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Old March 11, 2009, 12:06 PM   #1
awaveritt
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Are Lyman Calipers good?

I've never owned a caliper but now that I'm doing more reloading (223rem as soon as I can find some primers), I bought a Lyman stainless steel caliper for $39.99. Having no experience with calipers, is this a decent one for reloading purposes? I admit I bought it on a whim without shopping around so I'm not really sure if I made a good buy.

It seems to be accurate just checking the diameters of spare bullets I have laying around.

Also, since I'm a newbie to calipers, are there any tricks or pitfalls to avoid when learning to take accurate measurements with calipers?
Thanks
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Old March 11, 2009, 12:16 PM   #2
mkl
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Its a very good one.

I have one and have checked it against my Mitutoyo digital, and it seems to be just as accurate.

The main "trick" to using any caliper is to apply the same amount of pressure for each measurement. Don't squeeze too tight; just enough to get good jaw contact.

When you put it away, leave the jaws open .010" or so.
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Old March 11, 2009, 03:17 PM   #3
dmickey
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I used to work at a machine shop running a lathe. I never heard of leaving a set of calipers open! It seems to me that that would let dust and dirt to get on the measuring surfaces.
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Old March 11, 2009, 03:49 PM   #4
mkl
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Quote:
I never heard of leaving a set of calipers open!
I'm not a die and tool maker, but I had a friend who was and he told me to always do that before you put the calipers in the case that they were shipped in. He made it a point to say to be sure to put them back in the case with an air space between the jaws and close the case after using. The Lyman calipers come in a very nice hard case (or at least mine did).

Don't know the reason; just trusted in his experience.

Perhaps if the jaws are slightly wet ( from hand sweat while measuring), or there is high humidity, it would allow them to dry and keep them from rusting or building up corrosion? He also told me to wipe the jaws before storing, but sometimes I forget that.

Again, that's what a die and tool maker told me and he had been using precision measuring instruments for over 30 years.

Note I said "When you put it away..."

YMMV

Last edited by mkl; March 11, 2009 at 03:54 PM.
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Old March 12, 2009, 09:24 AM   #5
jmundy
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MKL,

I'm not a machinist, nor do I play one on TV, but the only precision measuring instrument I have ever been told not to store with the jaws touching are micrometers. This is to keep from damaging the anvils. I have always been instructed to place a small piece of clean paper between the anvils before storage.

I have both a cheap set of digital calipers and an high dollar set of dial calipers and neither one's case leaves much, if any, room for a gap between the jaws.

If the units are stainless steel, then any moisture or salts from your hands shouldn't be a problem. However, wiping them down is a good idea.
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Old March 12, 2009, 10:46 AM   #6
mkl
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lol

This thread has the potential to turn into one like:

"Should I knock the primers out before I tumble my cases?"

I was just passing on what I had been told many years ago. Perhaps it's an Old Wives Tale.

Can we agree on this:

"Always store your caliper with the jaws either open or shut, but not both."


How 'bout that?
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Old March 12, 2009, 10:54 AM   #7
awaveritt
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Well, thanks for your input guys. I was really just trying to determine if I made a good buy on an inexpensive dial caliper for reloading.

I think I'll store it with the jaws open every other day, how bout that?

Thanks again.
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Old March 12, 2009, 11:07 AM   #8
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OK, I am a machinist and can say without any question, Always use very light oil when lubricating (very light) Always close your caliper when not using. The bottom of the caliper moves outward as the jaws open. If dropped, it can bend and then you have a nice paper weight.
Always store closed in a dry place.Wipe down after use with a slightly oiled cloth.
Before ever using them check to be sure they are set to "0".
If you notice that they feel rough when using, the gear has some dirt in it. Use some compressed air to clean them up and re-oil.
OK, now for how to use.
Never squeeze the bullet or object between the jaws. You want just enough pressure at the contact point to get an accurate reading. Too tight and reading will be low. To slight and the reading will be high.Just enough pressure that you can feel the bullet slip through the jaws. This takes some practice.
I good way to learn this feel is get a 0.010 feeler gauge or bigger and slide it between the jaws and adjust the caliper till it reads the same size as on the feeler gauge. This will give you the feel you need to learn.
Micing / measuring a round object it the hardest surface to learn to mic / measure.
Lyman makes quality equipment.
Good luck and happy loading
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Old March 12, 2009, 01:40 PM   #9
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agreed. store with the jaws closed. if you bend the post at the back of the calipers yer screwed (in my years of measuring high tolerance military lenses i did it, i ended up buyin a new 300 doller mitutoyo). store em with the jaws closed. oiling is a good idea for storing but make sure you whipe the oil off before you use them to measure again (my digital calipers will measure moisture between the jaws).
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Old March 12, 2009, 02:28 PM   #10
mkl
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Okay, I give up!

To: awaveritt -- Please ignore my last paragraph in my first post (post #2).

To: madmo44mag -- There you go again, injecting facts and knowledge into my great post passing on my second hand hearsay and ignorant opinion. You must be a Republican. Hope you don't find my threads on global warming and how the Messiah's bail out plan will save the economy!

To: ddeyo1: Since the thread was relative to the calipers while they are stored in a hard case, how high did you have to drop it from to bend the caliper depth gage when it was extended? Lenses? A military satellite in orbit? That would be a significant drop.

