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Old July 9, 2020, 10:00 AM   #26
7.62 man
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Needing a permit to purchase should be illegal.
The 2nd amendment states "shall not be infringed" & if that is not infringement I don't know what is. Just build 80% guns & do away with the paperwork.
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Old July 9, 2020, 04:14 PM   #27
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gaseousclay---please feel free to correct me on this.

1. In Minnesota to purchase a handgun or a scary looking rifle you have to have a Minnesota "Permit to Purchase" (PTP) card. This means you go down to your local law enforcement agency get a form, fill it out then hand it in and in a couple of weeks you can return to the law enforcement facility and pick up your business card sized paper PTP card. There is no fee in Minnesota to get your PTP card. Since it's a state thing I don't think the 3-day Federal rules apply.

2. Now when you see a hand gun or scary looking rifle you want you show the clerk your PTP card. He allows how it's valid and then you get to fill out the Federal forms (4473) we all know and love and get the NICS background check that we all know and love.

By scary looking rifle I mean "assault weapon" like rifle, even if it is a .22LR. As in a Remington 597 .22 LR in factory pistol grip tacticool dress needs a PTP. The Remington 597 .22 LR with a "normal" rifle stock does not need a PTP.

Silly? We are loooooong past silly.

And on top of this our Minnesota anti-gun group "Protect Minnesota" claims:
Quote:
“I’ve got to tell you folks, we have never had as weak a gun laws in this country as we have today. We’ve NEVER had this weak of gun laws."
(Guess things were pretty strict back before 1968 when you could have a gun shipped to your house and especially strict pre-1934 when if you had the money you could buy a Tommy Gun from your local dealer without any "background checks".)
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Old July 9, 2020, 05:33 PM   #28
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i live in a free state where you dont need a permission slip to exercise your god given and federally protected right to bear arms.

We as gun owners need to stand up for our rights. The others are always happy to protest, rumble and destroy to get the results they want. We need to do the same.
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Old July 9, 2020, 08:18 PM   #29
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. That’s the part that makes no sense.
Most of the gun control laws make no sense. They were written by people who neither understand guns, nor want to. And they are afraid of other people having guns. Fear combined with ignorance makes stupid rules. They actually believe that it will save lives if it takes more time to purchase a gun. My opinion is that if you already have a gun, the next one should not require a background check.
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Old July 10, 2020, 08:27 AM   #30
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@DaleA

You’re correct. The PTP is for handguns and “scary assault rifles” with a pistol grip I believe. My PTP took 10 days to get.
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Old July 10, 2020, 02:45 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by candr44 View Post
The second background check is probably to cover the period between applying for the permit and when you actually receive the pistol.

When I lived in Florida, I filled out the 4473 and payed for my pistol but didn't get a background check until the 3 day waiting period was over. the salesman said they did it that way so the background check would cover your past up to the time I actually received the pistol.

Now I live in Massachusetts and have a lot of prejudice against gun owners to put up with.
Is this a State requirement; or store policy?
The approved 4473 is good for 30 days after the date it's initially signed in Section A. You just need to sign and date the re-certification block in section C (bottom of page 2)
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Old July 10, 2020, 04:31 PM   #32
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It is sad to listen to stories like these. I live in a free state, I still have to fill out the 4473 but the wait/background check never takes more then 10 minutes. I lay my money down and walk out with my gun, scary looking or not.
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Old July 13, 2020, 04:12 PM   #33
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Here in Idaho there is no PTP. And if you have a current concealed carry permit no background check at purchase either. And when a background check is required (no ccw permit) it only takes about 10 minutes while you wait.
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Old July 13, 2020, 08:07 PM   #34
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I did not even have to go through so much red tape for NFA stuff. The local chief of police signed my form for me to get a suppressor while walking out to his car to go to lunch.

I have a LTC handgun so my background check was taken care of. I show that at the gun store, and they do not have to make the NICS call. Last time I purchased a pistol it took 10 minutes from the time I said "I'll take it." to the time I was walking out to my car with it.
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Old July 14, 2020, 05:07 PM   #35
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Virginia does not have a PTP but we do have the requirement of doing a 4473 and an almost identical Virginia background check when you buy a gun. Rural King sells a lot of guns and they happen to be in the same town as a State Police area headquarters. I have seen someone do a background check and the State Police would come and arrest them before they could leave the store. I suspect someone had outstanding warrants or other problems and the background check simply told the State Police where they were. The State Police would call the store and ask them to stall until they got there. I have no problem with it as you get your gun in just a few minutes if there are no issues.
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Old July 14, 2020, 07:39 PM   #36
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Permit to "purchase" and to CCW, are two "separate" processes.

