Gun Safe in Upstairs Apartment?

KaliGunner · February 12, 2000, 04:00 PM

Well everyone, I've decided I NEED a safe. However, I'm just a bit worried, since I live upstairs in an aparment.
Would having a safe upstairs (besides getting it up there) , be any danger (structurally, etc).

I would move downstairs, but there are no vacant units, and haven't been for years.

Thanks.

**Mal H** · February 12, 2000, 04:07 PM

We can't answer that. You should ask your building super or anyone that might know what the floor loading specs are for your building. If they don't know, you can probably call the city/county building inspector to get their take on it.

Rosco Benson · February 12, 2000, 05:24 PM

People often have the same worry about waterbeds (although water leakage damage is a seperate and valid concern). Gunsafes (and waterbeds for that matter) aren't all that heavy in relation to their "footprint". Frankly, I wouldn't want to live in a building that was structurally weak enough to make either a weight concern.

Rosco

fastforty · February 13, 2000, 03:45 AM

With a waterbed, they say that if the floor is strong enough for a refridgerator, it's ok because of the "spread". I think that a safe is a little different. Mine has a FP of 28"*30", and weighs 500 pounds empty. When I first got it, I figured if three of my fata$$ friends could stand where I wanted to put it, it would be ok. Now, there's 200 pounds of ammo in it, almost as many guns, and a buncha other crap. Looks like it's pushing a half ton, not to mention my own weight when I'm gazing inside of it (ok, drooling). Not so sure anymore, but nobody lives underneath it, either.

45King · February 13, 2000, 10:42 AM

My gunsafe at about 500# is in my shop above my garage. I've never had a concern about it, other than getting it up there (took 3 of us and an appliance dolly-lots of sweat and some blood from scraped knuckles.) Of course, I can see the supports underneath as the garage doesn't have a finshed ceiling.
I'd say that it's not a worry. I'd worry more about getting it up there than whether it's too much weight.
I would guess that most modern apt's might have flooring that would take into account a waterbed's weight, so they could probably handle a safe. That is, however, just a guess. One never knows what runs through the tiny little minds of those who determine what building codes should be.

------------------
Shoot straight regards, Richard at The Shottist's Center http://forums.delphi.com/m/main.asp?sigdir=45acp45lc

DDS · February 13, 2000, 04:15 PM

Zanotti Armor makes a very nice safe that is modular and can be assembled. Check them out.

Dave

fastforty · February 14, 2000, 03:00 AM

45King, mine's over the corner of the basement, very sturdy area. I added some reinforcement before I set the safe just to be sure. All of the hammering I did made the familiar "thump, thump" sounds of banging on wood. Went down there a couple of months ago to check for signs of stress. Hammering there now makes a much higher pitched "ping" sound, but there is no visual signs of stress.

blades67 · February 17, 2000, 12:06 AM

DDS - Where can I get more info about the Zanotti Armor modular safe?

------------------
Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat!

Herodotus · February 18, 2000, 10:24 PM

Whatever safe you get, try to place it along the wall that bears the floor joists, a bearing wall. The floor can take a much larger concentrated load at that point. It will also lower the deflection of the joists and hopefully make the floor less "bouncy". The standards under which this building was built should have envisioned people putting safes in their dwelling, as this is fairly common. The question is always how it really got built. Short of hiring a structural engineer to come out and analyze your building, a horrendous expense, you will never get a satisfactory answer to your question. I would not worry unless I saw a definit bulge somewhere after installing it.

Nyterunner · February 19, 2000, 03:04 AM

I had a walk-in closet that I put a steel door with two deadbolts and inside hinges on. a little work on the doorframe, and I had a very secure area for my equipment and uniforms that didn't stick out. Not quite as good as a real safe, but affordable and reasonably secure.

blades67 · February 19, 2000, 04:12 AM

I thought about doing what Nyterunner did, but anyone can just kick through the sheetrock without bothering the door. I have a security cabinet, but I need a safe.

------------------
Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat!

DDS · February 19, 2000, 08:21 AM

blades67:

I'll try to find the address for you and post it.
Dave

DDS · February 19, 2000, 04:07 PM

blades67:

Here is the website for Zanotti Armor,
www.zanottiarmorsafes.com

Good Luck!

