to... and that Surefire light on there looks perfect for HD work...
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Old January 4, 2018, 09:30 PM   #7
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Seems like a big waste of money. Why not find some way to convert an 18 inch barreled auto shotgun into a bullpup design.
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Old January 4, 2018, 10:41 PM   #8
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Quote:
And the ATF doesn't view it as a shotgun either
I never said it was.

The whole deal with the “brace” was it was to enable a PISTOL to be held with more stability. The original BATFE letter concerns PISTOLS. This is not a pistol and nowhere does the manufacture say they have a letter of determination for their product.

Id shy away from this until THIS manufacture gets a letter for THIS product.
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Old January 4, 2018, 11:50 PM   #9
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I don't see the issue at all. A "Firearm" can have a pistol brace on it and not make it a pistol. It's still a "Firearm" and you can't make a firearm that over 26 inches OAL a pistol because a pistol is something that's under 26 inches in length.

So, you put a brace on a gun that's not a pistol and the manufacturer isn't recommending it be used as anything else and the ATF has said people not using brace's per manufacturer's recommendations doesn't violate any NFA of 1934 laws.

I'd say we're good to go.
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Old January 5, 2018, 01:00 AM   #10
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The LOP looks quite short and maybe uncomfortable.

I know it's not supposed to be shouldered, or is that okay now?? Such confused.
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Old January 5, 2018, 01:26 AM   #11
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Quote:
It's still a "Firearm" and you can't make a firearm that over 26 inches OAL a pistol because a pistol is something that's under 26 inches in length.
That is incorrect.
There is no OAL limit on handguns.

My "pistol" AR is still a pistol, even with a 24" varmint barrel upper receiver installed. It's 37-1/4" long at that point, but still a "handgun". (As long as I don't install a vertical fore-grip, because, then, it DOES become a Title 1 Firearm and not a handgun, if over 26" OAL... Yea, the regs are stupid; but they are what they are.)


Quote:
So, you put a brace on a gun that's not a pistol and the manufacturer isn't recommending it be used as anything else and the ATF has said people not using brace's per manufacturer's recommendations doesn't violate any NFA of 1934 laws.
That is also incorrect.
The ATF's intentionally vague statement(s) indicated that intentional misuse is not okay, but inadvertent misuse was overlooked.
Splitting hairs? Absolutely.
The ATF loves splitting hairs.
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Old January 10, 2018, 05:54 PM   #12
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I think people are wrapped around the axle as usual with this type of thing. Good find Truth, that setup plus Aguila minishells looks downright useful.
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Old January 10, 2018, 06:40 PM   #13
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For $200, you can have any length barrel on your shotgun. It can have a pistol grip, or a full stock, or anything in between.
But people will spend tons of money on something like this.
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Old January 10, 2018, 06:59 PM   #14
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Well the $200 gets you the SBS stamp. For $550 or less you could have the Shockwave and the brace.
I would like to see some more definitive wordage that it is legal with the brace from the powers that be.
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Old January 10, 2018, 07:14 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by TruthTellers View Post
The ATFE Letter is available on the SB Tactical website referenced in the first post.
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Old January 10, 2018, 07:42 PM   #16
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I have enough fun shooting my 18” Mossberg 500 with it’s 12” lop Hogue stock.
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Old January 11, 2018, 04:46 AM   #17
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Quote:
For $200, you can have any length barrel on your shotgun. It can have a pistol grip, or a full stock, or anything in between.
But people will spend tons of money on something like this.
Looks like it's somewhat cheaper than buying the parts individually, plus you save on the tax stamp and skip the year wait. Some states don't allow SBS's either.

My objection is that it looks unpleasant to shoot, inadvertently shouldered or otherwise.
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Old January 11, 2018, 04:44 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kozak6 View Post
Looks like it's somewhat cheaper than buying the parts individually, plus you save on the tax stamp and skip the year wait. Some states don't allow SBS's either.

My objection is that it looks unpleasant to shoot, inadvertently shouldered or otherwise.
It does look uncomfortable to shoot standard 12 gauge, but my thinking is it would be perfect with Aguila Minishells. 9 shots I think, lower recoil, and better aiming in a smaller, more compact package than a standard 18 inch shotgun.

For inside the home, I can't think of a better tool.
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Old January 17, 2018, 12:48 PM   #19
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There are two of these at the shop and I have got them out and handled them. to me there next to useless as they come from the factory. I did handle one with a sig brace and it seemed quit handy. I keep thinking I want one but wish it was a 20 ga
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Old February 19, 2018, 11:12 PM   #20
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Remington is now offering the Tac-14 with the SB Tactical arm brace, and Midway USA has the braces for both the Tac-14 and the Shockwave.
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Old February 19, 2018, 11:18 PM   #21
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Thanks for the update nightwolf, glad to hear it because otherwise I had only seen Opticsplanet selling them and I won't support them anymore.

I would get the SB4 because it looks beefier and more sturdy. The SBL doesn't look like it would hold up long to the recoil of a 12 gauge
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Old February 20, 2018, 01:01 AM   #22
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The reason I like it is, you get to take that stupid Raptor grip off and use the pistol grip that is part of the brace. That way you won't punch yourself in the face when aiming them.
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Old February 20, 2018, 03:54 PM   #23
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Aim?
People don't buy Shockwaves to aim...
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Old February 20, 2018, 09:48 PM   #24
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Well sorry FM....I like to aim something when I'm shooting.
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Old February 20, 2018, 10:19 PM   #25
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Shotguns (and this first cousin) tend to do better when pointed, not aimed.
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