For all: -- Think I'll store my calipers with the jaws closed.

Last edited by mkl; March 12, 2009 at 02:32 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old March 12, 2009, 05:49 PM   #11
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The Lyman 6" stainless steel dial calipers are surprisingly good for Chinese tools.

Fact is, all the reloading brands of dial calipers, Lyman, RCBS, Midway, etc., seem to come from the same Chinese shop. So far as I can tell, they are all identical. Sad thing is, they are also identical to the instruments sold by Harbor Freight, often for as little as $13, dial or digital, when on sale. Seems our reloader brands are sticking it to us pretty hard on the calipers!

I have two precision Jo blocks, .33" and 1.0", to check my five Chinese calipers (three are dial and two are digitals), my one high grade German vernier caliper and my fine old Starrett and B&S mikes. The worst Chink caliper is only off about a quarter of a thousant at 1" and that's about as close as we have a right to expect from calipers of any type! It takes a micrometer to beat that accuracy with any consistancy.

I've never found it to make any difference in storing stainless instruments with the jaws open or closed.

Last edited by wncchester; March 12, 2009 at 05:58 PM.
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Old March 12, 2009, 09:49 PM   #12
Inspector3711
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I'm a Mitutoyo certified calibration tech. You want to store all measuring instruments with the jaws slightly open. There are a couple of reasons for this. First, the surfaces are ground very flat and parallel to each other. Mitutoyo actually taught us that it is possible for molecules to transfer across the tiny gap if stored closed. In effect, the jaws can become welded in that position. Another factor is rust and corrosion. If the jaw is closed it may well trap moisture.

Someone above mentioned storing them with paper between the jaws. A tip from me... If you are going to do that, only use acid free paper.

The tip from the machinest about keeping them closed. I can say that it's okay to do this for short periods of time while working between measurements. The key is, when you put them back in the box at the end of the day they should be left slightly open. Once in the case they'll be safe.

Maybe Mitutoyo has this all wrong, but I figure they know more about calipers than most.
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Last edited by Inspector3711; March 12, 2009 at 09:57 PM.
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Old March 12, 2009, 09:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
how high did you have to drop it from to bend the caliper depth gage when it was extended?
I can state for a fact that falling from a normal height workbench to a concrete garage floor will ruin a 6" Starrett dial caliper.
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Old March 12, 2009, 10:56 PM   #14
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Quote:
I can state for a fact that falling from a normal height workbench to a concrete garage floor will ruin a 6" Starrett dial caliper.
That's an absolute fact. Closed or opened, they become worthless.
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Old March 13, 2009, 07:51 AM   #15
madmo44mag
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Quote:
I'm a Mitutoyo certified calibration tech. You want to store all measuring instruments with the jaws slightly open. There are a couple of reasons for this. First, the surfaces are ground very flat and parallel to each other. Mitutoyo actually taught us that it is possible for molecules to transfer across the tiny gap if stored closed. In effect, the jaws can become welded in that position. Another factor is rust and corrosion. If the jaw is closed it may well trap moisture.
Well I had to see so I checked the literature that came with my Mitu 12in calipers and my Starret 14in calipers and here what was written.
Mitu = "For extended storage wipe with treated cloth and store with caliper slightly open"
Starret = When not in use for extended periods, wipe with silicon treated cloth and store closed"

So I guess it depends on the manufacture how their tools are to be stored.

The main thing here is when working, close them. I have seen thousands of dollars worth for precision measuring tools destroyed from laying them down on a bench and accidentally knocking them off.
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Old March 13, 2009, 09:04 PM   #16
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I have too madmo... Been doing this for a few years too. I've also watched a guy use his new set of Browne and Sharps as a tomohawk on the top of a steel drum. Expensive mistake. Still don't know what he was thinking... Just talking to someone and absent mindedly hammering the points into the drum....
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Old March 14, 2009, 09:25 AM   #17
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For reloading the Lyman caliper is fine, I own the exact same set.
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Old March 14, 2009, 09:50 AM   #18
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mkl
i never said i dropped the calipers and bent the post while they were in a hard case. i maight have been doing something along the lines of umm measuring with them, and dropped them on the concrete shop floor. my point was that if you do bend the post your calipers are probly shot. and if your forcing your calipers into an a hard case while the jaws are open, you may just bend something that isnt supposed to be bent. i thought i did provide some logic in the last post but apperently i am a certified idiot.
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Old March 14, 2009, 10:42 AM   #19
mkl
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ddeyo1: I don't think anyone would disagree that dropping the calipers with the depth gage extended could bend it.

I never argued against closing them each time when you are working with them. If you will look at the last paragraph in my original post (post #2) you will see I said "When you put them away..."

In my mind "put them away" meant when you are finished using them for the day and are going to store them for several days in their hard case. I use my calipers maybe twice a month, so I was trying to give storage advice to the original poster. No one seemed to realize I was giving advice only on long term storage of the instrument, so perhaps I'm the certified idiot for not being clearer.

I was getting beat up for suggesting leaving the jaws open .010" while stored in the case. My attempt at humor was suggesting it would take a pretty good fall to bend the depth gage while the instrument was in its case and the depth gage extended only .010" past the end of the caliper. Sorry it did not come across as intended.
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