Dave

ohen cepel · February 19, 2000, 08:17 PM

I would suggest getting 2 pieces of 2x4 cut to go under the safe, as long as you can get them to go. Run them perpendicular to the floor joices, this will spread the weight over a couple of more joice. Also, it will let you get to the plugs in the bottom of the safe for you to run power in it if you want to. This will also get it off the floor and prevent rust from forming on the safe bottom.

Buy a big one, they tend to get smaller once you get them home.

TEXAS LAWMAN · February 21, 2000, 06:36 PM

I installed a Zanotti vault about 10 years ago -- have had absolutely no problems with it. The vault is pinned together from the inside with 1/2" hardened steel pins and is bolted to the concrete slab. The access hole for the GoldenRod (dehumidifier) 120v cord is at the rear near the base. The owner took time to answer my questions via phone (even allowed me to specify the combination for the lock) and installation went without a hitch. I'm pleased.

[This message has been edited by TEXAS LAWMAN (edited February 21, 2000).]

LOCHFAL · February 21, 2000, 06:43 PM

I have a friend who had a safe on the main floor of his townhome. He placed it against a wall in a corner and it spanned at least two floor joists. After about a month the floor and the joists under it were bowed. We looked at it from the basement and at the time we decided it was probably going to be allright but just so you know it did distort the woodwork and I doubt if your downstairs neighbors would be too happy about it if they noticed.

Dorcas · February 22, 2000, 01:34 AM

I've been playing with the idea of getting a safe for a few months now. I've considered talking to the apartment manager to find out if it was ok. But then again, I'm not so sure I'm fond of the idea of letting them know about my gun collection.

bkm...

------------------
Anyone worth shooting, is worth shooting twice...

Jeff Thomas · February 22, 2000, 11:38 PM

LOCHFAL, the good news was that downstairs neighbor started feeling taller whenever he looked up ...

February 12, 2000, 04:00 PM	#1
KaliGunner Junior Member Join Date: February 2, 2000 Posts: 14	Well everyone, I've decided I NEED a safe. However, I'm just a bit worried, since I live upstairs in an aparment. Would having a safe upstairs (besides getting it up there) , be any danger (structurally, etc). I would move downstairs, but there are no vacant units, and haven't been for years. Thanks.

February 12, 2000, 04:07 PM	#2
Mal H Staff Join Date: March 20, 1999 Location: Somewhere in the woods of Northern Virginia Posts: 16,949	We can't answer that. You should ask your building super or anyone that might know what the floor loading specs are for your building. If they don't know, you can probably call the city/county building inspector to get their take on it.

February 12, 2000, 05:24 PM	#3
Rosco Benson Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 1998 Posts: 374	People often have the same worry about waterbeds (although water leakage damage is a seperate and valid concern). Gunsafes (and waterbeds for that matter) aren't all that heavy in relation to their "footprint". Frankly, I wouldn't want to live in a building that was structurally weak enough to make either a weight concern. Rosco

February 13, 2000, 03:45 AM	#4
fastforty Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 1999 Location: In a kornfield in kalifornia Posts: 1,161	With a waterbed, they say that if the floor is strong enough for a refridgerator, it's ok because of the "spread". I think that a safe is a little different. Mine has a FP of 28"*30", and weighs 500 pounds empty. When I first got it, I figured if three of my fata$$ friends could stand where I wanted to put it, it would be ok. Now, there's 200 pounds of ammo in it, almost as many guns, and a buncha other crap. Looks like it's pushing a half ton, not to mention my own weight when I'm gazing inside of it (ok, drooling). Not so sure anymore, but nobody lives underneath it, either.

February 13, 2000, 10:42 AM	#5
45King Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 1999 Location: Columbia, SC Posts: 1,033	My gunsafe at about 500# is in my shop above my garage. I've never had a concern about it, other than getting it up there (took 3 of us and an appliance dolly-lots of sweat and some blood from scraped knuckles.) Of course, I can see the supports underneath as the garage doesn't have a finshed ceiling. I'd say that it's not a worry. I'd worry more about getting it up there than whether it's too much weight. I would guess that most modern apt's might have flooring that would take into account a waterbed's weight, so they could probably handle a safe. That is, however, just a guess. One never knows what runs through the tiny little minds of those who determine what building codes should be. ------------------ Shoot straight regards, Richard at The Shottist's Center http://forums.delphi.com/m/main.asp?sigdir=45acp45lc

February 13, 2000, 04:15 PM	#6
DDS Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 1999 Posts: 101	Zanotti Armor makes a very nice safe that is modular and can be assembled. Check them out. Dave

February 14, 2000, 03:00 AM	#7
fastforty Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 1999 Location: In a kornfield in kalifornia Posts: 1,161	45King, mine's over the corner of the basement, very sturdy area. I added some reinforcement before I set the safe just to be sure. All of the hammering I did made the familiar "thump, thump" sounds of banging on wood. Went down there a couple of months ago to check for signs of stress. Hammering there now makes a much higher pitched "ping" sound, but there is no visual signs of stress.