Quote:
Needing a permit to purchase should be illegal.
I think a bunch of replies, is missing the point. Every resident of our country , has to go through a "Federal" background check and at some point, you fill out the 4473 form. That is not going to change an even though I do not believe in Extended background checks I agree with what we have now. ....

However, each state had it's own political agenda to supplement as well as putting foolish restrictions and rules, such as AR types, magazines, FOID cards and so forth. Again, if you purchase from an FFL dealer, a Background check is conducted..

The nice thing about our Iowa law is that you also have the option of obtaining a "Permit-to-Purchase a Handgun". You fill out an application, wait a "max" of three working days, pay a yearly fee of $5.00 and go buy as many handguns as you can afford. Well, almost. For now, with that same permit, I can buy any Semi-auto long-gun as well, during that year.... ...

Now then, If I wish to do a CCW, I go through another background check. Right now, pay a $50.00 fee and meet addition requirement. If you are a US Vet, you show your DD-214 and the permit is yours and good for 5 years. The Permit to "purchase" and to CCW, are two "separate" processes; one is Federal and one is State/County. ....

Be happy and;
Be Safe !!!
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Old July 15, 2020, 12:10 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by osbornk
Virginia does not have a PTP but we do have the requirement of doing a 4473 and an almost identical Virginia background check when you buy a gun.
A 4473 is a form, not a background check. Are you saying that in Virginia you undergo two background checks (one call to NICS, and a second call to the state police), or are you just saying you fill out two pieces of paper?
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Old July 15, 2020, 12:12 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pahoo
Now then, If I wish to do a CCW, I go through another background check. Right now, pay a $50.00 fee and meet addition requirement. If you are a US Vet, you show your DD-214 and the permit is yours and good for 5 years. The Permit to "purchase" and to CCW, are two "separate" processes; one is Federal and one is State/County. ....
Please clarify. There is no federal permit to purchase. I believe that both your annual permit-to-purchase and your carry permit are issued by the state.
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Old July 15, 2020, 01:25 AM   #39
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Big Al, The stupid procedure you indicate is a result of the equally dumb rules the liberal legislature (Washington West Coast) enacted a couple of years ago...
This is not quite correct. Much as I hate to have to defend the Legislature, in this matter, they are NOT to blame. In fact they actually did their jobs, by not passing the laws, several sessions/election cycles in a row.

Failing to get them passed through the Legislature, they were passed as voter initiatives, failing in every county of the state except the 5 counties of the "I-5 Corridor" Where, the sheer number of un and under informed voters were subject to ad campaigns which lied to them, often boldly about how the new law was "needed", etc. Enough people "did what they were told" and they became law. Court challenges are underway...

Quote:
When they can get the computerized system to work properly ( several more years) you will once again be able to present your concealed permit and take possession immediately.
No, sorry, this won't happen. NO more CHP exemptions. The law passed in 2018 (again, voter initiative, passed only on the west side) which went into effect summer 2019 removed all the "extra" benefits from the concealed carry permit. Now, all background checks and waiting periods apply, permit or not. The only thing a concealed carry permit does now, is allow concealed carry.

Note to the OP, I don't see where you say where you are. Including that information when asking about the legal processes helps a great deal, and tends to keep us from running two or more pages of everyone telling you how it works where THEY are.

Sounds like you're dealing with a form where you fill out part and the people who process it fill out part. And the way these things usually work is if you fill out the wrong part its now invalid and you have to start over.

But I have no idea what state you are in, so can't give any specific advice.
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Old July 15, 2020, 10:22 AM   #40
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My State of "Iowa"

Quote:
Please clarify. There is no federal permit to purchase. I believe that both your annual permit-to-purchase and your carry permit are issued by the state.
That is not what I said and obviously misunderstood. Again the permit to purchase is regulated and "issued" by the the county/state. Some states have this and some don't. This allows a resident to purchase a handgun but only in that state. The permit to carry is also issued by the state and additional requirement are in play. As a resident of Iowa, If I have a carry permit, I do not need a permit to "purchase." Again, this reply only relates to working in "this" state. .....

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Old July 15, 2020, 12:22 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pahoo
That is not what I said and obviously misunderstood. Again the permit to purchase is regulated and "issued" by the the county/state. Some states have this and some don't. This allows a resident to purchase a handgun but only in that state. The permit to carry is also issued by the state and additional requirement are in play. As a resident of Iowa, If I have a carry permit, I do not need a permit to "purchase." Again, this reply only relates to working in "this" state. .....
Right. Both the permit to purchase and the carry permit are issued by the state. That's not what you said above:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pahoo
The Permit to "purchase" and to CCW, are two "separate" processes; one is Federal and one is State/County. ....
Thanks for clarifying.
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Old July 15, 2020, 02:52 PM   #42
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Not a problem.