February 17, 2000, 12:06 AM	#8
blades67 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 1999 Location: Chandler, Arizona, USA Posts: 6,014	DDS - Where can I get more info about the Zanotti Armor modular safe? ------------------ Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat!

February 18, 2000, 10:24 PM	#9
Herodotus Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2000 Posts: 743	Whatever safe you get, try to place it along the wall that bears the floor joists, a bearing wall. The floor can take a much larger concentrated load at that point. It will also lower the deflection of the joists and hopefully make the floor less "bouncy". The standards under which this building was built should have envisioned people putting safes in their dwelling, as this is fairly common. The question is always how it really got built. Short of hiring a structural engineer to come out and analyze your building, a horrendous expense, you will never get a satisfactory answer to your question. I would not worry unless I saw a definit bulge somewhere after installing it.

February 19, 2000, 03:04 AM	#10
Nyterunner Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2000 Posts: 134	I had a walk-in closet that I put a steel door with two deadbolts and inside hinges on. a little work on the doorframe, and I had a very secure area for my equipment and uniforms that didn't stick out. Not quite as good as a real safe, but affordable and reasonably secure.

February 19, 2000, 04:12 AM	#11
blades67 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 1999 Location: Chandler, Arizona, USA Posts: 6,014	I thought about doing what Nyterunner did, but anyone can just kick through the sheetrock without bothering the door. I have a security cabinet, but I need a safe. ------------------ Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat!

February 19, 2000, 08:21 AM	#12
DDS Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 1999 Posts: 101	blades67: I'll try to find the address for you and post it. Dave

February 19, 2000, 04:07 PM	#13
DDS Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 1999 Posts: 101	blades67: Here is the website for Zanotti Armor, www.zanottiarmorsafes.com Good Luck! Dave

February 19, 2000, 08:17 PM	#14
ohen cepel Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 1999 Location: Where they send me Posts: 1,013	I would suggest getting 2 pieces of 2x4 cut to go under the safe, as long as you can get them to go. Run them perpendicular to the floor joices, this will spread the weight over a couple of more joice. Also, it will let you get to the plugs in the bottom of the safe for you to run power in it if you want to. This will also get it off the floor and prevent rust from forming on the safe bottom. Buy a big one, they tend to get smaller once you get them home.

February 21, 2000, 06:36 PM	#15
TEXAS LAWMAN Senior Member Join Date: August 27, 1999 Posts: 304	I installed a Zanotti vault about 10 years ago -- have had absolutely no problems with it. The vault is pinned together from the inside with 1/2" hardened steel pins and is bolted to the concrete slab. The access hole for the GoldenRod (dehumidifier) 120v cord is at the rear near the base. The owner took time to answer my questions via phone (even allowed me to specify the combination for the lock) and installation went without a hitch. I'm pleased. [This message has been edited by TEXAS LAWMAN (edited February 21, 2000).]

February 21, 2000, 06:43 PM	#16
LOCHFAL Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Posts: 211	I have a friend who had a safe on the main floor of his townhome. He placed it against a wall in a corner and it spanned at least two floor joists. After about a month the floor and the joists under it were bowed. We looked at it from the basement and at the time we decided it was probably going to be allright but just so you know it did distort the woodwork and I doubt if your downstairs neighbors would be too happy about it if they noticed.

February 22, 2000, 01:34 AM	#17
Dorcas Senior Member Join Date: August 12, 1999 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 194	I've been playing with the idea of getting a safe for a few months now. I've considered talking to the apartment manager to find out if it was ok. But then again, I'm not so sure I'm fond of the idea of letting them know about my gun collection. bkm... ------------------ Anyone worth shooting, is worth shooting twice...

February 22, 2000, 11:38 PM	#18
Jeff Thomas Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 1998 Location: Texas Posts: 4,753	LOCHFAL, the good news was that downstairs neighbor started feeling taller whenever he looked up ...