Quote:
Thanks for clarifying.
Not a problem and misspoke What is not clear to me, is the source of the information. I've been told that when they enter your ID on the state's databases, they can tell if if you have a CCW permit and not necessarily a permit to purchase. I strongly suspect that state and Federal databases are all connected. It takes up to 30 days to get a CCW and it takes 3-days to get your purchase permit. ...

Then you have dealers that phones in an ID on a person that wants to Purchase a handgun and that person gets denied and no reason given. Later the dealer may call back and the purchaser , gets approved. .....

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Old July 15, 2020, 07:00 PM   #43
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Quote:
Note to the OP, I don't see where you say where you are. Including that information when asking about the legal processes helps a great deal, and tends to keep us from running two or more pages of everyone telling you how it works where THEY are.

Sounds like you're dealing with a form where you fill out part and the people who process it fill out part. And the way these things usually work is if you fill out the wrong part its now invalid and you have to start over.

But I have no idea what state you are in, so can't give any specific advice.
I specified that I was in Minnesota on page 1. I should’ve included that info in my original post but assumed a P2P was essentially the same regardless of state.

Either way, I got my P2P a little over 2 weeks ago. Took 10 days to receive it in the mail. Ordered a handgun from my LGS soon after but will still have to fill out form 4473 when I pick it up. That’s the part I don’t understand. The Mpls PD do a background check just to approve the P2P and then I do another. But, as someone posted earlier, could be that they do another check to make sure no crimes were committed from the time you get your P2P to the time you leave the store with your gun.
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Old July 17, 2020, 04:19 AM   #44
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Here in Texas if you have a permit to carry concealed the purchase of a hand hun requires you fill out a 4473, pay for the weapon and take it out the door with you.....permit to purchase??? God Almighty!
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Old July 17, 2020, 04:56 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by gaseousclay
I specified that I was in Minnesota on page 1. I should’ve included that info in my original post but assumed a P2P was essentially the same regardless of state.
Actually, a permit to purchase a firearm is a relative rarity among the fifty states. To be honest, I'm surprised that you have been a member here for ten years and you didn't know that. This is another example of why we should never assume that the way things are in our home state is the way things are everywhere.

Remember, Kirk's First Law of the Internet ("If it's the law in Texas, it must be the law everywhere") is supposed to be facetious.
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Old July 17, 2020, 09:07 AM   #46
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Actually, a permit to purchase a firearm is a relative rarity among the fifty states. To be honest, I'm surprised that you have been a member here for ten years and you didn't know that. This is another example of why we should never assume that the way things are in our home state is the way things are everywhere.
I wasn’t in the market for a handgun/AR in the last 10 yrs, which is why I wasn’t aware.
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Old July 17, 2020, 11:02 AM   #47
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A good option for Iowa

Quote:
Actually, a permit to purchase a firearm is a relative rarity among the fifty states.
It certainly is but not aware if it's an option, In other stated. Now, For the exception of Illinois, most Midwest laws are very similar and that is why I questioned the OP. .....

It's my "opinion" that the "option" of having a "Permit to Purchase a Handgun", Is a good thing as it allows citizens to purchase a handgun as well as a long-gun, for home protection. Many choose not to carry and this is a very affordable option; ($5.00 + 3-days). When "Shall-Issue" went into effect, there were many who wet through the process and obtained their CCW. To a certain degree, many have decided, not to renew. ......

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Old July 18, 2020, 05:17 PM   #48
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It's my "opinion" that the "option" of having a "Permit to Purchase a Handgun", Is a good thing...
You're welcome to your opinion, but I don't see where having to go to the govt and buy permission (for any price, even if "only" $5 and 3 days) in order to purchase any firearm is a good, or desirable thing.
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Old July 18, 2020, 06:19 PM   #49
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Here in Idaho if some lame-brain official tried to get a PTP law passed he would be extremely LUCKY to avoid a NOOSE and a public kicking and strangling execution.
And it would be more fun if he wet his pants.
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Old July 18, 2020, 06:33 PM   #50
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If that's your measure; So be it !!

Quote:
You're welcome to your opinion,
You took this statement, out of context and understand some liberals do that. Kindly read the entire reply. It's not just and opinion; it's what we have to work with, good or bad ....

Quote:
but I don't see where having to go to the govt and buy permission.
This is a state requirement as oppose to the Federal government and actually makes it easier for all to obtain a firearm. .....

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